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Collaborative Fanediting: An ROTJ Proposition (BACK ON TRACK WITH EMANSWFAN AT THE HELM--SEE POST 1488 OR OP FOR A LINK!) — Page 20

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fishmanlee said:

Here are all my score videos in one post:

The Iron Door: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoYbpEyY-Y8&feature=channel_video_title

Bounty for a Wookiee (SE Version) NEWER: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ek2YLVnzgwQ&feature=channel_video_title

Sail Barge Assault Alternate NEWEST: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSIG6oSCmJY&feature=related

Ben and Luke on Log NEW: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USlGlb_D9DM&feature=channel_video_title

Father and Son: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8eCuzn5q5U&feature=related

The Lightsaber: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_K8HL0psC8&feature=channel_video_title

Leia Breaks The News Alternate: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLidns6SSMM&feature=related

 Okay, I lied.  One more post.  Thanks for including this.  I'll have to check it all out once again and compare.  This is really great.  I updated the first post to include your links here.

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darth_ender said:

When seeing the Star Destroyers from a distance (i.e. "It's a trap" or "I wonder what those Star Destroyers are waiting for."), it would be good to see a few smaller ships dotting the fleet.  This of course would require only a still shot from the front and digitally inserted in a few places.

Let me tell you that I am grateful we have you on our team.  You have a super star destroyer?!  That's awesome too.  We've been discussing enhancing the Executor's death so it is more dramatic, a la...

Would you be willing to upload some pics of your models for us?  It might give us an idea of how close we can get in our special effects.  Thanks for your contributions thus far, and if you don't mind, I'd like to add you to our list of involved team members in the first post.

I'll try to sort out the models I have over the next few days and give a definitive list.  I've also been looking over the Victory class ship and have a few ideas about that so I will try to mock something up over the next week and depending on how that goes I'll be able to give you a more definite answer regarding a time frame. 

Most of the changes you have suggested here would be fairly static shots so I think I can probably help there and if some of the motion shots involve fairly straight movement at a reasonable speed this might also be able to be done with moving photos rather than motion footage.  At the very least it will be fun to give it a try. 

If we have a good image for the surface of the death star I think I can use my super star destroyer model to create the shot of it falling toward the death star, and I've had an idea for creating a half exploded version so maybe we could show the Executor breaking up a little more slowly as it hits the surface?  I'll see how I get on.  Oh and I would be honoured to be listed as part of the team. 

darth_ender said:

This is an interesting combo of Ronster's and timdiggerm's ideas.  Of all the ideas we've given serious thought to, I imagine this would be the hardest sort to pull off.  It's interesting and both ideas were very close in the votes and should be discussed further.  I still worry most about how hard some of these things would be to pull off, but if it simply involves editing existing footage from other films to the point where it's not too obvious, I'd have to defer to the special effects team on how doable it is.  It looks interesting, as did both Ronster's and timdiggerm's ideas.

Well if people don't mind me building on their ideas a little more, and taking a bit of a liberty with the Bothans (basically using the name and ignoring everything the EU added to it), I would like to try to improve this mock up a little.  I'll post another video at some point when I have added something worth showing. 

As for the assignment, I'll try to have some progress photos for new models up by the 15th, but exactly how much progress will depend on how much free time I have outside of work. 

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 (Edited)

Wow... I feel like I'm coming out of a Carbonite sleep lol

 

Sorry for my lateness to this party but I was brought attention to this project by a friend of mine who said you needed some composers.

 

If I may, I'd like to volunteer my efforts to that front and also to sound design/editing. I've worked on a fan film for Jurassic Park and actually have been DYING to work on a fan film of Star Wars and this is may as well be that heh...

 

I have a pretty extensive library of Star Wars SFX and if you're interested in hearing some of my Jurassic Park compositions, you can hear them here:

 

http://youtu.be/1QM6x1xy4ps

http://youtu.be/BkC_anDP5T0

 

I'm also familiar with video editing as I had produced a re-edit of the finale to Episode III (starting with Obi-Wan speaking to Padme through to the credits). Unfortunately, I had to remove the videos but perhaps you've seen them? 

