To me this set is fantastic. It wonderfully straddles that fine line of being ‘Star Warsy’ yet also giving us something we haven’t seen before. Great visuals.
A good chunk of Star Wars appeal to me is the sets and costumes. You don’t have to concentrate on what the main characters are doing or the plot, there is always some piece of set design or prop in the frame that will interest the eye.
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
Wouldn’t Plo koon be able to do that when he got shot down or would the explosion of killed him?
Every situation is different. Leia avoided pretty much all harm except exposure to space.
I just rewatched that part and it looked like he died a pretty horrible death (burning, exploding and smashing into the building)
Ah 77, my favourite year even if i wasn’t alive
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
Wouldn’t Plo koon be able to do that when he got shot down or would the explosion of killed him?
Every situation is different. Leia avoided pretty much all harm except exposure to space.
I just rewatched that part and it looked like he died a pretty horrible death (burning, exploding and smashing into the building)
Yep, I just happened to watch that clip the other day.
The blue elephant in the room.
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
Wouldn’t Plo koon be able to do that when he got shot down or would the explosion of killed him?
Every situation is different. Leia avoided pretty much all harm except exposure to space.
I just rewatched that part and it looked like he died a pretty horrible death (burning, exploding and smashing into the building)
Pfft, what a bad Jedi.
To me this set is fantastic. It wonderfully straddles that fine line of being ‘Star Warsy’ yet also giving us something we haven’t seen before. Great visuals.
A good chunk of Star Wars appeal to me is the sets and costumes. You don’t have to concentrate on what the main characters are doing or the plot, there is always some piece of set design or prop in the frame that will interest the eye.
Bit of Kagemusha, a bit of Flash Gordon. In the middle is Star Wars, so yes perfect.
Hopefully they can push it further in EpIX and have some Throne of Blood moments.
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
Wouldn’t Plo koon be able to do that when he got shot down or would the explosion of killed him?
Every situation is different. Leia avoided pretty much all harm except exposure to space.
I just rewatched that part and it looked like he died a pretty horrible death (burning, exploding and smashing into the building)
Pfft, what a bad Jedi.
Yes. But especially Kolar, Tiin, and Kit Fisto in Palpatine’s office.
“Let’s all bunch up in the doorway so we can’t maneuver well. Use nice long pauses before attempting to block, and pay no attention to whether he telegraphs his mevements.”
Like I said, the PT Jedi were idiots and that’s why they were killed.
chyron just put a big Ric pic in your sig and be done with it.
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
Wouldn’t Plo koon be able to do that when he got shot down or would the explosion of killed him?
Every situation is different. Leia avoided pretty much all harm except exposure to space.
I just rewatched that part and it looked like he died a pretty horrible death (burning, exploding and smashing into the building)
Pfft, what a bad Jedi.
Yes. But especially Kolar, Tiin, and Kit Fisto.
“Let’s all bunch up in the doorway so we can’t maneuver well. Use nice long pauses before attempting to block, and pay no attention to whether he telegraphs his mevements.”
I just laugh at that scene even though it’s not meant be funny, they’re masters!!
Ah 77, my favourite year even if i wasn’t alive
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
Wouldn’t Plo koon be able to do that when he got shot down or would the explosion of killed him?
Every situation is different. Leia avoided pretty much all harm except exposure to space.
I just rewatched that part and it looked like he died a pretty horrible death (burning, exploding and smashing into the building)
Pfft, what a bad Jedi.
Yes. But especially Kolar, Tiin, and Kit Fisto.
“Let’s all bunch up in the doorway so we can’t maneuver well. Use nice long pauses before attempting to block, and pay no attention to whether he telegraphs his mevements.”
I just laugh at that scene even though it’s not meant be funny, their Jedi masters!!
Mevements? whare are those? oh, are the Mevements their Jedi masters?
DrDre said:
Luke was the Yin to his father’s Yang. In the OT his character was set up to have most if not all of his father’s flaws, but unlike his father he was to make the right choices. His destiny was to pass on what he had learned, to surpass his elders, to become a legend.
But Luke says it himself in this film. He isn’t a legend. He is a man. And the legend is not who he is. It is not how I ever pictured him. I guess its one reason I never got into the EU.
We skip to ST continuity, where the Alliance’s victory did not lead to a lasting peace. Han and Leia who were destined to be together, got a monster kid, and they separated. It’s not that later generations squandered the OT’s victory, it’s the very heroes of the OT who let it slip through their fingers. The OT fairy tale did not have a fairy tale ending.
