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hd level cgi sucks. they should use models.
Anchorhead said:
That wouldn't be possible now. People go into the theater expecting HD CGI realism. If it isn't Avatar, Matrix, Transformers, or a Marvel-based comic action piece, it doesn't land at the level Star Wars circa 1977 did.
Yet these films doesn't have that something special as Star Wars has. That is why they were popular for a year and then forgotten.
Anchorhead said:T
The time to capture the world with an event comes along seldom. Once it does, you can't get your innocence back. There was only one Apollo Space Program, one The Beatles, one Facebook, and one Summer of Star Wars.
We are in agreement about that. But I assume from what was said so far that I attribute the main reason for the success to these things itself while you claim that the historic context around them was the major factor. It is the opposite, the greatness of these things shaped the history and not the other way around.
Anchorhead said:
You can read all you want about Star Wars 1977, you can imagine you understand it, and you can equate your TV experience decades later to it, but unless you were there, you can't feel or understand the emotional moment the way some of us did.
I have never claimed I understand anyone's emotional feelings... I said I love the film as much as someone else. I did not say I love it in the same manner.
真実
hd level cgi sucks. they should use models.
Reading the basic premise of The Sixth Sense spoiled the ending for me :-D
vacuum said:
hd level cgi sucks. they should use models.
And puppets; and animatronics; and stop-motion; and composites; and matte paintings; and* ...
*Though it may not look like it, this is meant to be a serious post.
Would you inhale?
Not if it's an illegal substance.
I think what is forgotten is the context of the times. I'm not suggesting the folks behind the film timed its release intentionally. What I am suggesting is that society was ready for something new and they didnt even know it; nor were they prepared for it.
Star Wars makes you feel good inside. It's corny sounding but its true. It is, unlike nearly all other film since or before, like a beacon of hope. It came at a time, when people needed it. Art is a reflection of life and if you look at the films of the time, edgy and dark were standards.
I would also add that I'm not asserting that anything today, even another great Star Wars movie, could have the same deep cultural impact. Afterall, part of that feeling of hope comes from the fact the film presented technology that hand't existed. But a good Star Wars film released today could stand apart from all other films; even those of the same genre.
Cinema today is obsessed with darkness. I like the Dark Knight as much as anyone but it is representative of the dark, moody, and edgy style of film inundating theaters. And many of them try too hard to be clever. Plot twists are almost pre-requisite and most are poorly done. There are light hearted movies but they tend to be either character driven or lack any real substance.
Above all, Star Wars was an escape in a time where people wanted to escape. When I first saw Star Wars as a kid, for those couple hours, I was in a completely different world and I was stuck there for about a week after and maybe even longer. Who wanted reality when you could lose yourself in that universe? When was the last time you saw a movie where you could totally lose yourself or your sense of time or reality for a couple hours? Granted I was just a kid and naive but how many adults at the time were absolutely taken by it?
And I dont dismiss the fact that the product itself was outstanding. I judged all other movies as 'other movies'. Star Wars was just a different category.
That's just my opinion. Technology has caught up with our imagination so it would be difficult for any movie to do what Star Wars did. Maybe I'm just hoping that the current cinematic landscape of cookie cutter films is ripe for the taking. Maybe it wont even be a Star Wars movie that impacts our collective conscience next.
The Original Star Wars Trilogy is one of the few movies that are fun to watch yet still have substance along with a combination of drama, humor and mythology along with special effects.
That's pretty hard to pull off because usually one of them dominates the others in today's blockbusters. As luckydube56 said about the Dark Knight, its a great movie, but it just doesn't hold the replay simply because it isnt fun to watch. Then you have movies like Transformers, which rely heavily on CGI and action, and have no replay value because they lack any character development or substance. Then you have the endless parade of Comic Book movies, that lack the drama or humor, or sometimes the substance that leads to replay value.
Star Wars has all of those things in it, and that is why I never tire of those original 3 movies. Maybe its just because CGI is too easy these days, and directors don't have to worry about the other stuff to get teenagers to plop down money for a movie, or maybe just Hollywood is out of ideas, but I rarely go to summer movies anymore simply because they lack many things that made Star Wars great.
