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The Force Awakens: Official Review Thread - ** SPOILERS ** — Page 43

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SilverWook said:

And Vader never held a blaster bolt in mid air like that. Ren’s potential is actually frightening.

Unlike many who dislike the film, I had no problem with that. I don’t think of Ren as being more powerful because of it, though. Perhaps different Force users tap into the Force in different ways. We never saw Vader zapping people with lightning, or Palpatine/the Emperor choking people. What cheapened him for me was his lack of proficiency with a lightsaber–against people who had never held one before.

You can be great at swinging a baton around, or shooting a gun, but be totally out of your depth with a sword. Finn and Rey had very little to no training with a sabre, while Ren almost certainly had some, yet he and Rey were equally matched, and even Finn held his own for a little while.

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Alderaan said:

imperialscum said:

Bosk said:

People seem to forget lucas only directed ANH and the shitty prequels.

Still, he was the primary author behind the other two.

“Story by:…” and special effects are what he was good at (and darn good at). He should have stuck to those and let other people write the script, direct, etc.

Yes he is behind some brilliant fantasy/adventure films, Indiana Jones, labyrinth, the dark crystal, dare I say willow. Lucas is a legend whatever people think with regards to the non release of the theatrical version of the OT. He Is star wars whether he sold it or not it will forever be his baby. Hat off to the man regardless to the decline and his epic fuck up that is the prequels. But his forte was being an executive producer and not a director. Fair play to him for letting his teacher direct Empire.

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Alderaan said:

imperialscum said:

Bosk said:

People seem to forget lucas only directed ANH and the shitty prequels.

Still, he was the primary author behind the other two.

“Story by:…” and special effects are what he was good at (and darn good at). He should have stuck to those and let other people write the script, direct, etc.

His main attribute is definitely creating stuff/ideas. I think he is good screenplay writer, it is just that someone has to fix his dialogue.

真実

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His interrogation technique is Force based as well. Something Vader apparently never tried on Leia.

If Snoke is as ancient as I suspect, he may have been teaching some long forgotten knowledge to Ren.

Where were you in '77?

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SilverWook said:

His interrogation technique is Force based as well. Something Vader apparently never tried on Leia.

If Snoke is as ancient as I suspect, he may have been teaching some long forgotten knowledge to Ren.

How to bring folk back from the dead…

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RicOlie_2 said:

SilverWook said:

And Vader never held a blaster bolt in mid air like that. Ren’s potential is actually frightening.

Unlike many who dislike the film, I had no problem with that. I don’t think of Ren as being more powerful because of it, though. Perhaps different Force users tap into the Force in different ways. We never saw Vader zapping people with lightning, or Palpatine/the Emperor choking people. What cheapened him for me was his lack of proficiency with a lightsaber–against people who had never held one before.

and even Finn held his own for a little while.

Watch the movie again dude…Finn got destroyed. I literally just watched the leaked lightsaber fight scene on Facebook. Yes Finn get’s a lucky hit in like Luke got on Vader in ESB but that’s it. The rest of the fight Ren had Finn on the defensive and any offense from Finn was easily dodged and was equally parried/blocked.

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RicOlie_2 said:

SilverWook said:

And Vader never held a blaster bolt in mid air like that. Ren’s potential is actually frightening.

Unlike many who dislike the film, I had no problem with that. I don’t think of Ren as being more powerful because of it, though. Perhaps different Force users tap into the Force in different ways. We never saw Vader zapping people with lightning, or Palpatine/the Emperor choking people. What cheapened him for me was his lack of proficiency with a lightsaber–against people who had never held one before.

You can be great at swinging a baton around, or shooting a gun, but be totally out of your depth with a sword. Finn and Rey had very little to no training with a sabre, while Ren almost certainly had some, yet he and Rey were equally matched, and even Finn held his own for a little while.

The official explanation is Vader can’t do Force lightning with his artificial limbs. The detrimental effects of getting zapped by Palpatine on his life support systems is probably another factor.

Finn probably had some training with the saber resistant staff the “TRAITOR!” yelling trooper pulled on him. He still almost gets killed.