Show me a true revolution in our history that ended with the winners establishing a lasting peaceful replacement. ROTJ ended on a high note because all we saw was a victory celebration (Endor in the OOT and Endor, Tatooine, Bespin, Coruscant, and Naboo in the SE-OT). Even in the EU it was not a clean victory. In ROTJ the Empire was decapitated, but by abolishing the senate and leaving the regional governors in charge, Palpatine ensured that even if he was defeated that the Republic could not be easily restored. The ST is taking that to a more realistic conclusion by giving us the First Order, something that rose from the ashes of the Empire. The Thrawn Trilogy gave us something interesting, but this has more realistic feel to it.
The ST represents the reality check of Star Wars. Legends and fairy tales are not real, and TLJ Luke Skywalker is an exponent of that. The OT Luke Skywalker is an icon, someone we aspire to be. TLJ Luke is like discovering the father you allways looked up to, is an alcoholic. He’s more human, and stripped from his iconic status. Sure, he went to AA meetings and finally sobered up, but you never quite look at him in the same way you used to.
Again, the Luke in ROTJ was really not that lofty. He was the same old Luke but had gained confidence. That is why he became a Jedi. He had overcome his failings. But as like you mention alcholism, a person’s failings often lie just under the surface, awaiting a failure to bring them out again. So to me Luke in TLJ and his journey from the fateful fall of his school to now is a very realistic portrayal of someone who had reach such heights and has had such a huge failure.
The OT is a fairy tale, like Santa Clause, and here’s RJ to tell you Santa Clause does not exist. He’s just some guy in a suit. Christmas is never quite the same to you. Sure, your kids look to this new guy (or girl actually) who’s now wearing the suit, and see Santa Clause, but you know it’s a fake beard, because Star Wars is not a fairytale anymore.
As we have watch Luke’s journey over the three films of the OT, we should all be painfully aware that Luke is a man with failings and that for a time he rose above those failings. That doesn’t mean he can’t fall. Such a huge failure as is described is enough to destroy your average person. Someone with Luke’s known failings in the OT, would do just what we are told he did. Your statements prove that you didn’t see the man Luke was and only saw the hero he became. Anakin was a hero and look at what the fear of losing his wife did to him and then how much further her actual loss ruined him. But his son brought him back.
Also, a big part that people are missing in this discussion on Luke is that he cut himself off from the force. He cut himself off from knowing what was going on. He didn’t know that the First Order had grown so strong. He didn’t know that Snoke had grown so powerful. He didn’t know anything. He didn’t know his best friend had died. Leia knew instantly. Luke had to be told. He completely cut himself off from the force and was just a man living on an island. He had no idea that Leia and the Republic needed him. He may not have even know that Kylo Ren had joined Snoke before he vanished to the island. So saying he would never have gone to the island because Luke would never have left the Galaxy in such a predicament fails to take into account that he has no idea. That was not the situation when he went there. That was not the situation when TFA started and he’s been on that island a lot longer than that.
So, realistic portrayal of toppling a despotic regime, realistic portrayal of a fallen hero, and a realistic portrayal of a character based on actual psychology and the given traits of the character (I checked up on that with some people who know these things), and you have a very realistic setting for the ST to take place in. No, it is not the story you wanted, but it is not flawed in the way you describe it. It is flawed from your view because you see Luke as a legendary hero and that the heroes of the OT should not have failed like they have in the years between the OT and ST. But it is damn hard to forge a new government from the ashes of destroyed government. It is not so easy to pick up the pieces as it is too take over from something that is established. The Rebel Alliance achieved their goal of topping the Empire, but the goal of rebuiding the Republic is not so easy and the scenario they are setting up in the ST is just the type of situation that in the real world leads from despot to revolution to despot to republic. That is what happened in France. That is not what happened in the US because the our revolution was not to overthrow the government (the Contiental Congress and State Congreses), but to split from the British government (the King and Parliament). So when the break happened the existing structure remained in place. When the French and the Russians rebelled against their monoarch, the monarchy fell and was replaced by to a despotic republic. In France it only lasted for a few years before Nepolean took over, followed by the Second and first true Republic. So Empire followed by weak Republic, followed by First Order, leading to a New Republic that will be far stronger and lasting is a very realistic story. The PT is politically the story of Hitler’s rise to power in the 30’s so using real world analogs is very in keeping with GL’s vision.
