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The Prequel Radical Redux Ideas Thread — Page 242

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No! No saber at all! Was it you, Bingowings, that made the case for there being no need for Yoda to be an action hero by comparing his type of Jedi to Shaolin Monks and the other kind of Jedi to Shaolin Knights? I thought that was a perfect comparison that summed up how these prequels ought to have been handled in the first place.

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brash_stryker said:

No! No saber at all! Was it you, Bingowings, that made the case for there being no need for Yoda to be an action hero by comparing his type of Jedi to Shaolin Monks and the other kind of Jedi to Shaolin Knights? I thought that was a perfect comparison that summed up how these prequels ought to have been handled in the first place.

 

I've been lurking here for a long time, but finally made an account....

I agreed 100% on Yoda being saber-less .... not to mention it makes the perfect world scenario of replacing CG yoda with a Puppet that looks like ESB/ROTJ Yoda easier to pull off....

 

and while were on that topic.... radical for me would be replacing a ton of the CG characters with costumes.. Gungans would be 100Xs better if they were in well done rubber suits, if Jabba were to remain I'd love to see one that looks like ROTJ Jabba... maybe an entirely revamped Watto/Sebulba (either puppets or costumes)... etc....

to me the CGI in many cases is way too "fake" looking.... it stands out and doesn't seem to blend with the real actors in far too many situations.  I know this would be incredibly hard to pull off in a fan edit, but I can dream I guess....

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Greetings everyone.

Just would like to put my 2 cents/republic credits to this discussion:

Unlike the Original Trilogy (OT) edits which were more focused on fixing technical issues & minor flaws without changing the plot/characters/scenes, edits done to the Prequel Trilogy (PT), as shown in many fan-edits, requires massive changes to either or a combination of scene arrangement, dialogue, deleted scenes, plot/storyline and characters.

If Adywan or other fan-editors who plan to work on the PT edits then perhaps these elements could be given more emphasis.

 

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brash_stryker said:

No! No saber at all! Was it you, Bingowings, that made the case for there being no need for Yoda to be an action hero by comparing his type of Jedi to Shaolin Monks and the other kind of Jedi to Shaolin Knights? I thought that was a perfect comparison that summed up how these prequels ought to have been handled in the first place.

I've always thought that Yoda and Palpatine were above the need for laser blades.

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The problem with Yoda using a lightsaber isn't the lightsaber, it's the intense physical effort that he's exerting. Flipping around without a weapon is just as unnecessary.

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ideally i'd love to see yoda removed from the PT, and reduced to just persistent mentioning to build up his revelation in ESB. BUT for the casual fanedit that would need to include him, perhaps it would be more in character to have him not even journey to geonosis, and likely flee to dagobah before the duels ever take place in ROTS.

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It's just a silly idea all round.

Without doing all that flipping how would he do all this out of character swordplay?

I suppose he could cut you from the waist down which doesn't sound very sporting.

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Personally I think Lucas & Co. messed up the whole Prequel Yoda approach. According to the timeline (20-30 years before ANH), Yoda would have been 800+ years old.

If it was a 400 or 500 year old Yoda then his saber antics would probably be tolerable. But at 800+ years, you'd think he would have mellowed and focused on the wisdom & philosophy of the Force (as he did in ESB).

Probably the same would apply to Palpatine/Sidious. Being the Sith Lord that he is, it would have been more believable if his use of lightsaber was reduced & just focused on using the Darkside to manipulate the events that unfolded throughout the PT.

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what I would like to see in Yoda is the removal of his walking stick! and then tone down some of the leaping about, reserve it for near misses when fighting Dooku & Sidious, that way the leapfrog nonsense is at least “SLIGHTLY” more plausible! Then when Yoda falls have him hit the deck hard with a cracking sound therefore damaging his hip and having him need the walking stick, that way at least he looks like he lost the fight and didn’t just run like a pansy assed chicken as he does in the original!

 

what do you think Bingo, would this be doable?

Bingowings said: Do you want to see the project finished as a playable film or a flick book?

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It's doable but it's still not desirable to me.

My ideal set up would be to remove Yoda from the PT and only have him mentioned with awe (thus preserving the surprise in ESB).