It’s a safe bet Rey had some training when she was very young, but does not consciously remember it, hence her ability to do the mind trick. And we saw toddlers training with sabers in the prequels.

Where were you in '77?

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SilverWook said:

His interrogation technique is Force based as well. Something Vader apparently never tried on Leia.

If Snoke is as ancient as I suspect, he may have been teaching some long forgotten knowledge to Ren.

Kylo Ren’s saber is of ancient design

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SilverWook said:
It’s a safe bet Rey had some training when she was very young, but does not consciously remember it, hence her ability to do the mind trick. And we saw toddlers training with sabers in the prequels.

It’s lazy and uninteresting writing to set up obstacles in front of a protagonist, and then they remember some secret powers whenever they need them to get out of jam.

Arguably a better idea, if Rey were trained when she was younger, would have been to make her not want those powers that she suddenly remembers. She mentally fights against it, and wonders where those forces are coming from, and who taught her … and there’s a real story there.

You actually see that one time in TFA, after the vision. She runs away and says she wants no part.

Unfortunately, that’s the only time she did anything like that. Any other time her forgotten, unnatural powers came to her, she was eager to jump into Wonderland and find out where the road went.

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Alderaan said:

You actually see that one time in TFA, after the vision. She runs away and says she wants no part.

I don’t remember who it was, probably Smoking Lizard, but someone complained about that bit.

You really can’t satisfy everyone.

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adywan said:

Bosk said:

Yes he is behind some brilliant fantasy/adventure films, Indiana Jones, labyrinth, the dark crystal, dare I say willow.

You’re getting Lucas mixed up with Gary Kurtz for Dark Crystal. George wasn’t involved in that film.

He produced it with him as he did numerous films

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Bosk said:

adywan said:

Bosk said:

Yes he is behind some brilliant fantasy/adventure films, Indiana Jones, labyrinth, the dark crystal, dare I say willow.

You’re getting Lucas mixed up with Gary Kurtz for Dark Crystal. George wasn’t involved in that film.

He produced it with him as he did numerous films

No, he didn’t. Kurtz produced it with Henson. George had nothing to do with it. He was busy with ROTJ at the time

ANH:REVISITED
ESB:REVISITED

DONATIONS TOWARDS MATERIALS FOR THE REVISITED SAGA

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adywan said:

Bosk said:

adywan said:

Bosk said:

Yes he is behind some brilliant fantasy/adventure films, Indiana Jones, labyrinth, the dark crystal, dare I say willow.

You’re getting Lucas mixed up with Gary Kurtz for Dark Crystal. George wasn’t involved in that film.

He produced it with him as he did numerous films

No, he didn’t. Kurtz produced it with Henson. George had nothing to do with it. He was busy with ROTJ at the time

Okay… He was one of the main writers, so he did help produce the film.

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Bosk said:

adywan said:

Bosk said:

adywan said:

Bosk said:

Yes he is behind some brilliant fantasy/adventure films, Indiana Jones, labyrinth, the dark crystal, dare I say willow.

You’re getting Lucas mixed up with Gary Kurtz for Dark Crystal. George wasn’t involved in that film.

He produced it with him as he did numerous films

No, he didn’t. Kurtz produced it with Henson. George had nothing to do with it. He was busy with ROTJ at the time

Okay… He was one of the main writers, so he did help produce the film.

I’m not sure if you’re just trolling now. The writers were Jim Henson ( story) and David Odell (screenplay). Again, George had NOTHING to do with Dark Crystal.

ANH:REVISITED
ESB:REVISITED

DONATIONS TOWARDS MATERIALS FOR THE REVISITED SAGA

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adywan said:

Bosk said:

adywan said:

Bosk said:

adywan said:

Bosk said:

Yes he is behind some brilliant fantasy/adventure films, Indiana Jones, labyrinth, the dark crystal, dare I say willow.

You’re getting Lucas mixed up with Gary Kurtz for Dark Crystal. George wasn’t involved in that film.

He produced it with him as he did numerous films

No, he didn’t. Kurtz produced it with Henson. George had nothing to do with it. He was busy with ROTJ at the time

Okay… He was one of the main writers, so he did help produce the film.