So I have no problem with you not liking the story and for your personal canon to end with ROTJ (mine may yet depending on IX), but I loved this film and find that it fits perfectly with how I see the OT. It lifts TFA for me by carrying on the characters and proving they are good new characters. I hope Abrams doesn’t change the ending and I hope it goes where I think it is going. Regardless of what RJ says, I think Abrams and Kennedy hashed out an overall story arc that they are following and I think it may be the core of GL’s treatment. Knowing that Luke in exile came from GL gives me hope that though he is not telling this story that he gave them an ending that Abrams can execute. Then it might end well and IX could be great.
In ROTJ, I liked the Ewoks. Even remember playing with that Ewok village toy. But after the prequels came out, I learned that there were a sizable group of OT fans who hated the Ewoks. i.e. just there to sell toys, or were too cuddly or something. I can understand people not liking the Ewoks. I do hate the CGI with blinking eyes in the Blu-Rays though. Also wish the Ewoks battle scenes didn’t have that green screen look to them.
But at least the Ewoks weren’t nothing near like Jar Jar.
But I was wondering. Are there any here who hated the Ewoks, but love the Porgs?
I don’t really like the Porgs, and wished they weren’t in the movie. Or at least not the way they used the Porgs for comic relief.
Love is a strong word, but I’m fine with the Porgs. Unless I missed something, they weren’t in half of the movie’s running time, and they didn’t defeat an entire legion of the Emperor’s finest troops with sticks and rocks.
Chewie will discover the ones that stowed away on the Falcon reproduce at an alarming rate, as Rey discovers in the Jedi Knight School texts Porgs naturally absorb all Dark Side energies. Our heroes concoct a daring plan to drop them into every FO installation. The bad guys die screaming as they’re buried in squawking Porgs.
Where were you in '77?
In ROTJ, I liked the Ewoks. Even remember playing with that Ewok village toy. But after the prequels came out, I learned that there were a sizable group of OT fans who hated the Ewoks. i.e. just there to sell toys, or were too cuddly or something. I can understand people not liking the Ewoks. I do hate the CGI with blinking eyes in the Blu-Rays though. Also wish the Ewoks battle scenes didn’t have that green screen look to them.
But at least the Ewoks weren’t nothing near like Jar Jar.
But I was wondering. Are there any here who hated the Ewoks, but love the Porgs?
I don’t really like the Porgs, and wished they weren’t in the movie. Or at least not the way they used the Porgs for comic relief.
Love is a strong word, but I’m fine with the Porgs. Unless I missed something, they weren’t in half of the movie’s running time, and they didn’t defeat an entire legion of the Emperor’s finest troops with sticks and rocks.
Chewie will discover the ones that stowed away on the Falcon reproduce at an alarming rate, as Rey discovers in the Jedi Knight School texts Porgs naturally absorb all Dark Side energies. Our heroes concoct a daring plan to drop them into every FO installation. The bad guys die screaming as they’re buried in squawking Porgs.
It like when the ewoks defeated the empire except this time porgs will defeat the FO
Ah 77, my favourite year even if i wasn’t alive
PORGMETHEUS
What was in the vials of black goo?
Yep, you guessed it…
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
It was a bit out of place, she probably would of died in the explosion and would of exploded in space but who cares it was a way they could keep her alive.
People don’t explode in a vacuum. That’s a movie cliché that has no basis in reality.
Where were you in '77?
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
It was a bit out of place, she probably would of died in the explosion and would of exploded in space but who cares it was a way they could keep her alive.
People don’t explode in a vacuum. That’s a movie cliché that has no basis in reality.
Actually she would of ballooned twice her size but not explode
Ah 77, my favourite year even if i wasn’t alive
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
It was a bit out of place, she probably would of died in the explosion and would of exploded in space but who cares it was a way they could keep her alive.
People don’t explode in a vacuum. That’s a movie cliché that has no basis in reality.
Actually she would of ballooned twice her size but not explode
https://www.cnet.com/news/what-happens-to-the-unprotected-human-body-in-space/
In ROTJ, I liked the Ewoks. Even remember playing with that Ewok village toy. But after the prequels came out, I learned that there were a sizable group of OT fans who hated the Ewoks. i.e. just there to sell toys, or were too cuddly or something. I can understand people not liking the Ewoks. I do hate the CGI with blinking eyes in the Blu-Rays though. Also wish the Ewoks battle scenes didn’t have that green screen look to them.
But at least the Ewoks weren’t nothing near like Jar Jar.
But I was wondering. Are there any here who hated the Ewoks, but love the Porgs?
I don’t really like the Porgs, and wished they weren’t in the movie. Or at least not the way they used the Porgs for comic relief.