But if he is kept I'd cut every use of a blade and rework the material so he uses the Force alone.

I could almost be tempted to allow Palpatine his saber (the Death Stars are basically giant Sith lightsabers).

It diminishes his dignity a bit seeing him fight like that but I guess seeing as only the Mace fight would remain and he is setting the guy (and Anakin) up for a fall it could remain but adjusted as seen in a few recent attempts to not be farcical.

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Is there any way to fix Ian McDiarmid’s over the top mouth movements?? have it so he sneers like he did in ‘Jedi’ as opposed to the over the top O shape he has, the "No NO, YOU will die!!!” bit especially???

 

Bingowings said: Do you want to see the project finished as a playable film or a flick book?

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I just registered because I had some thoughts on reworking TPM. Some (if not all) are probably repeats, but I thought I might share anyway. I am very tempted to get into the game and try and make an edit myself. 

First of all, I would rework the whole narrative to have the Tatooine sequence first. The scroll would establish that the Queen is on the run from the Trade Federation, with two Jedi protectors. Padme wouldn't be a handmaiden or even the Queen, but would just be someone in the Queen's party. She accompanies Qui-Gon to Mos Espa with no argument about it. Jar Jar is established beforehand in a reworked scene with Padme cleaning Artoo (implying Artoo is her personal droid, thus why he accompanies them to Mos Epsa). The Gungan/Nubian dynamic is established then.

During this sequence, we would be introduced to the Trade Federation through watching them initiate the invasion of Naboo. Sio Bibble would be portrayed as the main Naboo character on the ground. Sidious would appear somewhere in here, not sure where, but done after Maul's first appearance on Tatooine.

Anakin won't really be the hero (or even much of a main character) in my edit, much to chagrin of some people around here I think. Most of his Tatooine exploits will remain the same, with the addition of the Greedo scene before they leave. Maul's first appearance, and the first appearance of the Sith, would be his arrival on Tatooine.

Once they leave Tatooine, they'll head to Coruscant, where Anakin is given to the Council for testing. Anakin will only show up in the testing scene later on, which would be intercut somewhere in the later Naboo sequences before the battle is underway, the funeral of Qui-Gon, and the final scene with Obi-Wan. Palpatine would already be played as being the Chancellor, since the Senate sequence would be cut due to Padme not being the Queen. His inability to get things done would lead Padme and the Queen to go back to Naboo to fight. The Nubian senator would not be relevant in this edit, although it could be assumed it is Valorum since he appears in the first Coruscant sequence.

Instead of the Nubian's asking the Gungan's to help them, when Jar Jar speaks about them not giving up without a fight and being warriors, it'd cut to the Gungan's marching to war. Jar Jar would obviously be cut out of this conflict as he wouldn't be there (nor would he show up until the ending sequences either). Padme and the Queen's struggle now comes to get to the throne room and force the Viceroy to surrender and stop the droid army. The space battle would be cut entirely.

Since the Control ship isn't being destroyed, the Jedi slip into the control ship, with the idea of getting to the bridge, using the first sequences of the film. However, they encounter Maul, and their duel takes place on the control ship. 

Once Padme forces the Viceroy to surrender, the droids are shut off, the Gungan's celebrate, while the Maul/Kenobi duel finishes up. Yoda informs Obi-Wan that Anakin will be trained (he will not be rejected in this edit), but informs of his misgivings. 

 

The idea for this came from my thought that Naboo should not be visited twice in this movie by the Heroes. Once they leave a location, they shouldn't return in that movie. Everything else flowed from there. Just thought I would throw the idea out there and see what others thought. Feel free to co-opt anything you find good.

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Alot of those ideas have been mentioned before, but its good to see them brought up again for discussion! Avoiding too much naboo is important.

I wonder how it would work if the jedi were on tatooine already to retrieve anakin. anakin sort of blackmails them into helping the naboo in exchange for him joining the jedi.

What if Qui-Gon dies on tatooine at the hands of maul, leaving obi-wan to avenge him later on.

Perhaps if it were an extensive edit, with extra filmed elements, the queen could actually be a princess, and there could be an old king added to naboo to be the face of the suffering people. Maybe he dies too in the end. An alternative ending could be the padme's coronation.

