Info Wanted: the GOUT colors?

AntcuFaalb said:

I know the colors in GOUT are bad, but are they consistent?

If you mean are the colours faded or distorted in a consistent way, my take is that due to the organic nature of the medium (film) then probably not. Take a look at this clip and see how the skin tone jumps around between 2.40 - 2.44.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VLroz4DUJY

AntcuFaalb said:

Hmmm... you're probably right. I wonder if they're more consistent than what's on the SWE Technidisc.

Have a look at this: http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/STAR-WARS-Special-Widescreen-Edition-Technidisc/post/572569/#TopicPost572569

It looks like they are from the same source but the GOUT has been processed differently

I don't know about ESB and ROTJ, but I can tell you that in any version of SW the colors are inconsistent, and they've been confirmed to have been like that on some original prints as well.

Here are some examples from SW. Since GOUT-SW is so desaturated I'm using my script that boosts the colors so it's easier to see:

1 - Top shot has more red, especially visible in the whites on R2.

2 - Bottom shot has less yellow / more blue in it.

3 - Probably the most visible inconsistence in the movie, the bottom shot is pink tinted.

LexX said:

You_Too said:

I don't know about ESB and ROTJ, but I can tell you that in any version of SW the colors are inconsistent, and they've been confirmed to have been like that on some original prints as well.

But is the GOUT inconsistent because the film originally was or is it because it is GOUT?

It says here http://savestarwars.com/filmpreservation.html the original 1970s film stocks were unstable. Mike Verta talks about element damage here http://originaltrilogy.com/forum/topic.cfm/Color-correcting-the-Blu-Rays/post/548757/#TopicPost548757

and said on his forum that the colour seperations are missing elements.

So the original prints from the negative would be more consistent and then its been degrading organically since then. There might be a consitent linear pattern to a print fade (e.g. it gets pink, more pink, very pink, red) but it would be linear relative to the start and subsequent conditions being identical. If theres 4 different stocks within the film the fade couldnt fade in linear way across the whole film but only on the individual stock in linear conditions?

An ambitious person could start a thread and try to post up screengrabs of a still from every version of the film available and try and track fade patterns - however specific versions would have additional variations added in by the settings the transfer was done through and additional colour corrections added in (to either reverse colour loss/or for aesthetic reasons).

This is my understanding of the subject to date anyway.

My speculative idea is that the GOUT print is from the same source as the Technidisc print thats been through a cleaning solution (?) or printed on a different stock? which stabilizes the excess colour fluctuations-saturations of the Technidisc but the GOUT has not been colour corrected. The Technidisc has not been colour corrected. The special editions and the widescreen editions immediately prior to Technidisc seem all to have been tinted blue to dye-down the pink/red (not the JSC which I think is also not corrected). The special editions also have additional scene by scene corrections? This is all speculative and would welcome correction on this.

AntcuFaalb said:

 

Thanks for the information.

Do you know if anything was changed for the 1982 LaserDisc release? Does that release have any specific problems (besides being fullscreen)?

I should say anything I write is not based on years of reserch but quick appraisals/ speculative ideas /guessing. My subjective impression is the Starkiller 1982 Laserdisc preservation is the least red/pink shift effected commercial version I've seen. But it seems to have a yellow/green shift sometimes (in parts of the Cantina scene for example). But it doesnt have much information/bit depth and has been tweaked to fit the old style tv displays over-brightened etc. To me the highest up the chain of unfaded sources would be the Technicolor Screening stills/clips, the blu-ray deleted scenes, The pre-anh bootleg telecine, and the catnap 16mm (although the last two would have more layers of distortion because of how they were captured).

Again this is just my impression