Love is a strong word, but I’m fine with the Porgs. Unless I missed something, they weren’t in half of the movie’s running time, and they didn’t defeat an entire legion of the Emperor’s finest troops with sticks and rocks.
Chewie will discover the ones that stowed away on the Falcon reproduce at an alarming rate, as Rey discovers in the Jedi Knight School texts Porgs naturally absorb all Dark Side energies. Our heroes concoct a daring plan to drop them into every FO installation. The bad guys die screaming as they’re buried in squawking Porgs.
Pop a porg in your mouth when you come to Fishy Joe’s.
What they’re made of is a mystery. Where they come from, no one knows.
You can pick 'em, you can lick 'em, you can chew 'em, you can stick 'em.
If you promise not to sue us, you can shove one up your nose.
chyron just put a big Ric pic in your sig and be done with it.
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
It was a bit out of place, she probably would of died in the explosion and would of exploded in space but who cares it was a way they could keep her alive.
People don’t explode in a vacuum. That’s a movie cliché that has no basis in reality.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q26aM-ZJFO8
tl;dw: It is theorized that the human body can be subject to the vacuum of space for up to 3 minutes before the subject dies. The main sticking point with TLJ is that the skin and organs should swell a lot. Not 1990’s Total Recall levels of swelling, but still a highly significant amount (like 2x normal size). Also there is a high likelihood that the subject would simultaneously pee, poop and vomit due to digestive gases trying to escape.
Once the person returns to a pressurized environment, they are likely to achieve complete recovery depending on how long the experience lasted. This assumes, however, that the subject doesn’t purpose to hold a full breath of air in their lungs, whose pressure difference would likely quickly kill the subject.
chyron just put a big Ric pic in your sig and be done with it.
I’m just starting to read back through this thread, and I totally agree with this:
Mark just knocked it out of the park with this. I sincerely hope he gets an Oscar nomination. It would be a first for a Star Wars film?
I waited 34 years to see Luke back in action, and it was worth the wait.
Some additional thoughts on the movie:
I’ve heard this view that Kylo Ren is using typical abuser tactics to try to lure Rey into his reach. He tells her that nobody else cares about her but him; that her parents were poor nobodies who threw her on Jakku without care for her. The truth actually lies somewhere in between. Yes, Rey’s parents were nobody special, but they were paupers unable to retrieve her after, say, a kidnapping.
This movie really harps on the “true from a certain point of view” Ben says in ROTJ. Both Ren and Rey are right about each other, but only from a certain point of view. Luke’s and Ren’s interpretations of Kylo’s turn were both right from a certain point of view, but it is only at the end that we get the full truth. You can even see the theme again in the point I described above.
People complain about how much TLJ subverted TFA, but they fail to realize that’s the point of a middle movie; a sequel. The best sequels turn the previous movie on its head and leaves it spinning. Let’s use Empire, the rare sequel that’s better than its predecessor, as a case for this theory. Star Wars starts on a desert planet; Empire starts on an ice planet. Luke is ascendent at the end of SW; he’s despondent at the end of Empire. Ben lied about Luke’s parents. ESB’s full of subversion. That’s what makes it a great movie.
I think one of the reasons I really liked this film is that it introduced new ideas and interpretations on a great many things, something I don’t think TFA really did. TLJ’s flat-out creativity and boldness made me love it. It chose not to play it safe. I can’t wait to re-watch it soon. As one person said earlier in the thread, it is truly a film that has balls.
Also, the horse race was totally prequel-esque and completely unnecessary.
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
It was a bit out of place, she probably would of died in the explosion and would of exploded in space but who cares it was a way they could keep her alive.
People don’t explode in a vacuum. That’s a movie cliché that has no basis in reality.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q26aM-ZJFO8
tl;dw: It is theorized that the human body can be subject to the vacuum of space for up to 3 minutes before the subject dies. The sticking point with the film is that the skin and organs should swell a lot. Not 1990’s Total Recall levels of swelling, but still a highly significant amount (like 2x normal size).
AFAIK, it was Outland (1981) that started this human water balloon nonsense. A pity as I like that movie.
Kubrick got it right in 2001
and even gasp Moonraker got it right!
Where were you in '77?
I’m just starting to read back through this thread, and I totally agree with this:
Mark just knocked it out of the park with this. I sincerely hope he gets an Oscar nomination. It would be a first for a Star Wars film?
I waited 34 years to see Luke back in action, and it was worth the wait.
What would it need and what does it have that are Oscar nomination qualities?
