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Info: The Look of Terminator 2 — Page 6

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Beber said:

There has been a Columbia Tristar first DVD release in France for T2, before Studio Canal Ultimate Edition. Do you guys know how it looks? Maybe the same one got released in the UK or somewhere else?

http://pmcdn.priceminister.com/photo/10990.jpg

http://pmcdn.priceminister.com/photo/11979.jpg

 I only did a small check, but I thought the colors are quite like the StudioCanal Colors. Maybe I can take some caps this weekend.

Edit: just checked again with the scene in the facility at the end:

Coloring is as on the US Live DVD release.

"I kill Gandalf." - Igor, Dork Tower

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I don't know the US Live. Is it the same deal as the Studio Canal colorwise?

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Beber said:

I don't know the US Live. Is it the same deal as the Studio Canal colorwise?

 

I did a short check with the german HD-DVD, and I would say it is colorwise same as StudioCanal.

Just uploaded som DVD Caps from the french DVD at my dropbox to check.

(The Program took them at their original "on DVD encoded for anamorphic view" aspect ratio, so they are streched.)

"I kill Gandalf." - Igor, Dork Tower

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Right, thanks. So it's very similar. No point using it as a basis.

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Only thing the French Disc has, I did not found on other releases: The Terminator 2 Teaser in Full Screen.

The Live DVD had it in cropped Widescreen.

"I kill Gandalf." - Igor, Dork Tower

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Here is an exampleof Cameron actual Terminator colors

T2-3D cam from within the theater notice how teal that 1996 film is

https://youtu.be/wM0EZTwE9fM

Vs

T2-3D workprint fanboy remastered: looking blah like any movie T2 should absolutely not look that way.

https://youtu.be/u05TPQoKB2Y

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Maybe the theatrical T2-3D experience is using a newly teal'd DCP these days. :P

2012 HD cam

1996 cam pro-shot via the Making Of doc (Unfinished version? The background is plain.)

The design photos by the animation director indicate that this scene was conceived as blue.

Also these two, 2012 cam vs. actual film transfer:

http://s21.postimg.org/5b1xdy0br/T2_3_D_2012_HD_cam_2.jpg
http://s21.postimg.org/ph5fctvzb/T2_3_D_Making_Of_film_clip.jpg

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Here's a camcording from 2000: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=posgKaC227Y

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Well, the facility scene is way closer to the 35mm print. But not the rest.

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TServo2049 said:

Here's a camcording from 2000: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=posgKaC227Y

There are multiple HD cams from 2012/2013 that all show teal during the T-1,000,000 scene while this old one does not. I was tongue-in-cheek before, but now I'm serious about it being re-timed.

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Having gone to see T2: 3D before the ride closed, I vaguely remember a more teal color palette. That being said, I believe they were still using film to project, making a new retimed DCP unlikely. 

My guess is that the old camcorders don't show the teal due to the limited color fidelity of the SD recording technology of the time. Would definitely trust more modern recordings. Similarly, the bootleg workprints circulating could have been altered during whatever crude transfer was made... 

That being said, there were, at one point, three iterations of this ride around the world. It's possible, though unlikely each has different color timing, and the various cams are records of different rides. 

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MrBrown, can you post some of those shots where the color is so muted that it's practically black and white, as well some of the moments where the color timing changes completely from shot to shot?

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There are a couple Universal Studios Japan camcordings, they look more blue. The Hollywood ones, I can't tell. It may be that the film was retimed and reprinted for Florida only, but that the old prints as projected showed both blue and teal? I dunno. I know it's not DCP because people on theme park boards are saying it's not digital yet (but that they got a new print at some point?)

Based on the existing evidence, I am of the opinion that when Cameron's stuff was originally timed for theatrical projection, it had more teal than we like to assume, but that the trademark blues were still there. It could be that due to limited color space, camcordings of any kind will pull out either the blues or the teals more than the other? I remember the film having that light-blue/teal look, but I'm going off memories from 1997. I can't truly remember the colors.

I'll have to put in links to the other camcordings.

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TylerDurden389 said:

MrBrown, can you post some of those shots where the color is so muted that it's practically black and white, as well some of the moments where the color timing changes completely from shot to shot?

 Do you have any example Scenes? (approx. timecode)

"I kill Gandalf." - Igor, Dork Tower

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Notice the different sound effects for the guns in this special:

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlG79Q45eRY

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TServo2049 said:

...

Also, does anybody have the original Thorn EMI/HBO transfer? I read that had burns too, but I believe it was also overbrightened, as a lot of 80s transfers were.

 i just ebayed one Thorn EMI/HBO LaserDisc of Terminator 1 today. I hope it arrives this month, and I will check it.

"I kill Gandalf." - Igor, Dork Tower

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MrBrown said:

TServo2049 said:

...

Also, does anybody have the original Thorn EMI/HBO transfer? I read that had burns too, but I believe it was also overbrightened, as a lot of 80s transfers were.

 i just ebayed one Thorn EMI/HBO LaserDisc of Terminator 1 today. I hope it arrives this month, and I will check it.

 I just took a short check, but the Thorn EMI/HBO LaserDisc of Terminator 1 is full screen, and I assume it is just pan&scan, because if it is possible to notice the hard matting on the VCL DVD.

