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What is wrong with... Attack of the Clones? - a general discussion thread — Page 15

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It’s more like

“ATTACK OF THE CLONES? THERE AIN’T NOTHING WRONG WITH IT!”

One month later

“JUST KIDDING!”

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Gaffer Tape said:

So if this has already been brought up, I apologize, but I haven’t been here in a while. But the idea that the Jedi were supposed to be celibate in the OT is rather difficult to swallow because, um, well, Luke exists. And, yet, the fact that he is the son of a revered Jedi is never given a second’s thought or mention. Now, if I didn’t know much about, say, my mother, only for someone she knew to reveal to me that she was a nun, I’d probably have a few questions about that. I mean, sure, it’s not IMPOSSIBLE for my mother to have been a nun at some point in her life, but it would still probably turn my head a bit and cause me to ask for some details as to how I came into being.

And then, of course, you have Luke himself, whose main motivation is to become a Jedi, and while that motivation (and some last-minute, ham-fisted writing) ultimately trumps any romantic concerns… he totally has the hots for Princess Leia! And once again, no one ever says, “Hey, you know, Luke. Jedi aren’t supposed to be into that.”

And speaking of last-minute, ham-fisted writing, there is also the annoying idea that Force-sensitivity is hereditary. But if we are to accept that, then requiring Jedi to be celibate is an absolutely ridiculous, self-defeating idea. It’s almost like they WANTED to die out!

So while I don’t necessarily have a problem with an order of monastic, celibate warriors, it’s clear that it was a concept invented to give Anakin something to angst over.

Finally… eh, for what it’s worth, I really don’t mind the line about sand. Not really.

Would you ever consider doing a Star Wars Dissection? Big fan of your DBD, by the way.

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Attack of the Clones was so bad it made Home Alone 3 look like Home Alone 2.

The Person in Question

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Scott109 said:

TV’s Frink said:

We should nuke this entire site from orbit.

I originally started this thread as a tongue-in-cheek post. I never believed that the romance between Anakin and Padme was remotely believable. I just wanted to see your reactions.

People have taken this thread way too seriously. . . .

TV’s Frink said:

I don’t believe you! It’s another trick!

Fixed that for me.

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TV’s Frink said:

I don’t believe you.

Don’t get me wrong: I think Attack ot the Clones is a decent film. But my defense of the dialogue and the romance scenes was tongue-in-cheek.

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HansiG said:

“decent”

de·cent
ˈdēs(ə)nt/
adjective

conforming with generally accepted standards of respectable or moral behavior.
“the good name of such a decent and innocent person”

of an acceptable standard; satisfactory.

The Person in Question

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Not even the goddamn lightsaber duels were satisfactory…

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Lord Haseo said:

Not even the goddamn lightsaber duels were satisfactory…

Only George Lucas could make scenes with Christopher Lee boring.

The Person in Question

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While simultaneously ruining everything that made Yoda great in ESB.

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Gaffer Tape said:
And then, of course, you have Luke himself, whose main motivation is to become a Jedi, and while that motivation (and some last-minute, ham-fisted writing) ultimately trumps any romantic concerns… he totally has the hots for Princess Leia! And once again, no one ever says, “Hey, you know, Luke. Jedi aren’t supposed to be into that.”

And speaking of last-minute, ham-fisted writing, there is also the annoying idea that Force-sensitivity is hereditary. But if we are to accept that, then requiring Jedi to be celibate is an absolutely ridiculous, self-defeating idea. It’s almost like they WANTED to die out!

Yup! It’s pretty damn stupid. And the whole thing was unnecessary since the romance was awful. Just do a normal adventure movie romance between two likable characters.

(Even Phantom Menace didn’t have that rule in place, as the comics written at that time had Jedi with families)

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If Jedi aren’t allowed to get their freak on, you’d think the order would have some sort of artificial insemination program going on. If the Kaminoans can grow clones in jars…

Forum Moderator

Where were you in '77?

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Apparently midichlorians are hereditary given that Qui Gon asked Anakin’s mother who the father was. I doubt George had any intention of having love be illegal for jedi until writing Episode II.

The Person in Question

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moviefreakedmind said:

Apparently midichlorians are hereditary given that Qui Gon asked Anakin’s mother who the father was. I doubt George had any intention of having love be illegal for jedi until writing Episode II.

LUCASFILM: 2000

Rick: Hey Georgie, we’re filming in a few days. How goes the script writing?

George: Oh, well gee golly, I haven’t written it ye-- I MEAN not the final draft since I wrote it back in 1975 with the rest, of course.

RM: Are you okay, daddy?

GL: Fine, honey, I’m fine. Anyway, uh, just go on to the set and I’ll meet you there.

Exit Rick

GL: Okay, um, okay…

GL gets an idea. He removes the swiss cheese from a nearby sandwich and throws it on top of an erotic novel he left open. The words “Sex” and “Illegal” poke through the holes in the cheese.

GL: Haha! I’m a genius.

GL powers up his computer, ready to type his magnum opus.

.

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Gaffer Tape said:

So if this has already been brought up, I apologize, but I haven’t been here in a while. But the idea that the Jedi were supposed to be celibate in the OT is rather difficult to swallow because, um, well, Luke exists. And, yet, the fact that he is the son of a revered Jedi is never given a second’s thought or mention. Now, if I didn’t know much about, say, my mother, only for someone she knew to reveal to me that she was a nun, I’d probably have a few questions about that. I mean, sure, it’s not IMPOSSIBLE for my mother to have been a nun at some point in her life, but it would still probably turn my head a bit and cause me to ask for some details as to how I came into being.