I’m not sure if you’re just trolling now. The writers were Jim Henson ( story) and David Odell (screenplay). Again, George had NOTHING to do with Dark Crystal.

I’m not trolling he helped with the screenplay, I’m sure.

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I’m probably the biggest Dark Crystal fan around here, and I can say without hesitation George had no involvement with the script. Henson’s people did help out a bit with Yoda on Empire, as DC was years in pre production, and it was mutually beneficial to both parties. Lucas even tried to replicate Henson’s Creature Shop at ILM for ROTJ, with mixed results.

ILM did the matte paintings for DC, but that’s about it for any Lucas connection.

I welcome you to provide evidence to the contrary.

Where were you in '77?

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Wow! Impressive! I went to see it early afternoon, weekday, second week. There was a line outside the IMAX auditorium.
Overall, quite a ride. It took me by surprise. I was expecting a first act of the trilogy like ANH, and it had nearly as much humor and energy while being much darker and more ominous than the “second act” ESB.
Casting and characterization were Excellent. BB-8 quickly won me over. I thought Gleeson was on mark. If you are doing Hitler at Nuremberg, there’s gotta be some eyes bugging and facial contortions
Loved the greater emphasis on practical sets, locations, and characters. terrific FX. Great score…
Well worth the ticket price.

I always have quibbles with even the best films, and I did feel that this movie had a few considerable flaws.

My quibbles would include the sense that the score was a little too much of a good thing. I'm old school OT. I'm accustomed to more space for the score to build itself up or quiet itself into ambient sounds and to showcase the major themes. I come from the "Great, do something else useful and you might get to live a few more seconds" school of dialogue in a crisis. CGI characters still don't work as well as costumes in SW, imo, and I don't believe they ever will.

What I consider flaws are the entire subplots that seem a bit extraneous, forced, and unSTARWARSy.
The Starkiller Base subplot seems to exist entirely by itself. In ANH, the DeathStar plans were the macguffin, the imp officers and Vader dropped all sorts of expo in conference, it was the most awesome reveal in cinema history, and facing it or being in it or over it was the ultimate objective for all of the characters in the movie. My guess is that they wanted to center the film on other themes and then decided that wasn't enough, so they created the base.
 I have great sympathy for anyone who must rationalize and amortize...FOUR...BILLION...DOLLARS....  I'm sure that if it had grossed 1.5 billion they would have been declared terrible failures. If it made 1 billion it probably would have destroyed their careers. Abrams and his Bad Robot crew are THE WORLD MASTERS of office watercooler buzz. They live and die at the watercooler. Breaking Bad was still a big thing while they were outlining the script. There is a huge appetite among vast swaths of the pop entertainment viewers for material that plumbs the greatest depths of human depravity. They felt a need to poke at some hot buttons and intense themes to generate the "WOW!! OOH MAN!!! You'll never believe what they're doing with STAR WARS!!" sort of chatter. Likewise with the GUESS WHO'S COMING TO DINNER: IINNNNNNNNNNN SSSSSSPPPPPPPPPAAAAAAAAACCCCCCCCE!!! subplot. I'm in AWE of the risks they were willing to take with the franchise, and it appears to have paid-off. They have served Master Rodentium VERY well. They got em into the theater and have them, and me, wondering how they are going to deal with the deep dark hole they have dug and cast themselves into. It came at the cost of my considerable potential for greater enjoyment. Not quite the escapist pop entertainment romp I was hoping for.

 Anyway, It did provide some good laughs, amazing sequences, and a reunion with some childhood friends.

 Impressive. Most Impressive.
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SilverWook said:

I’m probably the biggest Dark Crystal fan around here, and I can say without hesitation George had no involvement with the script. Henson’s people did help out a bit with Yoda on Empire, as DC was years in pre production, and it was mutually beneficial to both parties. Lucas even tried to replicate Henson’s Creature Shop at ILM for ROTJ, with mixed results.

ILM did the matte paintings for DC, but that’s about it for any Lucas connection.

I welcome you to provide evidence to the contrary.

ILM was George lucas’s company and they had direct involvement