• The crait scene had amazing visuals
Ah 77, my favourite year even if i wasn’t alive
I liked the Leia scene and I read it as intended: Leia instinctually acted to save her life with the latent powers we know her to have. Maybe the moment was too contrived or the execution a little funny, but it worked for me.
It was a bit out of place, she probably would of died in the explosion and would of exploded in space but who cares it was a way they could keep her alive.
People don’t explode in a vacuum. That’s a movie cliché that has no basis in reality.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q26aM-ZJFO8
tl;dw: It is theorized that the human body can be subject to the vacuum of space for up to 3 minutes before the subject dies. The sticking point with the film is that the skin and organs should swell a lot. Not 1990’s Total Recall levels of swelling, but still a highly significant amount (like 2x normal size).
AFAIK, it was Outland (1981) that started this human water balloon nonsense. A pity as I like that movie.
Kubrick got it right in 2001
and even gasp Moonraker got it right!
i see they also used redscreen tech. Coincidence?
- Also, the horse race was totally prequel-esque and completely unnecessary.
Yes. Assuming you mean horse chase.
Some additional thoughts on the movie:
I’ve heard this view that Kylo Ren is using typical abuser tactics to try to lure Rey into his reach. He tells her that nobody else cares about her but him; that her parents were poor nobodies who threw her on Jakku without care for her. The truth actually lies somewhere in between. Yes, Rey’s parents were nobody special, but they were paupers unable to retrieve her after, say, a kidnapping.
This movie really harps on the “true from a certain point of view” Ben says in ROTJ. Both Ren and Rey are right about each other, but only from a certain point of view. Luke’s and Ren’s interpretations of Kylo’s turn were both right from a certain point of view, but it is only at the end that we get the full truth. You can even see the theme again in the point I described above.
People complain about how much TLJ subverted TFA, but they fail to realize that’s the point of a middle movie; a sequel. The best sequels turn the previous movie on its head and leaves it spinning. Let’s use Empire, the rare sequel that’s better than its predecessor, as a case for this theory. Star Wars starts on a desert planet; Empire starts on an ice planet. Luke is ascendent at the end of SW; he’s despondent at the end of Empire. Ben lied about Luke’s parents. ESB’s full of subversion. That’s what makes it a great movie.
I think one of the reasons I really liked this film is that it introduced new ideas and interpretations on a great many things, something I don’t think TFA really did. TLJ’s flat-out creativity and boldness made me love it. It chose not to play it safe. I can’t wait to re-watch it soon. As one person said earlier in the thread, it is truly a film that has balls.
Also, the horse race was totally prequel-esque and completely unnecessary.
Turning the herd loose to create confusion and escape the bad guys is a movie western trope as old as the hills. You can’t pin that one on the prequels. 😉
Where were you in '77?
Some additional thoughts on the movie:
I’ve heard this view that Kylo Ren is using typical abuser tactics to try to lure Rey into his reach. He tells her that nobody else cares about her but him; that her parents were poor nobodies who threw her on Jakku without care for her. The truth actually lies somewhere in between. Yes, Rey’s parents were nobody special, but they were paupers unable to retrieve her after, say, a kidnapping.
This movie really harps on the “true from a certain point of view” Ben says in ROTJ. Both Ren and Rey are right about each other, but only from a certain point of view. Luke’s and Ren’s interpretations of Kylo’s turn were both right from a certain point of view, but it is only at the end that we get the full truth. You can even see the theme again in the point I described above.
People complain about how much TLJ subverted TFA, but they fail to realize that’s the point of a middle movie; a sequel. The best sequels turn the previous movie on its head and leaves it spinning. Let’s use Empire, the rare sequel that’s better than its predecessor, as a case for this theory. Star Wars starts on a desert planet; Empire starts on an ice planet. Luke is ascendent at the end of SW; he’s despondent at the end of Empire. Ben lied about Luke’s parents. ESB’s full of subversion. That’s what makes it a great movie.
I think one of the reasons I really liked this film is that it introduced new ideas and interpretations on a great many things, something I don’t think TFA really did. TLJ’s flat-out creativity and boldness made me love it. It chose not to play it safe. I can’t wait to re-watch it soon. As one person said earlier in the thread, it is truly a film that has balls.
Also, the horse race was totally prequel-esque and completely unnecessary.
Turning the herd loose to create confusion and escape the bad guys is a movie western trope as old as the hills. You can’t pin that one on the prequels. 😉
Yeah but riding a poorly rendered CGI herd around a racetrack?