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Info Wanted: a Pre-ANH edit of Ep IV? — Page 2

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Yes you can do BRANCHING, however if everyone can do seamless branching howcome MGM can't?
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edit: Removed unnecessary flaming comment

I *am* talking about seamless branching. I didn't say everyone could do it, I said there are tools available to do it on PCs, so the tools are available to everyone. If you can't do it, then you are doing something wrong - we do it a lot and it works - seamlessly. Have you tried to do it? Give it a go and see how you go.

Now some early MGM titles reportedly didn't do it properly, that is correct. (Though all the ones I have work fine).
But hey some commercial titles have crappy layer changes too, some commercial DVDs have crappy telecine and bad colour grading. Does this mean that correct telecine, good colour grading, perfect layer changes can't be done? No.

The Robocop R2 set works perfectly on my gear, as does the T2 edition, not even a stutter at the branches. If your DVD player isn't up to the task I suggest you replace it with one that meets the full spec. It may be a bit short on RAM.

In general if a DVD player pauses on a layer change, then it will definately pause on a branch as well.



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MGM Robocop is not seamless when played on my PC! Let alone DVD players. It's just branching and it isn't seamless and if you think that passes for seamless branching then i suggest you seek a new definition. My question isn't can you do what MGM did - my question is can you do what artisan did with Stargate and then T2:UE? Seamless. That works for me first hand on all players as well as PC's.
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I thought I made it more than abundantly clear that I was talking about truly seamless branching - I don't understand why you are asking the same question again?

But to answer you new(ish) questions - T2 UE only works on players with a decent RAM cache, play it back on (for example ) a DVL700 and it pauses at the branches.

On my linn DVD player, Robocop (Region2) is completely seamless. If you want my definition of seamless, then it is that it branches with no pauses, and is completely imperceptible. I edit video and film for a living, trust me, if there is the tiniest stutter, I notice it.

On some players seamless branching titles pause, on most current ones they don't. MGM apparently didn't implement it well on a lot of their titles. In general MGM don't have much of a track record for quality on DVD so it doesn't surprise me. Perhaps the R4 Robocop doesn't branch properly, I couldn't say as I don't have it.
I'm not sure what your obsession with MGM is? Most of the major studios have had some crpaulent DVD releases (look at Warner's ultra lazy R4 release of Logan's Run, the bloody thing is R4, but still in NTSC!). You need to understand that just because a big bux studio does something in a crappy way, it doesn't mean that you can't do better on a humble PC.

If you need proof of that, just look at the current DVD release of the Star Wars trilogy Any of us here with half a brain can do a better job on fixing the matte lines, the sabres etc. and the colour grading is off in a lot of places.

But to answer your question, yes, the software tools I mentioned do seamless branching. They do it just as well as T2 and stargate, they use the same method (Have a look at the streams if you don't believe me, in fact have a look at the Robocop R2 streams, you will se that they use the same method also).

So just to make sure it is clear. You can do seamless branching on a 'home computer', and you can do it with more ease if you are running a Mac. And it is seamless, as in seamless.

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Will this seamless branched version be available via torrent (in VOB files or similar)? I'd love to get my hands on it when it's done...
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Well then that's okay. I know that a lot of publishers are very lazy with their releases. Artisan's Stargate SE had far too much sharpening, and then for their UE release they release the theatrical and special editions on separate discs. Fox did it well with the Alien movies and ID4. MGM's branching can hardly be called seamless because for most players it pauses. Now I haven't heard of any players having trouble with Artisan's discs, or Fox's that I've mentioned. You could be right though, that some cheap players will pause during general playback - can you clarify if this is the case, or are they seamless on any standard DVD player?

I'm 99% sure that the R4 robocop is exactly the same as the R2. Also in your opinion should 1.66:1 movies be anamorphic? My answer is a solid no. I know that you do get more resolution with the anamorphic, however it crops part of the frame! You are locked into viewing it at 16:9 (1.78:1) if you use the full resolution, and on PC's there's no way to get it to show you the full frame (because the software just assumes that because it's anamorphic the area outside the 16:9 anamorphic is useless, and discards that picture information). Which means if you want to watch it in 1.66:1 - like it is supposed to be presented, you have to set your DVD player to 4x3 output and then it looks awful because it's throwing away every fifth line!

