Harmy's STAR WARS Despecialized Edition HD - V2.7 - MKV (Released) — Page 354

Gomu69 said:

I know that feeling, being a 20-year man myself has me lumped into that awkward gap among the generations divided between those who are indifferent about the whole thing and people who are willing to take a step back and reconsider what's being presented to them. I had taken the liberty of experiencing the original trilogy as little as possible to avoid being brainwashed by the versions made commercially available so that my purest memories of Star Wars remain Despecialized.

I'm 21 and try to watch films on Blu-Ray if possible for maximum quality, obviously for the OT this presents some serious problems.

Although.. my older brother had ANH on VHS, no idea on the year/release but I can tell you it definately pre-dated 1997 as it had no gold label, i've only ever seen ESB & ROTJ in it's 1997 and 2004/2011 variants.

I'm more of a big film buff than a huge Star Wars fan (although I think they're great films), and thats why I love projects like this, the labor of love people have for films.

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

davextreme said:

Just to play devil's advocate slightly, I think the whole thing would not be an issue if the SE had been done tastefully from the start. If all it had been was cleaning up some continuity errors and doing some touch ups I doubt anyone would have gotten worked up.

You may be right, but to not preserve and make available the originals would still be wrong, regardless of whether or not a lot of people notice.

But allow me to play a different devil's advocate... I think that one of the reasons that so many people are concerned, is rooted in the fact that the changes were made 20 years later.  Had the changes been made 2 or 3 years later (say, in 1979), they would have been viewed by most as creative tweaks.  The fact that they were made 20 years later is what is so unprecedented and what also makes the changes so glaringly out of place.

It is hard to imagine any change made 20 years after-the-fact that could possibly be appropriate or relevant.  1997 is a very different time and place in moviedom than 1977.  To wit, if George had made tweaks in 1979, they would likely have been very different tweaks than the ones he made in 1997... even if the technology of the late 1990s were available to him.  This is evidenced by the change to Han's character with respect to him shooting first -- acceptable in 1977, not acceptable in 1997.  This is why it is so dangerous to change movies: in so doing you lose your window to the past.

I don't disagree with any of this and this thread derailment has probably gone on long enough. Clearly there's no scenario where the original shouldn't have also been restored properly and released, even in a world with a less outrageous SE. The problem was never that George shouldn't be allowed to mess with the movie, just his attempts to suppress the original.

CatBus said:

lpd said:

The best bits on that disc for colour reference is the split seconds of TESB, it looks great.

Well, if anyone can post caps of these, Harmy's fishing for ESB color references.  Even a few frames could be useful.

Have posted a few over on Harmys TESB

1982, so technically I existed at least before the last OT film came out.  I couldn't have been more than 4 or 5 by the time I was hooked on SW through a VHS recording made by my grandfather, complete with commercials, which also got burned into my nostalgia (just this last year I finally watched the heavily advertised "Greystoke: The Legend of Tarzan", I still save my green m&m's for last because they're for "hitting a home run", but you won't find me eating any nutrasweet...).  Of course I upgraded to the offical VHS's, eventually having probably 3 distinct sets, and likely a replacement of a set at some point depending on how much wear I may have put on my earliest sets.  Add to that the fact that Droids and Ewoks cartoons were still airing, I had a recording of Ewoks: The Battle for Endor, outlet pricing and garage sales of Star Wars toys, from which I built an impressive collection despite my comparitively late start, I had all the Star Wars I could want to watch or play with...  It was an amazing time (which I fully appreciate the blessing it was), a good chunk of my happiest childhood memories had to do with SW.

Mostly due to the SE's and the terrible PT which together prove that Lucas' vision wasn't as profound as the OT originally lucked into seeming to indicate, SW doesn't hold the same power over me it once did and could have somewhat continued to.  The frequency and necessity of watching the OT started to sharply diminish when the SE started taking over, without me even realizing at the time it was my body rejecting the cheapening of SW caused by the SE.  I went quickly from watching it multiple times a year to being lucky if I got in a viewing of some of the movies once in a year.  The SE's just weren't enjoyable to me and were quickly becoming the simplest way to see it.  But, when I watch non-SE versions like GOUT and now Harmy's recreation, I do feel a lot of that old magic, and can lose myself in my life-long favorite movies again.  I really can't thank Harmy enough, even though nothing can undo the ruin Lucas has brought to the overall SW universe, being able to ignore all of that for ~2 hours at a time is really special.

