Are Muslims really trying to take over, or are some people just suffering from Islamaphobia? — Page 8

Warbler said:

It sent a message to anyone else thinking of f___ing with us. "you attack the United States, we will come after you and make you pay... in ten years time."

TheBoost said:

Hey, it's me. said:

TheBoost said:

Hey, it's me. said:

TheBoost said:

I have a friend who is a massive cricket fan and has been to Bangladesh and Pakistan to see England play on tour. And he has quite reliably informed me that these countries are utter shitholes. No amount of holiday brochure pictures will change that. Nice try though.

Well, while I'm sure you're friends anecdotes are wonderfully insightful, reffering to the developing world, with their massive cities, internet, freeways, and hospitals, as "Stone Age shitholes" carries with it a nice little air of "These masses of brown savages sure should be glad we civilized folk invented fire. And they get it for free!" 

It's funny, because just about everything you're saying is what American's in the Southwest like to say about Mexicans. 

And while I cant speak to British immigration, it's the same thing that was said about Chinese immigrants, Irish immigrants, Afro-Carribean immigrants, and Easter European immigrants here in America.

 

In regards to my friend who has actually been to these places, his comments weren't anecdotal. Believe me.

You may need to look up what anecdotal means.

Were not weren't (tut) don't get me wrong, he wasnt entirely degrading of these places. He just said that the overwhelming majority seemed to live in squalor. And he couldn't get out of Islamabad quick enough. It's an extremely dangerous place. Anyway, I'm not anti-immigration. I just think it should be selective and should only apply to proven professional people or students who come to learn. Economic migrants cause problems when there are already big problems with unemployment, housing,for the native population. 

Regardless of if he directly did it or just inspired 9/11 (he did deny doing it at first though was pleased) running around the mountains of the graveyard of Empires (Afghanistan is where super powers go to die) trying to find his numerous Bond villain lairs (hollowed out mountains indeed) bred more future enemies of America and her allies than anything Bin Laden could have said or written.

Not bringing him to the trial of the Century only makes things worse.

Look what happened when Hitler missed his day in court. He, his brain and his clones were turning up all over South America like the postmortem Elvis.

Thousands of years from now some cult may be worshiping the risen Obama Bone Looden.

The only reason we have this thread is recent foreign policy led by the quest for cheap oil.

There were people of Arab and Persian extraction living in the West quite happily for decades before all this overblown hysteria and Western people had felt a genuine interest in the culture of Islam (the cuisine, the poetry, the art etc).

The dark side of extreme forms of those cultures went on without much in the way of comment from the east either.

But from the Carter presidency onwards things have just escalated to the point where Islam and Arab are Western boogey words.

If the Dollar falls the USA will go the way of the Weimar Republic (nice place, liberal laws, centre of artistic expression and freedom of expression, over-run by anti-Semitic nutjobs).

Warbler said:

what was wrong with that?  The guy did 911, he murdered 3000 Americans and laughed about it.   He continued to taunt us and threat to murder more Americans.   I'm glad we got the bastard.  

What about many in the UK celebrating Thatcher's death? 

btw, what problems did Thatcher's death solve?

Naturally neither death solved any problems.

Both Thatcher and Bin Laden were victims of believing a selective version of the past and both created more trouble than their perceived enemies could dream of without them.

I can understand celebrating the death of a bogeyman like Bin Laden but it just puts a capstone on the myth of the man.

The celebrations of the Death of Thatcher were a reaction to the celebrations of the life of Thatcher which were as much a whitewash of history as she was frequently guilty of.

CP3S said:

Warbler said:

It sent a message to anyone else thinking of f___ing with us. "you attack the United States, we will come after you and make you pay... in ten years time."

it may have taken awhile, but we got him.   He is now sleeping with the fishes and not threatening us or planning more attacks.

He is also more likely to inspire people to do what he was accused of.

The last thing you should do to someone with a martyr complex is turn them into a martyr.

^precisely^

Exactly like Hitler.

The Russians were convinced he had sneaked away, stories of him hanging around Argentina were a source of cash for old Nazis in exile and neo-Nazis keeping the demented dream alive.

Combat 18 get their name for A and H being the first and eighth letters in the alphabet.

Hitler was also a source of inspiration for Saddam Hussein.

What a great film The Boys from Brazil is. 

Bin Laden could've disappeared for the rest of his days if he wished. He would never have been found. And where does he eventually end up being discovered ten years later? In a mansion in Pakistan watching TV. Nope I just don't buy it. Why not Iran? Plenty of sympathisers there who would've made sure he would've permanently disappeared.

Bin Laden should have been put on trial and if found guilty locked up somewhere with a view of the Manhattan skyline.

Everyday he would be reminded that 9/11 accomplished nothing.

Instead he is a Bin Laden shaped beacon for everyone with an axe to grind against America and her allies.

Hey, it's me. said:

Bin Laden could've disappeared for the rest of his days if he wished. He would never have been found. And where does he eventually end up being discovered ten years later? In a mansion in Pakistan watching TV. Nope I just don't buy it. Why not Iran? Plenty of sympathisers there who would've made sure he would've permanently disappeared.