It would be tempting to remaster my anamorphic 1.66:1 DVD's onto non-anamorphic DVD-R's. Which is illegal, but at least then I could sit back and watch them in the correct frame without that jagged look of watching anamorphic titles non-anamorphically.
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And one last thing, when I saw Hero at the theatres, I really enjoyed the movie. But there was one thing about it that kept annoying me - the placement of the subtitles. They were WAY too low. They should have been higher. I find this the case a lot of the time when watching foreign movies that put subtitles in the black boarder. I know they're just trying to preserve the picture, but I wish at least they'd give you a second English subtitle track displayed higher. Because you have to move your eyes right away from the picture to read the subtitles, it's better to have the subtitles over the picture that way your eyes are still on the picture. IMHO. End of today's rant.
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I have one more question/suggestion - will you be using the X0 transfer or your own, or someone else's? I'd say use the X0 transfer. Personally I think it would be awesome if Zion would be willing to make his ANH DVD a seamless-branched version like this, with the ANH crawl as default and the original version an option, but I don't know if he'd be willing to do so.
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Laserman isn't going to make a DVD from this transfer. He's leaving this up to Zion and myself.

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
<span class=“Bold”>JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
<span class=“Bold”>Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.</span>

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Originally posted by: MeBeJedi
Laserman isn't going to make a DVD from this transfer. He's leaving this up to Zion and myself.
I was under the impression he's providing you with the source AVI, and providing a dual layer disc for general distribution?
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I realize that he's not making the discs...that's not what my post said...I was asking what transfer you were using for your pre-ANH project and suggested that you use his...that's all...
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"what transfer you were using for your pre-ANH project and suggested that you use his"

There are two "types" of projects going on (by a couple of people.) The X0 project uses the X0 transfer. There are also the attempts to make a De-SE'ed DVD version, which uses several sources, (DVDs, German TV transfers, Some LD footage, etc.)

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
<span class=“Bold”>JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
<span class=“Bold”>Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.</span>

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Sorry if I'm misunderstanding, but I still don't think you see my point. I'm not talking about those projects, I'm talking about the pre-ANH edits of Star Wars, with the original crawl and soundtrack. I'm wondering what LD transfer is being used for this project/these projects. Sorry if that's what you're saying, I just don't think you're getting what I mean.
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I guess it would depend on who you ask, then. As for me, I intend to make at least one straight transfer from the X0. I also hope to make a Pre-ANH edit from the X0, as well as a de-SE'ed DVD version. I have created a great SW crawl that follows the example from the DVDs, but I don't have anyplace to host it to show others. I was planning on getting some cheap webspace this month, but it'll have to wait for next month. If someone wants to host it (9 Mbs.), let me know.

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
<span class=“Bold”>JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
<span class=“Bold”>Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.</span>

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OK, cool; thanks for clearing that up for me. I'd help you with the webspace if I could, but unfortunately I have no means of doing so (if I had webspace I'd have a lot more than one DVD cover up at Dag's site...). If there's any way I can help with this, I'll gladly do whatever I can. I'm very interested in these projects, and if I had the time and money I'd try one of my own, but alas, I don't. Hell, it took me a month to figure out how to put our most recent school play onto a DVD (much to my fellow cast members' annoyance; I'd hoped to have it done a week after production at the latest); I don't have a lot of knowledge on these subjects, and the capture card I have will only capture at 352 by something-or-other (I'm not at my computer now so I can't check), so needless to say my final product with the play didn't look so hot. I can only imagine how badly a transfer of my own for Star Wars would look...I don't even want to think about it...haha...
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"the capture card I have will only capture at 352 by something-or-other"

What card were you using? My card didn't capture at 640x480 until I found some excellent third-party software. I found it funny that the software that came with the card didn't allow the card to perform at its full potential, so you might want to take a look at the card and get back to me.

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
<span class=“Bold”>JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
<span class=“Bold”>Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.</span>

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Well...see...its not really a capture card, per se...its that shitty Dazzle USB thing I got for Christmas a few years back...so currently my two goals are 1. get a dual-layer DVD burner (I have the money now, just need to place the order), and 2. get a real capture card. Do you have any suggestions for a good/cheap card?
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Oh, I had (have) one of those too. I got the WinGoTv 90 for $40 bucks. After I got the third-party software, it works like a charm. Can't beat the quality for the price.

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
<span class=“Bold”>JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
<span class=“Bold”>Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.</span>

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Time
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I agree, the WinTV GO! is a good BT-8x8-based cap card. (Only used Xawtv on Linux (!) to cap with it)

Moll.

"Right now the coffees are doing their final work." (Airi, Masked Rider Den-o episode 1)