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Anybody else feel that we shouldn't have met Yoda until Empire? I would rather have seen a story that didn't involve the Jedi council and focused more on the lower ranks. This would keep up the mystique of what they do and how they do it. We could hear talk of the powerful Jedi master Yoda which would build a false image of who and what he is in the audiences minds and then still be a surprise when he is revealed in Empire.

But I guess mystique isn't at all what George was going for. After all, these are the same movies that explain the force as bacteria in your blood...

Ray’s Lounge
Biggs in ANH edit idea
ROTJ opening edit idea

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That's what he should have done.

It doesn't even make 'toy sense'.

If they had another alien Jedi Master sitting there they could have sold a different action figure.

Kids who know Yoda could imagine him in adventures during the PT using the OT action figures insuring that they had to collect them all.

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If we ignore the deleted scene from the SE, Jabba is repeatedly only mentioned by name in the OT, only to be revealed in ROTJ. That clearly worked, and worked well. So the same logic could be applied to Yoda.

If we think about what Yoda's character represents aswell in ESB, his presence doesn't make any sense in the PT as he is.

I wonder how much could be added to the PT through additional characters, subplots and dubbing? Introducing a few tricks like Dooku wearing a mask until a big reveal in AOTC could allow more shots of him to be added. Also if we consider ROTJ to need some additional treatment, then maybe some added PT subplots could manifest in ROTJ 30 years later (with reoccurring sub-characters, locations etc)

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ChaosLane86 said:

I just registered because I had some thoughts on reworking TPM. Some (if not all) are probably repeats, but I thought I might share anyway. I am very tempted to get into the game and try and make an edit myself. 

First of all, I would rework the whole narrative to have the Tatooine sequence first. The scroll would establish that the Queen is on the run from the Trade Federation, with two Jedi protectors. Padme wouldn't be a handmaiden or even the Queen, but would just be someone in the Queen's party. She accompanies Qui-Gon to Mos Espa with no argument about it. Jar Jar is established beforehand in a reworked scene with Padme cleaning Artoo (implying Artoo is her personal droid, thus why he accompanies them to Mos Epsa). The Gungan/Nubian dynamic is established then.

During this sequence, we would be introduced to the Trade Federation through watching them initiate the invasion of Naboo. Sio Bibble would be portrayed as the main Naboo character on the ground. Sidious would appear somewhere in here, not sure where, but done after Maul's first appearance on Tatooine.

Anakin won't really be the hero (or even much of a main character) in my edit, much to chagrin of some people around here I think. Most of his Tatooine exploits will remain the same, with the addition of the Greedo scene before they leave. Maul's first appearance, and the first appearance of the Sith, would be his arrival on Tatooine.

Once they leave Tatooine, they'll head to Coruscant, where Anakin is given to the Council for testing. Anakin will only show up in the testing scene later on, which would be intercut somewhere in the later Naboo sequences before the battle is underway, the funeral of Qui-Gon, and the final scene with Obi-Wan. Palpatine would already be played as being the Chancellor, since the Senate sequence would be cut due to Padme not being the Queen. His inability to get things done would lead Padme and the Queen to go back to Naboo to fight. The Nubian senator would not be relevant in this edit, although it could be assumed it is Valorum since he appears in the first Coruscant sequence.

Instead of the Nubian's asking the Gungan's to help them, when Jar Jar speaks about them not giving up without a fight and being warriors, it'd cut to the Gungan's marching to war. Jar Jar would obviously be cut out of this conflict as he wouldn't be there (nor would he show up until the ending sequences either). Padme and the Queen's struggle now comes to get to the throne room and force the Viceroy to surrender and stop the droid army. The space battle would be cut entirely.

Since the Control ship isn't being destroyed, the Jedi slip into the control ship, with the idea of getting to the bridge, using the first sequences of the film. However, they encounter Maul, and their duel takes place on the control ship. 

Once Padme forces the Viceroy to surrender, the droids are shut off, the Gungan's celebrate, while the Maul/Kenobi duel finishes up. Yoda informs Obi-Wan that Anakin will be trained (he will not be rejected in this edit), but informs of his misgivings. 