I am sure he had people in Pakistan helping him.  He probably thought we've never send troops into Pakistan and so he thought he was safe. 

Mrebo said:

 I think Bush was right that bin Laden wasn't the that important a target

tell that to the friends and family members of the 3000 people he murdered(not to mention the friends and family member of people that died in other attacks like on the USS Cole).

And was that really the Situation room they were all huddled in watching events unfurl? It looked like a Human Resources office and they were watching it on a portable meant for training videos. In fact a woman at the back looks confused, as if she's stumbled upon the gathering and is asking, 'is this Human Resources?' 

Mrebo said:

 I don't agree that bin Laden and Hitler are more inspirational now, however.

if anything, Bin Laden was more of an inspiration while he was alive.   Evil people everywhere could at him and believe that since he did it, they too could attack the US and live to tell the tale.   Now they know we will pursue people that attack the US, not matter how long it takes.   One the reasons 911 happened, was because of our weak response to the World Trade Center bombing in 1993, the Cole attack, and the embassy bombings.   Call our response to 911 what you will, but it certainly wasn't weak.   

Hey, it's me. said:

And was that really the Situation room they were all huddled in watching events unfurl? It looked like a Human Resources office and they were watching it on a portable meant for training videos. In fact a woman at the back looks confused, as if she's stumbled upon the gathering and is asking, 'is this Human Resources?' 

so?

Warbler said:

Hey, it's me. said:

Bin Laden could've disappeared for the rest of his days if he wished. He would never have been found. And where does he eventually end up being discovered ten years later? In a mansion in Pakistan watching TV. Nope I just don't buy it. Why not Iran? Plenty of sympathisers there who would've made sure he would've permanently disappeared.

I am sure he had people in Pakistan helping him.  He probably thought we've never send troops into Pakistan and so he thought he was safe. 

That's a very nonchalant thought from the worlds most wanted man. Iran was, and still is, a no go country for America. Your telling me after 10 years he became mildly blasé about the hunt for him and thought,'nah. Ill be alright here.' . ?

Warbler said:

Hey, it's me. said:

And was that really the Situation room they were all huddled in watching events unfurl? It looked like a Human Resources office and they were watching it on a portable meant for training videos. In fact a woman at the back looks confused, as if she's stumbled upon the gathering and is asking, 'is this Human Resources?' 

so?

So? Look at this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cabinet_Office_Briefing_Room.jpg#file. 

Thats the Situation room in London. Now your telling me the White House equivalent is a store cupboard in comparison? And not only that,someone was permitted to take pictures of all the deeply concerned officials and release them to the media? Come on.

Hey, it's me. said:

Warbler said:

Hey, it's me. said:

Bin Laden could've disappeared for the rest of his days if he wished. He would never have been found. And where does he eventually end up being discovered ten years later? In a mansion in Pakistan watching TV. Nope I just don't buy it. Why not Iran? Plenty of sympathisers there who would've made sure he would've permanently disappeared.

I am sure he had people in Pakistan helping him.  He probably thought we've never send troops into Pakistan and so he thought he was safe. 

That's a very nonchalant thought from the worlds most wanted man. Iran was, and still is, a no go country for America. Your telling me after 10 years he became mildly blasé about the hunt for him and thought,'nah. Ill be alright here.' . ?

Well remember for a portion of that time, Bush concentrated on Iraq and Bin Laden wasn't priority.    I would think Pakistan would be more no go than Iran.   There are alot of people who hate us in both countries, but only Pakistan has nukes(yet).   Sending troops into Pakistan is much more risky than sending troops into Iran.   For years in this very forum I asked why we couldn't send troops into mountain areas in Pakistan, where we thought he was, the response I got was

"no it would be too risky,  we would be risking nuclear war with Pakistan.   The people that don't like the US, would be up in arms and perhaps cause chaos and perhaps extreme US hating hardliners would take over Pakistan and then who knows what."   

maybe Bin Laden thought the same thing and therefor thought he was safe in Pakistan.   

Hey, it's me. said:

Warbler said:

Hey, it's me. said:

And was that really the Situation room they were all huddled in watching events unfurl? It looked like a Human Resources office and they were watching it on a portable meant for training videos. In fact a woman at the back looks confused, as if she's stumbled upon the gathering and is asking, 'is this Human Resources?' 

so?

So? Look at this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cabinet_Office_Briefing_Room.jpg#file. 

Thats the Situation room in London. Now your telling me the White House equivalent is a store cupboard in comparison? And not only that,someone was permitted to take pictures of all the deeply concerned officials and release them to the media? Come on.

I meant so, as in so what if the picture of them watching events wasn't real?  Does that really mean anything?

So you thought the picture at the time was a staged fake anyway? Begs the question, why release a 'staged' fake picture of the most important people in America in a clearly fake Situation room? 

imperialscum said:

 Or millions of people around the world suffering because of your foreign policy and military invasions.

yeah, sure it is all the fault of the big bad US, and Saddam and Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda have nothing to do with it.   what bullshit.