 

I could try reupping them too if you'd like.

 

I'm also extremely familiar with the scores to the OT including ROTJ which is one of my favourites. I recreated an almost completely clean Lapti Nek (film version). So that may help lol

 

Anyway, I'd like to help if I can :-)


Is it not sad that in this time, we are more surprised by acts of love than acts of hate?
-Me

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You are extremely welcome!  I wish I could give a lengthier intro, but at the moment I'm a tad busy.  I will give you a more formal welcome today or tomorrow.  For now just know that we are very pleased to have you :)

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Goodmusician maybe is the most valuable asset to the audio and music so far!

I wish TheCutter was be able to join us part time ;)


-Angel

–>Artwork<–**

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Wow...thank you Angel lol

 

I'm also pretty fast with things and can mix in 5.1 so however I'm needed lol


Is it not sad that in this time, we are more surprised by acts of love than acts of hate?
-Me

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GM is a great asset to have aboard.  He's just as talented and creative as ABC and a bit less neurotic. 

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So GoodMusician, we are tremendously pleased, and I assume fishmanlee had something to do with your coming (thanks, fish).  Since music composition usually comes along later in a film but we don't wish to waste your time or lose your interest, it might be nice to see what you can offer.  I like your Jurassic Park clips very much and can see you can go the distance, you're gonna fly now, and you've got the eye of the tiger :)

So one thing we voted on recently was incorporating the Death Star theme into the film more extensively, as it served as the Imperial March of ANH.  We voted specifically to include in Vader's arrival in the beginning, though you ultimately are the music expert.  I picture a slightly lengthier arrival scene combining the intimidating DS music with Imperial March, either interweaving the two motifs, or more likely using DS music first as the shuttle slowly approaches, followed by the March when it's actually coming into the hangar.  Since we aren't anywhere near completing our version of the scene, I was wondering if you might be interested in simply creating a sample version that could easily be modified for inclusion when the scene is completed.

This is all up to you of course, because you are ultimately the decision-maker.  However, I know I've got high hopes for such a music choice, and we all know you've got your own life.  It's simply a request to see how workable it is.  Perhaps we could see your work in action on ROTJ and give feedback.  Just a thought, but perhaps you prefer to use your own methods.  Let us know :)

 

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A thought for Johannus: since our opening will be using the Executor in place of the Imperial Star Destroyer when Vader arrives, it occurred to me we may have a use for both your Lambda shuttle and Super Star Destroyer models.  It may be easiest to just reuse the shuttle footage while compositing the bigger destroyer, but since we want to make the approach take a bit longer, your model may come in handy.  Just early thoughts.  But of utmost importance if going with an actual model, how much close scrutiny could it handle?  Could it be used in a scene like this?  Or do you think it's better just for the distance shots?  No worries if it can't get that close, as that's pretty detailed.  Just asking.

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darth_ender said:

A thought for Johannus: since our opening will be using the Executor in place of the Imperial Star Destroyer when Vader arrives, it occurred to me we may have a use for both your Lambda shuttle and Super Star Destroyer models.  It may be easiest to just reuse the shuttle footage while compositing the bigger destroyer, but since we want to make the approach take a bit longer, your model may come in handy.  Just early thoughts.  But of utmost importance if going with an actual model, how much close scrutiny could it handle?  Could it be used in a scene like this?  Or do you think it's better just for the distance shots?  No worries if it can't get that close, as that's pretty detailed.  Just asking.

I think we might be able to get away with a scene like that if we were going for a youtube quality video, but I think if our aim was DVD or even BluRay quality it would really show the weakness of using a smaller scale model.  The only thing that might work would be to film the model for the reference angles, then try to overlay some sort of detail we create in photoshop or something.  If someone made a surface texture in photoshop, then I know After Effects has an option to put 3D pieces on top of video so we could sort of make the triangular texture piece 3D and line up the edges, if that makes sense.  That way it would be more detailed but still with its limitations.  I think for a shot like that you would need a larger scale model, a 3d model, or my smaller model and a lot of touching up afterwards to add more details. 

