twooffour said:
Can we just pin this down to the core?
"Opinion":
1. A factual statement not sufficiently supported by evidence and/or logic. OR:
2. A statement about a subjective mental state. Often dressed as a claim about the external world (i.e. this sunset IS beautiful), but what really happens is that the person's BRAIN finds it beautiful.
One word, two completely different meanings.
Same in German and Russian.
So how can we agree on that, please? Or would you argue that?
But they aren't really two completely different meanings (and I am not sure why you keep mentioning the German and Russian words, I am trilingual myself, but the English meaning is all that matters here).
The meaning from the 2nd grade text book "Fact or Opinion" chart used the definition: "a personal belief or judgment that is not founded on proof or certainty"
My beloved Oxford English Dictionary words it like this in a single definition (no second or third definition like your dictionary, rather it lists those as examples): "a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge"
Let's contrast those with your two definitions: "a factual statement not sufficiently supported by evidence and/or logic" and
"a statement about a subjective mental state. Often dressed as a claim about the external world."
Your two definitions are saying the EXACT same thing as The Oxford English Dictionary and "Fact and Opinion" chart.
F & O Chart: "not founded on proof or certainty"
Oxford: "not necessarily based on fact of knowledge"
Twofour's Dic: "factual statement not sufficiently supported by evidence and/or logic"
All three of these are saying the same thing, the statement may be factual, but there isn't sufficient evidence to support it (thus it isn't founded on proof or certainty, or in other words, it isn't necessarily based on fact or knowledge). Or in your second definition it is a "subjective mental state", which again is saying nothing contrary to or different from "a personal belief or judgment that is not founded on proof or certainty" or "a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge"
All three sources give the word "opinion" the exact same meaning, yours just does it in twice as many words. Both your definitions are encompassed under the single definition from the first two sources.
The only other meaning of the word "opinion" would be in the sense of "legal opinion" or "medical opinion" etc., but you never claimed those meanings as your reason for being so confused about what meaning of the word we were trying to use.