Harmy's STAR WARS Despecialized Edition HD - V2.7 - MKV (Released) — Page 347

Chaps, I think your getting the tech vs source artifacts argument upside down.

The higher the resolution dosnt make the artifacts dissapear, if there in the source you will see them and you'll actually see them more the higher the resolution you have and the bigger the screen you have.  If you have a 4K projector its up scaling everything ( there are no native 4K blu rays yet)  which inevitably introduces artifacts, however small or unnoticeable believe me they are there. Same with watching a 720p source on a 1080p display. You either have your player are your display doing the up scaling but its still up scaling. Yes the further away from the screen you sit the less you'll see I always recommend you sit at least 2 times the width of screen away from it or If you reduce the size of your screen the better the picture looks. If you still have an old crt tv which can take an hd source say via component inputs the picture looks amazing and pin sharp and not an artifact in sight. I still swear old crt tv's can beat any new lcd, plasma, dlp hands down for picture quality honestly.

The only way to watch a movie without any artifacts is to not watch it digitally at all ie: the "old way" with celluloid. Believe me I have qualifications in av and av installations and would give my left nut to have a 35mm projector set up.

Technical question regarding the sound mix for all three movies. The original 1977, 1980, and 1983 sound mixes are all at significantly lower levels than the Hairy Hen 5.1 Purist mix on my copies of the DE ED editions. Is this how it is suppose to be or did I screw something up in the burning of the DVDs? I have to crank the volume up significantly in order to listen to these mixes. Keep in mind I don't have a surround sound system set up, I'm listening to these through my TV speakers only at this point.

Cheers,

Adam 

lpd said:

Chaps, I think your getting the tech vs source artifacts argument upside down.

The higher the resolution dosnt make the artifacts dissapear, if there in the source you will see them and you'll actually see them more the higher the resolution you have and the bigger the screen you have.  If you have a 4K projector its up scaling everything ( there are no native 4K blu rays yet)  which inevitably introduces artifacts, however small or unnoticeable believe me they are there. Same with watching a 720p source on a 1080p display. You either have your player are your display doing the up scaling but its still up scaling. Yes the further away from the screen you sit the less you'll see I always recommend you sit at least 2 times the width of screen away from it or If you reduce the size of your screen the better the picture looks. If you still have an old crt tv which can take an hd source say via component inputs the picture looks amazing and pin sharp and not an artifact in sight. I still swear old crt tv's can beat any new lcd, plasma, dlp hands down for picture quality honestly.

The only way to watch a movie without any artifacts is to not watch it digitally at all ie: the "old way" with celluloid. Believe me I have qualifications in av and av installations and would give my left nut to have a 35mm projector set up.

 

Well of course.  It's interesting though isn't it...yes, the artifacts are there, but if you can't see them, it really doesn't matter, does it?  Either you can't see them because you're sitting far enough away from the screen, or original source is high quality enough, or your device does an amazing job of upscaling, or, more likely, your eye just isn't trained to notice most video artifacting.  It's like high bit rate lossy music, yes, artifcats are there, but since 95% of the population can't hear them, what difference does it make?

I rip all my BD's to 720p video using x264, with a size of approximately 5-7gb per hour, which I then watch on my 1080p TV.  I'm sure there artifacts are there, since the files are a fraction of their size on BD, but damn if I can see the difference unless I'm looking very, very closely and using the pause button.  And that's generally been my experience with Harmy's 720p Ded.

Oh I agree, if you cant see it makes no odds. I was just trying to say it basically works this way, crap in crap out ie: if there's artifacts in the source you will see them no matter how great your gear is, thanks Mr Lucas. Its hard with Star Wars because you can only adjust its colors and so-forth so much, until some how we get a pristine scan of a pristine copy we'll have to put up with these niggles.

But once again i've never had an edition of Star Wars that reminded me of what it used to look like as much as this one.

Cheers to that. It's probably the best we're going to have for quite some time. Someday there'll probably be a "lost" reproduction in "extra HD+ gasm" format with "perfect everything." Until then, I think this is pretty much "it" when it comes to a "remix" of original-ness. Honestly, I wonder if they'll even bother with continuing on the 3D stuff, and then release that as yet another 4th or 5th gen "SE" of the movies.