An idea I remember reading before was changing the shuttle used by Han and co to get to Endor to the wider version that looks more like a cargo shuttle.  I have been planning to make one of those for some time so if people like that idea I could find the piece I started a while back and see what I can do there.

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The great thing about that opening sequence is that there is a lot of room for changes. Vader's Theme is only used to showcase his presence, but the rest is almost just filler based on the intervals of the theme ie: lots of places to play with the music or what have you heh

 

I may have to give it a try heh


Is it not sad that in this time, we are more surprised by acts of love than acts of hate?
-Me

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^I'm looking forward to your work, GoodMusician, and I'm glad you find the idea a worthy one.

@Johannus, I don't know what would be easiest, so I would let the effects team decide that sort of thing I guess.  I know Jaitea is skilled with Photoshop, so I don't if he'd be willing to touch up an existing model in motion or not.  We can ask him.

As for the shuttle, I suspect you are thinking of this picture from the wishlist (item 14):

Personally I like the idea.  The same shuttle was used in ANH:SE (not the best picture but the first that I found):

You can see it taking off briefly in the upper midleft.

I think it'd be a nice addition and is a nice distinction from the regular Lambda shuttle used by Vader and the Emperor already.  What does everyone else think?

Here's the Wookieepedia article.  My greatest concern now having read this is size and fitting it into the hangar.  There's no truly definitive size (as is truly the case for any Star Wars ship, since they abound in inconsistencies on screen).  I think it can be done, though, if anyone else likes the idea and you're willing to put forth the effort.  I'm sure it would be filmed quite a bit more than any other models we ask of you, as we already know what shots it would be used for, and may even have additional shots for it.

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Something to relate to the team for now...a big announcement/proposal really.

Someone recently suggested to me via PM that we create a sort of sub-team.  This would consist of the folks most heavily involved in special effects.  The hope is that we could set up a chat function for this sub-team specifically wherein they could discuss concepts more fluidly and not have to take up actual forum here discussing the more technical aspects of making our edit.  There would be a level of privacy for them in order to avoid extraneous ideas.  In other words, the idea folks could suggest ideas here (that includes me) while the actual movie-makers discuss the how-to there.  My big worry is that if we incorporate this element, some team members will feel left out.  The best way to handle this would probably be to have me (since I have thus far been the coordinator and recruiter of this project) sort of act as a liaison between the two groups to make sure everyone here is up to speed.  Of course the other guys would share what they are making, post vids and stills and ideas and such.  They would still take our feedback.  But I would in a sense bring announcements on progress to you and bring your ideas to them if they are being negligent of the forum here.  Also, if there are grievances that the idea/story folks are feeling left in the dark, I would bring such complaints to their attention and request updates.  This is the best compromise I can think of and it hopefully wouldn't be too time-consuming for me.  The hope is to create greater efficiency among those making everyone's dream become a reality.

What do you all think of this?  If we go for it, this would be my suggested sub-team

Aalenfae (3D modeling, compositing, other special effects)
Angel (2D, matting, lighting, compositing, other special effects)
Jaitea (image enhancement?, touch up?, texturing?)
GoodMusician (music composition, possible sound editing?)
Johannus (physical models, filming models in action)
emanswfan (deleted scene restoration)

If others are interested, they can certainly be considered.  I hope we easily gain a general consensus, but if necessary, it may require a vote.  This is in many ways like the democratic Republic known as the USA.  There is a general population with a will, but we elect representatives to bring the public will to fruition.  However I understand if there is concern, so please express your thoughts.

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Speaking of the wishlist, here are some images/ideas that I would really like to see implemented if possible. Am I alone here?

http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/545/nazimonitor.jpg

http://public.sn2.livefilestore.com/y1pjeAzVKMdslAa9lqCMeQdYb8Mfwz9TBc8nh_UsL7K6crKsDZxssKaqIjxH0ZpYce5mkOyYrRcOqeOyhsEJSWHYQ/Eye%20droid%202.jpg

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/5971/armeat.jpg

http://i620.photobucket.com/albums/tt285/nDuTwan/EndorRebeledit.jpg

http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a115/doubleofive/ROTJ%20Wishlist/Vaderios/roughshit.jpg

 

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Final comment for today.  I was pondering Endor and its planet.  The novel says the planet blew up long ago.  This would mean it's technically no longer a moon, but rather a planet, though it could keep the moon title for nostalgic reasons I suppose.  But at this point in Ewoks: The Caravan of Courage, you can see a large celestial body clearly hanging there in the sky:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0928R-MZ1ZI&t=0m25s

And interestingly I noticed this celestial body at the opening of ROTJ.

