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44rh1n's "The Fellowship of the Ring" Extended Edition Color Restoration (Released) — Page 11

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It was an all day afair but I had time…

https://vimeo.com/495937271

Enjoy the restored music and footage and fixed chronological scene orders which was another bodge up because they kept fiddling about with it hopefully this takes it back to a nearly or close to perfect version all that is needed is Gil Galads death really…Of which is not available but hopefully will be next year.

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44rh1n said:
WOW, you’re right! I just checked my iTunes copy, and it looks REALLY good! It’s still only HD for me (hopefully it upgrades to 4K for me eventually – iTunes usually does!), but it’s definitely the new master. It looks WAY better than the old green extended Blu-ray master!

So I’m curious about something. When you stream the new master from iTunes/Apple TV on an 1080p SDR monitor, what are you actually watching? I get that the 4K would just be downscaled to 1080p, but what about the HDR? Is there some kind of tone mapping being done, or does Apple already have a 1080p SDR version of the new master that automatically streams if they detect you’re using a non-HDR screen?

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Nick66 said:

So I’m curious about something. When you stream the new master from iTunes/Apple TV on an 1080p SDR monitor, what are you actually watching? I get that the 4K would just be downscaled to 1080p, but what about the HDR? Is there some kind of tone mapping being done, or does Apple already have a 1080p SDR version of the new master that automatically streams if they detect you’re using a non-HDR screen?

I’d assume all streaming services have an HDR and SDR version of films, and just give you what your monitor supports. Tone mapping HDR to SDR is very resource intensive and not very accurate, while storage is cheap.

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stwd4nder2 said:

Nick66 said:

So I’m curious about something. When you stream the new master from iTunes/Apple TV on an 1080p SDR monitor, what are you actually watching? I get that the 4K would just be downscaled to 1080p, but what about the HDR? Is there some kind of tone mapping being done, or does Apple already have a 1080p SDR version of the new master that automatically streams if they detect you’re using a non-HDR screen?

I’d assume all streaming services have an HDR and SDR version of films, and just give you what your monitor supports.

That’s what I’d assume also. But the 1080p/SDR version of the new LOTR masters hasn’t officially been released yet (a release is scheduled for this summer), so if Apple does indeed have the SDR versions, we’re getting a preview of what those are going to look like.

stwd4nder2 said:
Tone mapping HDR to SDR is very resource intensive and not very accurate, while storage is cheap.

Perhaps. But my Nvidia Shield does HDR to SDR tone mapping on the fly, as does Plex, and the results are actually pretty impressive.

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Nick66 said:

44rh1n said:
WOW, you’re right! I just checked my iTunes copy, and it looks REALLY good! It’s still only HD for me (hopefully it upgrades to 4K for me eventually – iTunes usually does!), but it’s definitely the new master. It looks WAY better than the old green extended Blu-ray master!

So I’m curious about something. When you stream the new master from iTunes/Apple TV on an 1080p SDR monitor, what are you actually watching? I get that the 4K would just be downscaled to 1080p, but what about the HDR? Is there some kind of tone mapping being done, or does Apple already have a 1080p SDR version of the new master that automatically streams if they detect you’re using a non-HDR screen?

The simple answer is that the 1080p version is an SDR master that’s been derived from the HDR master. It’s not HDR, but it comes from the same source.

The more complex answer is that this was mastered in Dolby Vision. A lot of people don’t quite understand what Dolby Vision actually is, so let me explain: Dolby Vision is when you take an HDR (Rec.2020/ST.2084) graded master, and use Dolby’s trim analysis tools to perform a shot-for-shot tonemapping of the entire film. Every single shot is analyzed and remapped to fit inside of a Rec.709/Gamma 2.4/100-nit SDR container. After the analysis, Dolby has additional custom trim tools that allow the colorist to fine-tune the SDR version of the film. They can tweak the exposure, the saturation, and the balance/tint. This way, they can make SDR version look as good as possible. Then the same analysis/trim pass is repeated a number of times to accommodate the capabilities of different screens. For example, a brand new analysis and trim pass will be performed for 600-nit TVs, 400-nit TVs, etc. This is why Dolby Vision HDR looks so much better on consumer screens than generic HDR, because its tonemapping is done by the colorist himself rather than just using a TV’s automatic tonemapping. Every version of the film, tailored to your specific screen, was done by the colorist.

So when you’re watching the SDR version, you’re not just watching something that’s been automatically tonemapped. You’re watching the Dolby Vision SDR version that the colorist has actually created, using Dolby’s toolkit, and derived from that original HDR master. That’s what Dolby Vision is – a toolset that allows filmmakers to create an HDR master and then interpolate the color grade all the way down to SDR while preserving the original intent of the grade.

And yes, I would imagine that the new 1080p Blu-rays are going to be from that same Dolby Vision SDR trim. So they will likely look the same as the iTunes 1080p versions, but with a much higher bitrate.

Hope that makes sense.

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Thanks much for the detailed explanation! Still think your FOTR looks better. 😃

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Hey! While I’ve been too ill and tired to look through all pages I just wanted to post again and say thank you! It’s really nice to have the extended version in higher resolution with its original colors.

It’s been a long time since I worked with restoring movies but if I have any constructive criticizm it would be - mind that it’s just my opinion - first of all: There is a bit too much grain in the highlights sometimes. Like when Arwen appears in light and speaks to Frodo. Maybe it was necessary to cover the DNR in the theatrical blu-ray shots but yeah, in the highlights it looks a bit too visible and sharp. And don’t get me wrong, I’d take this version over any other, any day!

(Dwalin’s version was fine too though it suffers from the downsides of the messed up contrast and colors of the extended blu-ray like the artifacts in the sky of the wide landscape shots after the Fellowship leaves Rivendell, or Aragorn’s skin being cyan-tinted when looking out the window from the Prancing Pony. Dwalin did a great job matching shots anyway though I’d always make sure the black level is always black which can be extra tough.)

And second: Some of the extended version’s shots are oversharpened already in the source. Example: https://i.imgur.com/K7EIZvE.png
Then the sharp grain on top of that makes it look even more oversharpened! I’d blur such scenes just a tiny bit before applying that grain.

Then I saw a difference in two shots of Galadriel that comes after each other. First one looks great and the second looks like a DVD upscale, has slightly different colors and no grain added on top of it. Not sure what happened there: https://imgur.com/a/nv3x9oS

Hope you’ll make a shot by shot correction based on the upcoming blu-ray release! (if it’s like the old extended blu-ray minus all the color changes they made and the awful green tint)

Again, thank you so much for this version!

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Hey You_Too, it’s good to hear from you. And I think you undervalue your own blanket tint adjustment. While not as good as this, it was still worlds better than the EE Blu-ray, and the best alternative version available for quite some time. Just, you know, Merry’s vest went all orange, that’s all 😉

Project Threepio (Star Wars OOT subtitles)

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Saying that the fellowship of the ring never had a digital grade before is nonsence the limited edition dvd with costa boates documentary had a digital grade for sure.

You will taste lambflesh! or so a kiwi told me…