Coloring/brighness seemed to be a bit odd on first sight, but I am not sure on that. I have to clean the disc a bit, it was quite messiy watching. Errors like a VHS, hope it just are some fingerprints and dust, and no scrateches. (The discs seem not to be in bad shape, but I hat no time for a real check, yet.

Maybe I have some time next weekend, to plug in and install my USB Video Grabber (hope it works with Win 7), and take some caps from the LD.

I really need to learn how to preserve LDs, now I have 3 different Terminator LDs. (Thorn EMI/HBO Full Screen, Image Widescreen and German VCL FSK18) Hopefully my Pioneer DVL-909 is in well condition enought.

"I kill Gandalf." - Igor, Dork Tower

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Is this the LD with the chase fake stereo mix? It would be awesome to preserve the soundmix.

This dmaster is speeded up too. But I'm sure it's quite easy to sync it back to the current Blu-ray master. Would love if you could rip it :)

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There's a lot of conflicting info out there about the various releases. LDDB doesn't list any of the LDs as being stereo. A note for the 1995 THX release says that the older (1991) widescreen disc had reel change burns (MrBrown, which Image widescreen LD do you have, THX or non-THX?)

Also, there seem to have been two different full-frame transfers too, because the Thorn-EMI-HBO LD doesn't have an Orion logo at the beginning, but the later Image full-screen disc (around 1988-89?) has the Orion logo. The first Image LD was still under license from HBO, their logo was at the start, but the widescreen discs were after the rights had reverted to Hemdale. (I believe both widescreen transfers have the Hemdale logo at the start.)

Also, is the Thorn-EMI transfer the one where the Harlan Ellison acknowledgment was a tiny video-generated text notice buried in the end credits? I've read that Ellison complained that the acknowledgment was not sufficient, and that was when the start of the end credits was fully redone to insert the more prominent Ellison credit.

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There's no listing it as stereo, but if you total running time is 102mn, and it's the full screen then it features the spatialised mono to stereo conversion. I'm sure many will be happy seing it preserved. It's the version where there's not the picture of laserdisc gold disc on the front cover. I think it's the one you have. If you can rip it to usb, that would be insanely awesome, I could retime it to the current disc.

The fake Chase stereo mix LD is that one. Cameron had it redone later on with the correct speed of the film, and with correct mono track without enhancement.

http://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/30336/2535/Terminator-The

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TServo2049 said:

There's a lot of conflicting info out there about the various releases. LDDB doesn't list any of the LDs as being stereo. A note for the 1995 THX release says that the older (1991) widescreen disc had reel change burns (MrBrown, which Image widescreen LD do you have, THX or non-THX?)

Also, there seem to have been two different full-frame transfers too, because the Thorn-EMI-HBO LD doesn't have an Orion logo at the beginning, but the later Image full-screen disc (around 1988-89?) has the Orion logo. The first Image LD was still under license from HBO, their logo was at the start, but the widescreen discs were after the rights had reverted to Hemdale. (I believe both widescreen transfers have the Hemdale logo at the start.)

Also, is the Thorn-EMI transfer the one where the Harlan Ellison acknowledgment was a tiny video-generated text notice buried in the end credits? I've read that Ellison complained that the acknowledgment was not sufficient, and that was when the start of the end credits was fully redone to insert the more prominent Ellison credit.

 My Image LD is non-THX. the THX LD seems to arrive upcoming week. Maybe next one. The non-THX image LD is stated to be m,ono on the backside. It has the Hemdale Logo.

I did not notice any Harlan Ellison acknowledgement in the credits. Maybe they where done on a later Full Screen release? Maybe the above mentioned Image Full Screen release?

Stamper said:

There's no listing it as stereo, but if you total running time is 102mn, and it's the full screen then it features the spatialised mono to stereo conversion. I'm sure many will be happy seing it preserved. It's the version where there's not the picture of laserdisc gold disc on the front cover. I think it's the one you have. If you can rip it to usb, that would be insanely awesome, I could retime it to the current disc.

The fake Chase stereo mix LD is that one. Cameron had it redone later on with the correct speed of the film, and with correct mono track without enhancement.

http://www.lddb.com/laserdisc/30336/2535/Terminator-The

If I have the possibillity to capture the A/V from LAserdiscs, we can check running time. The Backcover states 108 mn. running time.

What logo/picture is not at the frontcover?

What's up with the Image DVD release? Anything nice to know regarding that?

"I kill Gandalf." - Igor, Dork Tower

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I think you should get the full-screen Image disc too (the one with the gold disc background).

Does the LBX Image LD have the cigarette burns, like the LDDB notes for the THX version claim?

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Yes, the back cover have the correct running time, but the actual master is speeded up for some reason. Also they reissued it since the LD was done before the Ellison settlement and Ellison threatened more with lawyers when he saw he wasn't included in it.

So you should notice the film is weird because of the speeded up pace (like it's in Pal or something), and you should notice the same soundmix, but with some weird stereo effects.

The full screen second LD by Image, the one with the gold disc logo on the front, is corrected and should feeature the correct film speed + untouched mono audio.