Now this is very close in the real universe, but in Star Wars it might not be true.  Potentially this could be the planet (albeit much further than shown in the Ewoks film).  I guess I'm just wondering who wants to include the planet?  I think it'd be fun to have.  Just thinking aloud.

Insane, I like 'em all.  I hope we can include something like them.  They'd be amazing.

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Also, I was thinking about songs that might replace Lapti Nek/Jedi Rocks. While listening to the Comple Score for The Phantom Menace, I came across a track that I don't remember hearing in the film, called "The Street Singer." But I think that it has the potential to work well inside Jabba's Palace. It's not really a "gangster club showtune" like Lapti Nek and Jedi Rocks were intended to be, but instead it's very alien and sinister. Thoughts?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4OhTTKrd5c&feature=youtu.be

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darth_ender said:

As for the shuttle, I suspect you are thinking of this picture from the wishlist (item 14)

Yeah thats the one.  I think it would work well because it means its similar but not identical to the other shuttle so its not like everyone is suddenly using the same type of ship.  Also it looks like it holds more and thus far the other shuttle has been seen as a ship for transporting important individuals rather than a load of supplies. I'm guessing this sort of idea will go into the next vote but if people like it I would gladly try to make a model for this.  I'm just going to photograph what I already have so you can have an idea so I will upload that shortly.

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Interesting tune.  I don't know if it could necessarily replace either song because even if we cut down the scene (something I favor), it still is a tense moment where Oola meets the Rancor and needs something to better capture the mood.  Nevertheless, I feel it would fit quite well when the droids first approach Jabba (or maybe on the sail barge, but I prefer the former).  It creates a sinister mood so we better feel like the droids are entering a dangerous place.  Before it tended to feel a little silly, but this ominous music creates a creepy feel quite well and sets up a scarier Jabba, I think.

Okay, really, the last comment for today, or at least for a while.

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darth_ender said:

Interesting tune.  I don't know if it could necessarily replace either song because even if we cut down the scene (something I favor), it still is a tense moment where Oola meets the Rancor and needs something to better capture the mood.  Nevertheless, I feel it would fit quite well when the droids first approach Jabba (or maybe on the sail barge, but I prefer the former).  It creates a sinister mood so we better feel like the droids are entering a dangerous place.  Before it tended to feel a little silly, but this ominous music creates a creepy feel quite well and sets up a scarier Jabba, I think.

Okay, really, the last comment for today, or at least for a while.

I agree, this would work great as an introduction for Jabba IMO....

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MrInsaneA said:

darth_ender said:

Interesting tune.  I don't know if it could necessarily replace either song because even if we cut down the scene (something I favor), it still is a tense moment where Oola meets the Rancor and needs something to better capture the mood.  Nevertheless, I feel it would fit quite well when the droids first approach Jabba (or maybe on the sail barge, but I prefer the former).  It creates a sinister mood so we better feel like the droids are entering a dangerous place.  Before it tended to feel a little silly, but this ominous music creates a creepy feel quite well and sets up a scarier Jabba, I think.

Okay, really, the last comment for today, or at least for a while.

I agree, this would work great as an introduction for Jabba IMO....

+1

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Right as promised here are some photos of the models I already have. 

1 - Super Star Destroyers (the larger measures 180mm long)

2 - Interdictor

3 -Star Destroyer

4 - Assault Frigate

5 - Rebel Transports

6 - Death Star 2 (if you look carefully you can see the top and bottom do not allign perfectly, its quite a disappointing model)

7 -Nebulon B Frigate

8 - Home One (I think)

9 - Viscount (I think) (170mm long)

10 - Mon Calamari Cruiser (I think)

11 - Tantive

12 - Y wings

13 - Tie Interceptor

14 - Tie Bomber

15 - B wing

16 - Naboo Fighter

17 - A wing

18 - Shuttle Tydirium

19 - X wing

These are all larger models so can potentially be made much more detailed, but none are finished so if it was decided we wanted more shots of any of these I could bring them up to scratch.  The Rebel transport is 240mm long and the cargo shuttle is 145mm long. 