Can't wait for a "2.0" of ESB / ROTJ after this gets finished up. Would just be flat out awesome.

As far as authoring goes, any thoughts on making it more something "simple" and easy, or "all out" on the structure? ...too bad the tools for this are still kind of a mess to deal with. Hopefully it can get sorted out soon and work can progress on these "finishing touches."

Yeah, it's a bummer that some authoring features are still extremely complicated to pull off (or need very expensive software), for example multiple angles. It would be SO cool to have just one release with all the different language crawls, Greedo subs and credits, depending on what audio track you pick.

Harmy said:

Yes! I win! Up yours Ady! :-D Just kidding - I'm personally really looking forward to ESB:R and also ANH:R HD. I was actually thinking about sometime doing my own personal SE using Ady's ANH:R (PAL DVD9 of course) and HD-fying it and undoing some of the changes I don't really like all that much.

Since you mentioned Greedo subs, I still think alien subtitles should be featured in a forced subtitle track rather than burned in to our pristine picture (for the sake of foreign viewers, if nothing else), but Harmy says he wants it this way, so I guess I've lost out on this hope.

LOL, perhaps a new hope (to coin a phrase), would be that these hard subbed scenes could be provided in full quality in an alternate angle or as bonus content.  Since so many people use clips of Star Wars for so many different purposes (we can all agree that's an understatement), it'd be nice to have everything, including such scenes, fully available for use in the quality offered by this project.  Tell me anywhere else I could find the "Han was the only one to shoot" (I find "Han shot first" to be a woefully inaccurate description) scene in this kind of quality, and I'd be all ears.

INv8r_ZIM said:

Harmy said:

Yes! I win! Up yours Ady! :-D Just kidding - I'm personally really looking forward to ESB:R and also ANH:R HD. I was actually thinking about sometime doing my own personal SE using Ady's ANH:R (PAL DVD9 of course) and HD-fying it and undoing some of the changes I don't really like all that much.

Last edited on April 3, 2013 at 1:41 PM by INv8r_ZIM (Reason: Board doesn't F%$*kin work.)

lol

The amazing thing about these Despecialised Editions is not that they are perfect...they're not, and never will be.  What's amazing about them is the incredible amount of care and research that has gone into every "frame"...especially the colour correction.

Let's say Disney/Lucasfilm ever did give us the an HD version of the OT...is there anyone who thinks that they'd put as much care and meticulous research into how the film looked in 1977 as is evident in this set? Does anyone think they'd consider carefully how every moment of the movie looked? Would they attempt to match the subtitles of the original release? The colours?  Would the reproduce the 1977 audio mixes? Of course they wouldn't. When, and if we ever get the OT in HD, I'm sure it will have plenty of beautiful 1080p or HD detail...maybe even a 4K scan.  But I have absolutely no doubt they'd f*ck up the colours at a minimum.  It will be a slick presentation made for contemporary tastes and sensibilities.  But it won't be any kind of preservation.

So no matter what, these DEd's are going to be a part of my HT collection for a long, long time.

Sweet. Nice to hear there's thought taking place concerning an eventual 3.0 some day :)

This looks promising - exactly what I was thinking was possible for authoring a menu, or set of menus (you mentioned a couple slideshows...) - - - http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1119634#post1119634

Seems like it is indeed possible to simply create a "fake" project, then throw in your rendered m2ts file(s), tweak a couple things, and it should work as expected.

Not sure if chapters would come across as functional, but it's worth a shot.(see: http://www.afterdawn.com/guides/archive/afterdawn_blu-ray_encoding_tutorial_lesson_3-chapter_points_and_bitrate.cfm)

Subtitles may also need to be 'rendered' with something like this - http://www.afterdawn.com/guides/archive/afterdawn_blu-ray_encoding_tutorial_lesson_8-convert_text_subtitles_to_images.cfm

I'd be willing to give this a try, making a 'fake' project, trying the 2.1 m2ts, adding a slideshow, but I don't know when I'll have time. Crazy busy month ahead.

I just watched V2.1, but I'm not sure what to think. It looks great and all, but I'm not sure if "what seems off" is from the picture settings, or not seeing it in a long time? x_x

Chyron, I agree about the typeface, but if the font and position could be reproduced correctly as a Blu-ray subtitle, would that not be close enough?