And just for the fun of it, the number of official non-SE OT sets I now own is, I think 7:  3 VHS sets (have to double check this), 3 Laserdisc sets (CBS/Fox P&S, Faces and Definitive Collection), and The GOUT DVDs.

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

Had the changes been made 2 or 3 years later (say, in 1979), they would have been viewed by most as creative tweaks.  The fact that they were made 20 years later is what is so unprecedented and what also makes the changes so glaringly out of place.

I understand what you're saying here, but even if the changes had been made within 2-3 years I don't think they would've been greeted all that favorably.

When Spielberg released the "Special Edition" of Close Encounters in 1980 with re-edits and added effects the response was uniformly negative. Especially when it soon became clear that the unaltered 1977 cut was gone forever.

On Topic: Watching Despecialized on my big-ass HDTV with the lights low and the sound up never fails to send me back to summer '77, sitting in the packed Glenwood Theatre and experiencing Star Wars for the first time.

Thanks so much Harmy for this astounding gift of time travel.

Harmy,

I know this is off topic but I wasn't sure you would check that other thread again.  Out of curiosity what do you like about the movie Titanic?  I can't stand practically anything up to the point it hits the iceberg. 

I think this thread just hit an iceberg.

 

Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:

Had the changes been made 2 or 3 years later (say, in 1979), they would have been viewed by most as creative tweaks.  The fact that they were made 20 years later is what is so unprecedented and what also makes the changes so glaringly out of place.

 

Backlight said:

 

I understand what you're saying here, but even if the changes had been made within 2-3 years I don't think they would've been greeted all that favorably.

When Spielberg released the "Special Edition" of Close Encounters in 1980 with re-edits and added effects the response was uniformly negative. Especially when it soon became clear that the unaltered 1977 cut was gone forever.

 

When Spielberg released the "Special Edition" of Close Encounters in 1980 with re-edits and added effects the response was uniformly negative. Especially when it soon became clear that the unaltered 1977 cut was gone forever.

 

Hmmm. I'm not sure I entirely agree that the response to the SE of CE3K was "uniformly negative". This sounds like a bit of revisionist history to me.  For example, Roger Ebert, arguably the most influential movie reviewer at the time, praised the SE and called it a superior film.  And I believe you'll find that this was the general assessment of most (though not all) mainstream critics at the time. And I don't believe that it was ever "clear" (or even discussed) that the 1977 cut was "gone forever" (indeed it wasn't).

Don't get me wrong, I don't believe the SE is the best version of CE3K by a long shot (I don't like the mothership interior and prefer the 1998 cut) . As I'm sure you know Spielberg only did the mothership interior because of pressure from the studio. But keep in mind that at the time Spielberg said he wasn't happy with the 77 cut, and wanted to do a "Director's Cut", and in fact he was responsible for the edits in the 80 cut. In any event, at best, the SE is an odd curiosity, but I don't think there was a "uniformly negative" reaction it at the time, and certainly no one was worried that the original cut was gone forever. There wasn't wide-spread running around saying "Oh no, I'm never going to be able to own the 1977 cut of CE3K on VHS or Betamax!"

As far as the SW SE goes, I agree with Puggo that had Lucas made changes within 2-3 years (and he did to a certain extent) I don't believe there would have been much ado about it. Having said that, even 20 years after the fact the Star Wars SE's did not get a uniformly negative response when they came out 1997, and in fact the changes were basically regarded as creative tweaks. Much the opposite, there was quite a bit of excitement to see the films on the big screen (again or for the very first time), and most people were psyched to see the new effects. The films were generally very well received. It was only later, with the rise of DVD (and people saw how dated and out of place the new effects look), along with the ability to spread the word online, that the backlash really grew.  Remember, the initial home video release of the SE's was on VHS...a medium people could still get the films in their original versions in.  It was when Lucas refused to release the unaltered films on DVD and people realised that we'd never see the films in their original versions again (in the latest home video format) hat things went off.  