These are a selection of others I have, again they are quite small but who knows some might be useful. 

This is a close up of some of the fighters, because they are smaller the detail is not as good and in some cases the plastic bends so again these probably wouldn't be useful as anything other than placements in shots.  (Except the B Wing which isn't too bad). 

This photo is just a quick close up on some areas of the super star destroyer model.  Hopefully it will give you ideas of the limitations of these models.  Although the detailing is good for a model of this size, and it could be improved even more by repainting it, the closer we zoom in, the more noticable it is that it isn't going to match the existing close up shots. 

Anyway I hope this gives you some ideas and in the meantime I will be making a start on the Victory class ship.  

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darth_ender said:

Something to relate to the team for now...a big announcement/proposal really.

Someone recently suggested to me via PM that we create a sort of sub-team.  This would consist of the folks most heavily involved in special effects.  The hope is that we could set up a chat function for this sub-team specifically wherein they could discuss concepts more fluidly and not have to take up actual forum here discussing the more technical aspects of making our edit.  There would be a level of privacy for them in order to avoid extraneous ideas.  In other words, the idea folks could suggest ideas here (that includes me) while the actual movie-makers discuss the how-to there.  My big worry is that if we incorporate this element, some team members will feel left out.  The best way to handle this would probably be to have me (since I have thus far been the coordinator and recruiter of this project) sort of act as a liaison between the two groups to make sure everyone here is up to speed.  Of course the other guys would share what they are making, post vids and stills and ideas and such.  They would still take our feedback.  But I would in a sense bring announcements on progress to you and bring your ideas to them if they are being negligent of the forum here.  Also, if there are grievances that the idea/story folks are feeling left in the dark, I would bring such complaints to their attention and request updates.  This is the best compromise I can think of and it hopefully wouldn't be too time-consuming for me.  The hope is to create greater efficiency among those making everyone's dream become a reality.

+1


-Angel

–>Artwork<–**

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 (Edited)

+1

I'd be in for that, once this kicks off and visual ideas start bouncing around, i'll see what I can come up with.

Like the idea of the Death Star motif resurfacing, GoodMusician sounds more than capable

J

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Still an idea and not at all filmed, Jaitea, but judging by the 7 inch Executor pics above, are you able to enhance it to a point where it would be more detailed in motion, resembling the original star destroyer flyover in the ROTJ opening?  I'm just trying to gauge how much CGI we will ultimately have to use, as I imagine asking aalenfae to create so many realistic 3D CGI models is really a big request.

Johannus, those models look great!  You are of course right that they will not be as useful as studio models, but I think we can use them for mostly distance shots, and perhaps enhance any closeups we'd have to do.  Of the starfighters, the various TIEs look good, as does the B-wing, the Millennium Falcon, and perhaps others.  We could use them in distant shots at least.  The Sentinel-class shuttle looks like it could serve our needs when in motion (probably relying on a modification to the matte in the Home One hangar).  The Mon Cal cruisers would be helpful, but definitely for very distant shots.

It also occurs to me that if someone can think of some way to keep Fett alive and kill him later, possibly in the space battle in some sort of dogfight with Lando, that could be fun and we could try to use the Slave I model.

As you said, if nothing else, these can provide placement.  And if we are truly fortunate, we can even use them as the basic model so it only requires touching up to give them the level of realism they need.

MrInsaneA and everyone, I hope you are noting and collecting all your ideas for a second round of voting.  I don't know how soon I'll hold it, but I doubt I'll wait long.  I really do like that very alien sounding song you mentioned, MrInsaneA.

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Jaitea said:

Like the idea of the Death Star motif resurfacing, GoodMusician sounds more than capable

When this idea was brought up? what motive?What will be the change?


-Angel

–>Artwork<–**