In fairness, the fact that Luke’s father was a Jedi was kept secret.

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DominicCobb said:

In fairness, the fact that Luke’s father was a Jedi was kept secret.

Well, um, no. Ben was quite clear about that, actually.

There is no lingerie in space…

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don’t exist… then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks… and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming… Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.

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Gaffer Tape said:

DominicCobb said:

In fairness, the fact that Luke’s father was a Jedi was kept secret.

Well, um, no. Ben was quite clear about that, actually.

Yeah I mean before Ben told him it was a secret.

JEDIT: Ah I get it you mean his reaction to learning that should have been different. Yeah maybe? But then how much does Luke really know about the Jedi anyway? If he doesn’t know what the force is is he really going to know Jedi rules and regulations?

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Yeah, that’s more what I meant. And, yeah, it is highly possible that that might be the case. But my post was more of a cumulative thing. As in, you’d think at least one of these things would have happened. While it’s likely one or more wouldn’t have happened, it’s hard to believe NONE of them would have. Luke wouldn’t have asked, anybody who knows Luke’s father is a Jedi wouldn’t have asked, nobody who knew Luke was training as Jedi wouldn’t have commented on his behavior, AND neither of the people who actually trained him would have mentioned either of those scenarios.

There is no lingerie in space…

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don’t exist… then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks… and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming… Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.

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 (Edited)

Yeah it was definitely a retcon and a mostly pointless one at that. Just playing devil’s advocate.

I think if they had addressed the absurdity of the rule in-movie as one of the many reasons the Jedi order is somewhat broken and archaic and tied it into Anakin’s disillusionment with the order, I would be fine with it. But, of course, as is there’s no point beyond Lucas trying to make it an epic love story or whatever.

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Gaffer Tape said:

So if this has already been brought up, I apologize, but I haven’t been here in a while. But the idea that the Jedi were supposed to be celibate in the OT is rather difficult to swallow because, um, well, Luke exists. And, yet, the fact that he is the son of a revered Jedi is never given a second’s thought or mention. Now, if I didn’t know much about, say, my mother, only for someone she knew to reveal to me that she was a nun, I’d probably have a few questions about that. I mean, sure, it’s not IMPOSSIBLE for my mother to have been a nun at some point in her life, but it would still probably turn my head a bit and cause me to ask for some details as to how I came into being.

And then, of course, you have Luke himself, whose main motivation is to become a Jedi, and while that motivation (and some last-minute, ham-fisted writing) ultimately trumps any romantic concerns… he totally has the hots for Princess Leia! And once again, no one ever says, “Hey, you know, Luke. Jedi aren’t supposed to be into that.”

And speaking of last-minute, ham-fisted writing, there is also the annoying idea that Force-sensitivity is hereditary. But if we are to accept that, then requiring Jedi to be celibate is an absolutely ridiculous, self-defeating idea. It’s almost like they WANTED to die out!

So while I don’t necessarily have a problem with an order of monastic, celibate warriors, it’s clear that it was a concept invented to give Anakin something to angst over.

Finally… eh, for what it’s worth, I really don’t mind the line about sand. Not really.

I think that it is clear that the Jedi Code died with the Jedi Order during the Great Jedi Purge.

Luke might not have been interested in learning the ways of the Force if Obi-Wan had insisted up front that he remain celibate for the rest of his life…

If force sensitivity is a recessive trait, it would be possible to be force sensitive but not have force sensitive parents and vice versa.

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Why would the Force be a recessive trait? Why would the Force be a genetic trait at all, with or without the meaty-chlorine?

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DominicCobb said:

Yeah it was definitely a retcon and a mostly pointless one at that. Just playing devil’s advocate.

I think if they had addressed the absurdity of the rule in-movie as one of the many reasons the Jedi order is somewhat broken and archaic and tied it into Anakin’s disillusionment with the order, I would be fine with it. But, of course, as is there’s no point beyond Lucas trying to make it an epic love story or whatever.

I thought that it was clear that Anakin’s disillusionment with the Jedi Order was the primary reason for the turn to the dark side after his desire to save Padmé. The Jedi Code forbade attachment to all worldy things, which kept him from his mother, whom he left as a vulnerable young boy, leading to her violent death. The Jedi Code forbade his marriage to Padmé, whom he loved more than life itself. When Anakin learned that the Jedi Council was planning to execute the democratically elected supreme chancellor without a trial and seize direct control of the Republic, Anakin became convinced that the Jedi Order was corrupt. From Anakin’s point of view, Palpatine sought to win the war against the separatists, whereas the Jedi Order only sought to maintain power. Palpatine had told him the dark side could save Padmé, whereas Master Yoda had told him, “Let go of everything you fear to lose.”

The Jedi Code taught Anakin to repress his fear, anger, hatred, and love. Palpatine taught Anakin to give into his repressed emotions, which he desperately desired to hear.

If the Jedi Code never forbade natural emotions such as love and attachment, Anakin would not have been seduced to the dark side.

The Jedi Order had to be at least partially flawed, otherwise Anakin’s turn to the dark side would have been unbelievable.

The “attachment is forbidden” concept was not an excuse for George Lucas to insert poorly written cliché dialogue into the prequels. It was at the heart of the reason why Anakin turned to the dark side.

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Scott109 said:

DominicCobb said:

Yeah it was definitely a retcon and a mostly pointless one at that. Just playing devil’s advocate.

The Jedi Order had to be at least partially flawed, otherwise Anakin’s turn to the dark side would have been unbelievable.

It was unbelievable anyway.

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