Warbler said:
dclarkg said:
darth_ender said:
I was also defending Jesus Christ. You see, to me he is not just some guy. He is not even some remote supernatural being. I see him as a very dear friend, someone for whom I have a great deal of love. You may criticize me, my beliefs, my church, its founder, its leaders, its doctrine, its scripture. You may criticize similar things for broader Christianity. But when you actually belittle the Man I love most in this universe, I really cannot take it. It's not just being thin-skinned. Most of you wouldn't take me insulting a family member. This is much like that. You don't have to believe in him, but please do not disrespect him.
Are you aware that the guy is dead right?
You are aware of what we Christians believe happened about 2000 years ago this Sunday, right? We don't believe he is dead.
Yeah, I know what you guys believe but I was pointing out the fact.
darth_ender said:
See, I just don't see how even the most extreme Christian statements like an atheist will burn in a hell he doesn't even believe in could really be that offensive. But mocking someone special to me in as disrespectful language as possible, as Darth Id insisted on doing in particular, is very hurtful. I am always respectful towards atheists' reasons for lacking belief. I believe in the rights of atheists and do not condemn them or criticize them for their lack of belief. But if that respect cannot be reciprocated, I get irritated. If you don't think it would be hurtful to criticize Jesus Christ to a Christian, then clearly you've never loved. If you want to say you don't believe, you still don't have to call him bull****.
Of course hell threats don't insult me at all, I was referring that me as human being find offensive that another human being is willing to condemn to eternal suffering a person who just doesn't agree with his/her believes.
I do understand that Jesus is special for you, I get that, but I think you missed my point here. First let me clarify that for me Jesus as the biblical character didn't existed (the reasons why are matter of another discussion). If ANY Christian/Mormon makes a statement about believing that Jesus was real and that he is still alive somewhere then I'll just share my opinion on that which is: ''all of that is a bunch of bullshit'' and then we can proceed to a debate o whatever comes next. I don't think that me as an atheist should withhold my honest opinions on religion because it could offense those who believe and specially when I don't even believe none of that.
I'm not saying that atheist can deliberately be disrespectful but that is why I said that there is a difference between someone being offensive and you finding something offensive. I would never try to directly disrespect you or any believer by just saying nasty shit about Jesus or you faith in general ''just because'' but I will indeed speak out my mind when it comes to my honest views on Christianity and religion in general. If you say ''Jesus rocks'' and I say ''Jesus is not real and is absurd to believe so'' you may be offended by my opinion but I'm not being offensive at all.
I often do make fun of contradictions in the Christianity and I like to point at the flaws that I see and to be honest I find amusing how angry some believers can get when you ''disrespect'' religion just because you think is not true. I understand that some people is just plain aggressive and disrespectful and I don't agree on that, the true is that to be an asshole you don't have to be of any faith (or lack of it).
I think is important to establish that pretty much any atheist opinion at some point will be taken as a personal offense by believers even if those are articulated in the proper manners, this is understandable since the faith is something that operates at a very deep level in the identity of those who believe. I hope you understand that I will never try to disrespect you but if my opinions on religion offend you then I can't do nothing about it but if I'm being offensive in my ways then please point out my error.