This proposal of Star Wars being released later on not doing as well is paradoxical. Lets say hypothetically the release of Star Wars was delayed into the 90s, the movie exactly the same as it was in 1977 original release. Same audio mixes everything the same. The hypothetical culture of the 90s sans Star Wars would be different than the culture with Star Wars. Who knows maybe the hollywood landscape would've been much the same in the 90s had Star Wars not made it's initial impact in the 70s. Thus allowing for the same sort of influence only later. Afterall it was the success of Star Wars that made them think about bringing Star Trek back from cancellation(edit or more appropriately in movie form) in the first place. That's just one thing that wouldn't have happened had Star Wars not been released in the time it was.
I would argue it's impact would've been even bigger had it's release been delayed since it seems the execs, and theaters, were straying away from even allowing sci-fi properties a chance. Star Wars was block booked with The Other Side of Midnight to get into many theaters in the first place. Star Trek was cancelled. Maybe if it was delayed into the 90s there'd be so little sci-fi entertainment that Star Wars would've become, almost literally, the only show in town. That sort of impact would've been so much bigger than it's 70's impact. Being the literal only form of "new" sci-fi entertainment after only reruns of old Star Trek or Twilight Zone on the tv.
Course it could've gone another way and some other sci-fi movie could've made it big around the same time. Making a delayed 90s Star Wars release disappear in the haze of that 90s sci-fi market.
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twister111 said:
This proposal of Star Wars being released later on not doing as well is paradoxical. Lets say hypothetically the release of Star Wars was delayed into the 90s, the movie exactly the same as it was in 1977 original release. Same audio mixes everything the same. The hypothetical culture of the 90s sans Star Wars would be different than the culture with Star Wars. Who knows maybe the hollywood landscape would've been much the same in the 90s had Star Wars not made it's initial impact in the 70s. Thus allowing for the same sort of influence only later. Afterall it was the success of Star Wars that made them think about bringing Star Trek back from cancellation(edit or more appropriately in movie form) in the first place. That's just one thing that wouldn't have happened had Star Wars not been released in the time it was.
I would argue it's impact would've been even bigger had it's release been delayed since it seems the execs, and theaters, were straying away from even allowing sci-fi properties a chance. Star Wars was block booked with The Other Side of Midnight to get into many theaters in the first place. Star Trek was cancelled. Maybe if it was delayed into the 90s there'd be so little sci-fi entertainment that Star Wars would've become, almost literally, the only show in town. That sort of impact would've been so much bigger than it's 70's impact. Being the literal only form of "new" sci-fi entertainment after only reruns of old Star Trek or Twilight Zone on the tv.
Course it could've gone another way and some other sci-fi movie could've made it big around the same time. Making a delayed 90s Star Wars release disappear in the haze of that 90s sci-fi market.
I like what you're saying but I find it implausible that Star Wars could have been released in the 90s and have the same affect. Star Wars was a part of technological history and a milestone but it was built upon ideas that were just budding in the 70s. So your paradox would only be true if today's society was unchanged from the 70s...and that is the sticking point for me. No way society and technology doesnt advance.
It could not have been released in the 90s or 00s and had the same affect. Technology of today would actually dim the fantastic world of Star Wars. We're walking around with iphones and tablets and we're going to be presented with a movie that doesnt really blow our minds. So Star Wars released today would be a completely different film and then who knows what you got or how good it is. Maybe what we would have ended up with was something very much like....the Phantom Menace.
The movie was unquestionably a byproduct of/reaction to its time.
luckydube56 said:
It could not have been released in the 90s or 00s and had the same affect. Technology of today would actually dim the fantastic world of Star Wars. We're walking around with iphones and tablets and we're going to be presented with a movie that doesnt really blow our minds. So Star Wars released today would be a completely different film and then who knows what you got or how good it is. Maybe what we would have ended up with was something very much like....the Phantom Menace.
Look, I told you. I first watched Star Wars in late 90's. So as far as I am concerned, for me it was as if it was released in late 90's because that's when I was first introduced to it. Yet I found it superior to any film made at that time. So it did not "dim" nor was "completely different film". It simply was the same great film as it it was in 1977. Certainly far better than any crap released at the time I watched it.