I agree that if the SW SE's came out today, knowing that the originals would never see the light of day, the backlash would be huge (as it is). But today we have the internet in a way we didn't in 1997 (and certainly 1980). Back in 1997 people couldn't easily find how much BS George's "These are the films I always wanted to make" was. Reviews of the SW and CE3K SE's back then were largely written by professional film reviewers who didn't have as much invested in these movies, not hard core genre fans who make up the bulk of online reviewers today.  Having said that, if Lucas released the OT today, with new updated effects, and "deleted" scenes, people would still flock to the theatres.  Including most people on this board.  It's the absence of the OT in an HD format that has most of us upset.

Again, just to be clear, I feel the same way about the SE's and "good-enough" George's basterdizations of his films as most on here, and I won't even watch them (thank you again, Harmy).  But, like George's SE's themselves, there is quite a bit of revisionism that tends to go on about their reception.

1971 here. Saw all three films in their original forms in theaters during their original runs... ahhh to be 6, 9, and 12 again!!

I'm so sorry to be a bug. I'm not a techie in any way, i don't understand half of what i'm reading but i am extremely passionate about these movies being their original. if i could find the old VHS tapes i'd settle for them! I don't understand how to download these movies, how to even tell which one is witch. if someone could just give me a link that i can burn with a macbook i would be so grateful. Please don't ban me, this is probably in the wrong place and everything but i'm desperate! desperate and confused i tell you! I'm like a poor little ewok over here who got taken into space and is like WTH? This is nothing like endor. HELP!  

chyron8472 said:

1978.

Believe it or not, my earliest memories of Star Wars are listening to the Return of the Jedi Read-Along Book and Tape. :)

 

 

I can't recall when I first watched the movies. I do, however, remember that my parents must have had a pirate copy of "Star Wars" (which I think might have been widescreen) because I can distinctly recall the final shot of the throne room and the thought that the black bars were annoying and stupid (hey, I was a kid and it wasn't explained why they were there). So, obviously I didn't watch it.

But I do remember when my parents gave me the "Faces" VHS box set. I think it was for my birthday.

 

Actually, I used to love the "Story of Star Wars" LP myself. :)

And the black bars you recall during the throne room scene could have still been a P&S version.  Unless I'm mistaken (and I'm sure someone will correct me if I am), some of the old P&S videocassettes switched to "widescreen" in the final moments of the film, just before the credits.  I once knew the technical reason for this, but I've forgotten it. Though I do remember something like that happening in many old VHS films, not just SW.

Iceempress66 said:

I'm so sorry to be a bug. I'm not a techie in any way, i don't understand half of what i'm reading but i am extremely passionate about these movies being their original. if i could find the old VHS tapes i'd settle for them! I don't understand how to download these movies, how to even tell which one is witch. if someone could just give me a link that i can burn with a macbook i would be so grateful. Please don't ban me, this is probably in the wrong place and everything but i'm desperate! desperate and confused i tell you! I'm like a poor little ewok over here who got taken into space and is like WTH? This is nothing like endor. HELP!  

Step one - read page 1 of this thread. You might also benefit from reading the rules thread. One such rule is that direct links are not allowed.

AntcuFaalb said:

Nick66 said:

And the black bars you recall during the throne room scene could have still been a P&S version.  Unless I'm mistaken (and I'm sure someone will correct me if I am), some of the old P&S videocassettes switched to "widescreen" in the final moments of the film, just before the credits.  I once knew the technical reason for this, but I've forgotten it. Though I do remember something like that happening in many old VHS films, not just SW.

The HBO custom pan&scan does this, IIRC.

Yeah, and it may be an old HBO broadcast that I'm remembering seeing.

Iceempress66 said:

how to even tell which one is witch.

See if it weighs the same as a duck.

That blog post made my head explode.