7FN,
No, 16bit 44.1kHz files are not blu ray compliant. They have to be upsampled to 48kHz, just like DVD. However, 44.1kHz should work fine when muxed to an mkv file.
If I had some gum, I’d chew a hole into the sun…
schorman13 said:
7FN,
No, 16bit 44.1kHz files are not blu ray compliant. They have to be upsampled to 48kHz, just like DVD. However, 44.1kHz should work fine when muxed to an mkv file.
That's great - thanks for clearing that up for me. Prefer to keep things bit-perfect and unchanged where possible. I'll keep this as it is and mux into an mkv as/when available then.
Ta ;)
Any chance of somebody being able to upload the GOUT-synced version to MySpleen? It would be greatly appreciated. I tried a newsgroup trial to acquire it, but the connection kept resetting and I wasn't able to download the files.
Since this seems like it might be the best quality source available at the moment for the original Star Wars stereo 35mm soundtrack, has Hairy_Hen used this as the source for his restored/corrected 1977 Star Wars stereo soundtrack?
Thanks for providing the soundtrack, schorman13. :) Hopefully these laserdisk sets will also provide the highest quality sources for the original The Empire Strikes Back and Return of the Jedi stereo soundtracks, also. :)
The Star Wars trilogy. There can be only one.
Dunedain said:
Since this seems like it might be the best quality source available at the moment for the original Star Wars stereo 35mm soundtrack, has Hairy_Hen used this as the source for his restored/corrected 1977 Star Wars stereo soundtrack?
He's used it as a source for his 70mm mix, but for fairly small sections IIRC (an explosion on Tantive IV... and that may be it). H_H's 70mm project predates this one and I believe switching over to an entirely new source for most of the audio would have created more problems than it solved--keep in mind that while this recording is clearly the current best-of-breed for 1977 stereo, 1) it is not without its problems, and 2) its better dynamic range is not such a standout when compared to later audio revisions, from which h_h based much of his audio.
And yes, I'm also interested in hearing Empire and Jedi!
Any updates on whether or not Empire and Jedi are floating around? I listened to Harmy's DeEd 2.0 the other night with this and it's just wonderful!
“Alright twinkle-toes, what’s your exit strategy?”
As far as I am aware schorman has these, and they are part of the Star Wars Laser Disc Audio Archive on the 'Spleen. I am looking into syncing these rips to match the other GOUT-synced mixes, as the jump between the Digital rips and the Analogue ones is night and day.
Teeceezy said:
As far as I am aware schorman has these, and they are part of the Star Wars Laser Disc Audio Archive on the 'Spleen. I am looking into syncing these rips to match the other GOUT-synced mixes, as the jump between the Digital rips and the Analogue ones is night and day.
Excellent news. Please consider patching over any problem areas (dropouts, pitch warbles) with the best available other sources, and also making the ROTJ sync match the PAL framecount. Can't wait to hear these all synced up--you're right they sound pretty great unsynced already.
Nifty! Would anyone be kind enough to offer me an invite to myspleen?
Sounds like a wonderful place.
“Alright twinkle-toes, what’s your exit strategy?”
My expertise in film audio is virtually non-existent. I've used ACID, Audacity and FL Studio for a few years, and have done a bit of video production at University, but it's unlikely anything I ouput would be at the same standard as a lot of the audio work on this forum. So far I have aligned the digital rips against other GOUT-synced audio sources, and patched the disc change gaps with the analogue captures of the theatrical mixes. Outside of that, and matching the master gain to fall in line with other mixes I have not made any changes.
I will scan over these in the next few days, and see what needs fixing. Does anyone know of any particular defects that are in these mixes already?
Teeceezy said:
My expertise in film audio is virtually non-existent. I've used ACID, Audacity and FL Studio for a few years, and have done a bit of video production at University, but it's unlikely anything I ouput would be at the same standard as a lot of the audio work on this forum. So far I have aligned the digital rips against other GOUT-synced audio sources, and patched the disc change gaps with the analogue captures of the theatrical mixes. Outside of that, and matching the master gain to fall in line with other mixes I have not made any changes.
I will scan over these in the next few days, and see what needs fixing. Does anyone know of any particular defects that are in these mixes already?
ROTJ GOUT NTSC-based audio (unfortunately, this includes most of our GOUT-synced audio resources) will fall out of sync with PAL-based projects (all of our big ones) at about 47:37 (just after Luke's last scene on Dagobah) and will continue to be out-of-sync until 1:38:33 (after some Ewoks jump over a log), after which the sync problem becomes so minor you don't notice it anymore. It's worst when you're watching Han speak--other characters either don't move their mouths as much, or speak more slowly, so it's always worst with Han. At its worst, it's only a two-frame sync problem, so some don't notice it at all, but I sure do.