 

The idea for this came from my thought that Naboo should not be visited twice in this movie by the Heroes. Once they leave a location, they shouldn't return in that movie. Everything else flowed from there. Just thought I would throw the idea out there and see what others thought. Feel free to co-opt anything you find good.

Get out of my head, dang it. You're ideas are very similar to something I've been attempting.

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Greetings,

Just to share a thought & get your ideas. Maybe it could be used in future fan-edits. This one is regarding Palpatine/Sidious' appearance.

Ever since watching ROTS it always bugged me that Palpatine's deformed face in the OT was the result of his own Force Lightning deflected off Mace's lightsaber.

Might have been more interesting if his face had always been deformed like that (probably due to his strong practice of the Dark Side). But through the use of the Dark Side of the Force he was able to manipulate how others saw him (i.e cloud their vision. After all, he used manipulation throughout the PT).

Of course the tricky part for a fan-edit is 'how to reveal his deformed face?' One idea (if technologically possible), is that he 'reveals' his true face after he says "I AM the Senate.." when Mace comes to arrest him. This would add the element of surprise to his attack, catching the Jedi off guard (Dark Lord of the Sith or not, the Jedis died too easily in that scene).

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"Of course the tricky part for a fan-edit is 'how to reveal his deformed face?' One idea (if technologically possible), is that he 'reveals' his true face after he says "I AM the Senate.." when Mace comes to arrest him. This would add the element of surprise to his attack, catching the Jedi off guard (Dark Lord of the Sith or not, the Jedis died too easily in that scene)."

 

LOVE that idea.Very cool.

I guess maybe it could be achieved through some morphing type special effect?

But then how would the remainder of the scene play out? Would that only be a momentary reveal or would the evil face be there throughout the battle and Anakin's turn?

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My preferred TPM order has long been on record.

Have the Naboo invasion happen while the queen is on Coruscant.

Have her attempt to return to take back her planet.

Have her ship attacked and have to stop off on Tattooine.

Progress to Naboo and with the aid of Anakin rescue the situation.

The going back and forth never made sense to me.

The original trilogy worked better and each episode had the heroes traveling in one direction, forward.

The main character should be the Queen.

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"LOVE that idea.Very cool.

I guess maybe it could be achieved through some morphing type special effect?

But then how would the remainder of the scene play out? Would that only be a momentary reveal or would the evil face be there throughout the battle and Anakin's turn?"

 

Thanks for the response. The reveal could go either way:

1.The momentary reveal would be a cool way to catch the Jedi off guard as he attacks them. The Force lightning part of the Mace-Sidious duel would still need to be removed. Once Mace has been killed, Sidious reverts back to his true evil/deformed face as he talks to Anakin.

2. His evil face could remain from then on since his true identity has already been discovered. The Force lightning part of the  Mace-Sidious duel would be removed as well. (The problem would be to maintain his evil face throughout the duel).

Later Sidious could then manipulate the Senate (again) by lying that his deformed face was the result of a Jedi attack.

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http://vimeo.com/44219864

I posted this idea awhile back, but I thought I'd make a proof-of-concept mockup.
This is just an idea, so the video is awfully edited, but I think it gets the point across.

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aalenfae said:

http://vimeo.com/44219864

I posted this idea awhile back, but I thought I'd make a proof-of-concept mockup.
This is just an idea, so the video is awfully edited, but I think it gets the point across.

Impressive, what you did there!  It really works well.  Tweek the dialogue a little and there you go.  Definitely adds depth to Grievous's character.

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I agree with those ideas. Would be good to find a shocked look for Obi when Grevious says , "Syfodios"... He still has the cocky look on his face when realization should be there. Great idea though.

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I also think the Jedi die to easily. Well maybe I don't mind that Palps could dispatch them so quickly, but it didn't look good on screen. One Idea I have had, was to remove the Sith Lightning from the Dooku Scenes so that we haven't seen any Sith Lightning in the series yet. Then when Palpatine leaps from his chair, I would add swirling Sith Lightening that attacks the Jedi and holds them frozen while he cuts them down, with only Mace being able to hold it off.