All right, I just watched the first six of your videos. Some nice ideas! A lot of them probably wouldn’t be possible because it leaves the end result choppy and harsh. I had a hard time with some edits, even giving up on them because it couldn’t be done without sticking out like a sore thumb. I’d like to comment on some of the changes you made, and get some insight from you about your logic behind them. I may need to go back and do an updated version to incorporate these ideas!
(In the following reactions, I ask some questions and can seem harsh. I only want to know your thoughts behind each edit, that’s all. Also, once or twice I refer to Kerr’s book cuts. Have you seen them too? If not, check ‘em out!)
You removed most of the “racism” toward men, both on the part of the opening narration and from Elrond. I like this.
You removed Sauron smacking soldiers around, and made Isildur look more competent by not having Sauron step on Narsil. These are both good ideas, and something I’d want to play with and make sure it can be done smoothly.
You removed two instances of a Hobbit picking his ear. Good idea, as long as it can be done fluidly.
You cut Frodo telling Gandalf that he’s late, but left his reply. Is Gandalf just supposed to know what he’s thinking? It also leaves a jump cut mid-shot.
You removed Bilbo musing that “there’s always been a Baggins under the hill…” Why was this?
You removed Frodo telling Gandalf that he’s been labelled “a disturber of the peace.” Why? I’d say that’s a pretty accurate statement.
You removed Gandalf’s ‘forthcoming’ firework display for the kids, yet left in the laughter. This makes it look like he’s just a mean old man, and isn’t a good idea. We would have to cut the whole bit, kids and all, if we were to remove the forthcoming fireworks. I don’t think it’s a big deal anyway; in the book the narrator can just tell us that he does fireworks, but in the movie we see them shortly. No biggie, but it’s one of those things that I would edit out if it can be done totally smoothly. It’s a purist change to make, but one of no consequence.
You removed Gandalf’s head bump, which I had done in a previous version of Sharkey’s edit. I put it back in because I liked it, so I could go either way on this one. You also snipped Bilbo talking with his mouth full, which is a good idea.
You removed two instances of Sam and Rosie: you cut Frodo getting Sam to dance with her, as well as Sam’s defense of her as they leave the pub later. Why is this? I know it isn’t in the book, but it helps set up their relationship at the very end. It’s nice to be able to think back to these things and remember that we’ve “met” this girl before, and it’s not like Sam just picks a person that we’ve never seen. I’d say leave these bits in.
You trimmed part of Bilbo’s troll story and I can’t figure out why.
You removed Merry and Pippin jacking with the fireworks, which I had tried many times to do but could not without it looking choppy and/or removing the “big” firework. I will try to take your order of editing and see if it can be done nicely. On second thought, it might just be worth it even if we have to lose the big firework altogether.
You cut Gandalf peering down at the ring at Bilbo’s door and the “flash” of the eye of Sauron. The problem with that is that it is what launches Gandalf into his deep thought and hurrying off to research it. For that reason I suggest it stay, because, though it is a purist change to make, it messes up the film’s logical progression. And it’s not a big deal anyway.
You cut the Nazgul departing Barad-dur. This allows the viewer to learn about this stuff from Gandalf and Saruman telling us in later dialogue. However, the music transition may not work well. Plus, it’s not a purist change to make. So I’m not sure about this edit.
I noticed that you re-ordered part of the scroll of Isildur for some reason, also removing the incorrect year. I’d leave the year there for pacing reasons. Please explain why you moved parts of Isildur’s scroll around, as I’m sure there’s a reason that I just don’t realize.
I do like that you had the Black Rider say, “Baggins” only, and not “Shire.” It makes it seem like he knows what he’s asking, rather than just being a mindless zombie running around yelling, “Brains!”
You trimmed Saruman taking a shot at Gandalf for enjoying Hobbit weed. This makes sense, since it turns out that Saruman had a love of the leaf as well. However, I always appreciated the line as a hypocritical thing for him to say. I say leave this line in, because it makes him look like a hypocrite, and I believe this is in on purpose.
(Here’s a clip from Unfinished Tales: Yet in truth Saruman's spying and great secrecy [concerning the Shire - H-I] had not in the beginning any evil purpose, but was no more than a folly born of pride. Small matters, unworthy it would seem to be reported, may yet prove of great moment ere the end. Now truth to tell, observing Gandalf's love of the herb that he called "pipe-weed" (for which, he said, if for nothing else, the Little People should be honoured), Saruman had affected to scoff at it, but in private he made trial of it, and soon began to use it; and for tins reason the Shire remained important to him. Yet he dreaded lest this should be discovered, and his own mockery turned against him, so that he would be laughed at for imitating Gandalf, and scorned for doing so by stealth. This then was the reason for his great secrecy in all his dealings with the Shire even from the first before any shadow of doubt had fallen upon it, and it was little guarded, free for those who wished to enter. For this reason also Saruman ceased to go thither in person; for it came to his knowledge that he had not been all unobserved by the keen-eyed Halflings, and some, seeing the figure as it were of an old man clad in grey or russet stealing through the woods or passing through the dusk, had mistaken him for Gandalf.)