The easiest way to fix this is, once you're done syncing to NTSC, trim one frame from 1:38:33, and then add two frames to 47:37, and patch over the transitions to smooth it out. Ta-daa, it now syncs perfectly with Harmy/dark_jedi/You_Too's projects.
As for the digital rips in particular, I just casually listened enough to declare they sounded great, and to hope someone synced them, sorry ;)
EDIT: Although I'd certainly be willing to give your files-in-progress a test-listen... ;)
One more thing, to get the timing exactly right, the frame you trim at 1:38:33 should be the last frame before the cut, and the frames you add at 47:37 should be the first frames after the wipe is complete. Uh.. at least I think so...
Are there ROTJ audio sources that are synced to the preservations here? The mixes I used are from DE 1.0 and DJ v3 so I had assumed they were already synced, but if not it was not something I had noticed before.
Nope, neither of those are perfectly synced. But honestly they are close enough for most people. If you made something that matched that, 98% of people would be happy. And I could patch it myself for the anal-retentive crowd. But following the instructions above, you should be able to get yours synced without a perfect reference track.
Any progress to report Teeceezy? I'd sure love to hear these!
Have been really busy this week with University, but I am still planning on doing a flyover of TESB, patching if needed and then upping that somewhere. I am thinking the spleen would be best as I have no Usenet access, but I am not entirely sure what the best option is. I was watching over SW 2.1 the other day with the Digital rip and noticed the pitch error on the binary sunset scene, so I may go back for that as well. I'm not sure whether I should up each track seperately, or put up a synced and fixed lossless trilogy of schorman's rips.
Also, does anyone know any program that I could use to view ROTJ DE frame-by-frame with ms timecodes without converting it. I know VirtualDub is good, but I really don't want to convert to AVI.
If you're pressed for time, I'd leave Star Wars alone. hairy_hen is at work on that and he's spotted an amazing number of problems (me? I spotted 2...)
borisanddoris said:
Nifty! Would anyone be kind enough to offer me an invite to myspleen?
Sounds like a wonderful place.
If you still need one, pm me. I'd be glad to help out.
Oh, and if you're just releasing your final versions, MySpleen is the place. For test versions and feedback, any random web hoster will do.
CatBus, is there anyway you could get me timecodes for the exact frames that need fixing in ROTJ? I've tried with VLC, MPC and others, but I can't get an exact timecode in ms or ff that I can use to get the exact ms values I need to change in the audio.
I'm not sure I ever got the exact timecode for the error, down to the millisecond. All of my work (amateur) has a fudge factor of a few ms (I don't notice anything less than two frames off, but I like to think it never got nearly that bad). As long as I couldn't hear the sync drift, I didn't care.
You could probably post in the technical howto forum, how to get the exact timecode of a particular frame. But if you can't get that, consider that neither of these edit points is particularly critical in the A/V sync department, except that they make the frame count match down the road.
If it helps, see this post here: http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Whats-missing-from-GOUT/post/457548/#TopicPost457548
Okay, so while I haven't gotten to giving ROTJ a serious go yet, I have synced the 80, 85, 93 and LD commentary mixes for TESB. I am thinking about doing this for all 3 films, apart from the theatrical and home video mixes for SW which I understand have been done. The size of the results, even when FLAC'd, makes it unlikely to send out testers, as at just under 2gigs a film, they're not the kind of thing I would want to put on a filehost, but they are not 'final' enough for a torrent. The 80 and 85 mixes were matched against current 'theatrical' sources, other than the digital rips, and synced. The 93s were given the same treatment, and then I picked the best out of the original Definitive rips and the 'Faces' rips, and while both are virtually the same for some reason I found the 'Faces' rips sounded better. So a theatrical mix, home video mix, 'Faces' mix, and commentary mix is my plan. I am not totally sure about complete patching, as h_h's observations of SW showed me I am out of my depth trying to do that, so outside of patching disc changeovers, and particularly egregious errors, I will likely not patch much. Oh, and the commentary is the mono commentary rips dropped 20dB, and layered over the theatrical rips, which are dropped 30dB.
Well I'm interested in the '80 ESB mix and the '83 ROTJ mix whenever they're ready enough to share, if not totally complete.
Is there anyone who already has this who might be willing to updload this to 'spleeny-poo or even dropbox it my way?
The laserdisc Archive thingy is 60 gigs and I only want the one file... plus no one seems to be seeding it at the moment...
If no one is willing to do this, and it's allowed, I'll try to download the whooole dang thing and seed just the 77Digital as a standalone file if this would be useful to others?
I've got the 77 digital mix somewhere. It does still have the error around the Binary sunset. If I dig it out, I can upload it somewhere.
I'm dying to get the digital 80 and 83 mix for Empire and Jedi too if anyone has just those. Synced to GOUT of course...
“Alright twinkle-toes, what’s your exit strategy?”