真実
luckydube56 said:
Cinema today is obsessed with pointless, soulless, CGI-cluttered, remade junk.
Fixed.
Easy to forget Star Wars was called the cinematic equivalent of junk food by it's detractors back then, among other things. I still chuckle at the memory of one critic who was strongly suggesting parents were better off taking kids to the Disney film Candleshoe instead. Oh, the irony!
And some of the usual suspects have blamed SW and Jaws for Hollywood's blockbuster mentality ever since.
It's all a load of dingo's kidneys of course. ;)
Where were you in '77?
SilverWook said:
Easy to forget Star Wars was called the cinematic equivalent of junk food by it's detractors back then, among other things. I still chuckle at the memory of one critic who was strongly suggesting parents were better off taking kids to the Disney film Candleshoe instead. Oh, the irony!
This one cracks me up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rB3V3qyZiFM
He also runs a blog now: http://uncensoredsimon.blogspot.com/
A picture is worth a thousand words. Post 102 is worth more.
I’m late to the party, but I think this is the best song. Enjoy!
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imperialscum said:
Anchorhead said:
That wouldn't be possible now. People go into the theater expecting HD CGI realism. If it isn't Avatar, Matrix, Transformers, or a Marvel-based comic action piece, it doesn't land at the level Star Wars circa 1977 did.
Yet these films doesn't have that something special as Star Wars has. That is why they were popular for a year and then forgotten.
You mean limited competition in the toy market and unbelivable merchandise out the wazoo, with a holiday special to boot?
I'm not denying the lasting appeal of Star Wars -- hell, I wouldn't be here if I did -- but at least part of that was manufactured.
A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em
bkev said:
I'm not denying the lasting appeal of Star Wars -- hell, I wouldn't be here if I did -- but at least part of that was manufactured.
And I am not denying that part. But that part was small and lasted (had an affect) only a few years around the release. It is not a factor in lasting appeal of SW. I don't know about your case (I am curious) but it certainly had no influence on me. Nor on anyone of my age that I know and who was also introduced to SW 20 years after the initial release. The only influencing factor on me was the film itself. I did not know any of the details about the hype and historical context of the initial released and at that time I did not see nor own any of Star Wars merchandise.
真実
imperialscum said:
Anchorhead said:
That wouldn't be possible now. People go into the theater expecting HD CGI realism. If it isn't Avatar, Matrix, Transformers, or a Marvel-based comic action piece, it doesn't land at the level Star Wars circa 1977 did.
Yet these films doesn't have that something special as Star Wars has. That is why they were popular for a year and then forgotten.
Yeah, you never hear anything about The Matrix fifteen years later...
That is only because even though there is interest on the part of the fans seeing a Matrix Resurrection does not mean the filmakers have any intention of making it.
And its been so long that the general public would probably be like Matrix what?
Even the Hobbit films are not making the same mark that the lotr trilogy did.
They may eventually make as much or more but the novelty is gone.
“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.
So, that's some other Hobbit movie that's been king of the box office against a crap load of other holiday movies the past month?
G.E. thinks there's still enough recognition factor for The Matrix, they hired Agent Smith as a pitchman. ;)
Where were you in '77?
SilverWook said:
G.E. thinks there's still enough recognition factor for The Matrix, they hired Agent Smith as a pitchman. ;)
TV's Frink said:
Yeah, you never hear anything about The Matrix fifteen years later...
That's not what I was trying to point out. Human memory is amazing. Obviously we will still recognise stuff and maybe say something about it once in a while. But that is true for good films and bad films.
Let me put it like this. How many people watches Star Wars, let's say annually, and how many does that with Matrix?
真実
This is a foolish comparison. I still watch The Matrix fairly often, and find it as excellent as I ever did.
hairy_hen said:
This is a foolish comparison.
Repeated 'cause is so true.
TV's Frink said:
hairy_hen said:
This is a foolish comparison.
Repeated 'cause is so true.
It actually wasn't a comparison. It was a question.
真実
Are you for real?*
i've lost interest in the matrix, but still think star wars is the bees knees.