I like that you removed some of the “The nine? OMG Frodo!” because it is old news to the audience.
I agree that the wizard fight should be removed, and I dislike Merry and Pippin’s somewhat silly meeting with Frodo and Sam. However, jump-cutting away from both of them leaves problems of both pacing and logic. Where did they pick up Merry and Pippin? I would prefer to shorten the wizard fight, but I was even unable to do this without problem. Sorry, but I don’t think this good idea is doable.
You shortened the tension with their first encounter with a Rider, which I thought was too short. The Rider gets down, sniffs, and then just flies away.
You cut Merry’s line “That rider was looking for something or someone.” Why? Just to lessen their role? It’s not a big deal, but I could see cutting it if it can be done smoothly.
You cut two sections of “scarey” people in Bree, a philosophical choice I agree with. The “scarey” walk to Bree is safely cut, and can be done just fine. Kerr was able to edit out the scarey faces as Frodo slips into thought before Pippin calls him out at being a Baggins. So I know it can be done, and I like it.
You removed the silliness around Pippin wanting to get a pint, which I agree if it can be done smoothly. However, removing too much of Merry and Pippin can have the adverse effect of making them seem useless and for sucking too much of the life out of the film. I remember when a friend of mine agreed to watch Sharkey’s edit with me, he asked me “Did you remove a lot of the humor from the film?” I told him I had kept most of it.
Why did you remove Strider’s line, “Are you frightened? Not nearly frightened enough!”? I liked that one.
Haha, I like your idea to make it look like the gatekeeper let the Nazgul into Bree. I laughed out loud at the ingenuity. I’m not so sure it can be done believably, but I’d be in favor of it if it could. This is another example of a purist change to make, but doesn’t have any consequence.
You removed Aragorn describing the Nazgul as having been blinded by greed, another great way to remove the subtle hints at the larger theme of men being weak.
You removed Pippin’s concern about not having all his meals, which I feel is too humorous and characterizing to cut. I’d cut some of their other antics, but not this one.
You removed the Lay of Lúthien! Why? Even if (though I wouldn’t want to) we totally removed almost all of the Arwen love story, it’s okay to hear the Lay of Lúthien, as we do in the book anyway. It could still be a subtle insight into the woman he does eventually marry, even if the viewer doesn’t spend much time with her.
You removed Aragorn telling the hobbits to stay put while he looks around. This is subtle, but it removes some hobbit condescension. Bravo on this one!
I like how you were able to make the hobbits’ fire look merely like a fire, and not have Frodo freak out over it. I’d still want to play with it but I think this one is doable.
You removed the next cut to Gandalf entirely, removing the viewer seeing orcs equipping for war. You also removed Gandalf’s later conversation with Elrond about what he saw. I can understand cutting one or the other, but not both. It’s good to see Saruman equipping for war, especially since I already removed his efforts being directly ordered by Sauron. This way he is more of his own entity in this fight.
You had an interesting idea with the flood, editing in some of Elrond’s voice. I see the logic, but I don’t think it could be done convincingly. The only thing I could see would be to just cut Arwen’s chanting and let the floods come on their own and let us wonder why.
I’d love to find a better way to transition between Frodo passing out and Frodo waking up. I’m not sure a jump cut is the answer, but it’s about as good as what’s there already.
I like the idea of removing some of Saruman’s temptations for Gandalf to join with Sauron, again because it makes it more like he’s an independent player. As long as it can be done smoothly.
I agree with your decision to edit out the scene in Rivendell where Sam and Frodo seem to think they’re done with the ring and can just go home. By this point Frodo had known for a while that he was going to have to take the ring to Mordor.
I’d be okay with removing most of Gandalf and Elrond’s conversation, since it makes it look like Elrond doesn’t care about Middle Earth. I think we’d need to include a little of it just so that it can smoothly transition to the council of Elrond.
Because we lose that conversation, baking Elrond’s flashback to Isildur into the Council of Elrond makes sense and could probably be done smoothly enough.
I understand your reasons for shifting parts of the Council around, but it leaves pacing problems.
You cut Gimli’s attempt at destroying the ring, which is all right. I’d do this as long as I can see that it is smooth. We do loose a visual lesson about how the ring can be destroyed, but we already get an additional mention of the only way to destroy it in this scene due to the flashback of Isildur.
I know it’s a deviation from the book, but I can’t see cutting the shouting match at the Council. Having Frodo bolt up and volunteer causes continuity and pacing problems.
I would not mind cutting Merry and Pippin’s silliness, but I’m not sure I can without problems of music and such.