bkev said:

Warbler said:

bkev said:

Jetrell Fo said:

DuracellEnergizer said:

Oh, and IMO, DS9 didn't fuck up Star Trek. If anything, it rectified some of the damage that TNG had done and restored some of the fun to the ST Universe that had been lacking in it since the TOS films had come to an end.

I agree with you 100% on this. DS9 gave Star Trek it's teeth back.

Also agreed. DS9 took a few seasons to find its groove -- if Sisko's not bald, you're probably watching the wrong episode -- but man did it get good. I especially liked the moral ambiguities of the Federation in this series. showing that we're not perfect is always important in Trek, even if it's at the cost of some of the Utopian imagery.

You mean the Utopian imagery that was Roddenberry original premise for Star Trek? That humanity had improved and advanced?

In a sense, yes. The original Trek epitomizes Space Age optimism as presented in pop culture and, I think, as a culture we have become too world wise - or cynical, take your pick - to accept that. An ambiguous storyline is more compelling than B-Movie television. DrCrow's thoughts on Garak point to why I enjoy DS9 as a whole and he said it well enough I don't need to.

In terms of TOS being a utopia, the only real problem I have with that universe is the blatant sexism.

Yeah I love TOS like a child and I didn't pick up on it as a kid but rewatching the episodes now some are hard to get through without feeling a little ill. There are episodes where Kirk pretty much forces himself on woman and yet they fall in love with him because he was just that good at sex???? So rape is okay as long as you are good at it,I guess.

Notice that in the movies they didn't have Kirk do any of that stuff because times had already changed enough for that to not appeal to movie goers in the 1980s.

Give me DS9's shades of gray over the hero committing rape and not a word being said about it any day of the week.