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When did you realize the Prequels sucked? — Page 5

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I remember the exact moment that I realized the prequels sucked. I was watching 'Attack of the Clones' in the cinema and was completely bored during that opening chase scene, and then when that morphing lady got shot with a needle and the lady's face morphs into something really fake. At that point I wondered why the effects looked faker than the original films. After that point I was fairly annoyed at the rest of the film, and my annoyed-ness increased as the film went on.

 

 

Another thing which irritates me about the prequels is how everything looks even more advanced than the original films. I personally would have the technology in the prequels be clunky-er and cruder than the original films, Robots like R2 wouldn't appear until perhaps the third film. Also the prequels be complete Retro-fests as if they were made in the 40s, 50s and 60s.

(Episode one/1946) Anakin is 18/19, Obi is 20/21

(Episode Two/1951) Anakin is 24/25, Obi is 26/27

(Episode Three/1966) Vader is 49/51, Obi is 51/53

(Star Wars/1977) Vader is 60/62, Obi is 62/64

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That's actually a great idea!

Maybe someone should do an edit of TPM which replaces all the CGI with the type of special effects there were in 1946!

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The easiest thing for anyone to do is to pretend that the entire Prequel mess is simply an alternate Star Wars Universe.

If Marvel and DC can do it all the time, why not?

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That what I do all the time. Of course, I go the multiverse route with almost everything I watch/read/etc. Parallel worlds are just too much fun =D

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twooffour said:

but I somehow hadn't thought of the fact that TPM doesn't have any decent main character, which is a main contributing factor while it's so... "flat".

I never liked that argument of his.

I don't think a movie needs a single "main character" to be considered good. There are a lot of good movies with multiple "main characters;" The Seven Samurai springs immediately to mind, and even the OT has something of an ensemble cast.

I just think the failing with TPM was that they tried and failed to pull it off; none of the characters are well-defined enough to warrant an ensemble cast, and that makes it seem like it's a movie full of secondary characters that's missing a main character. They tried to introduce far too many new characters at once and therefore couldn't spend enough time with each one (within 133 minutes) to develop them.

It's also a problem because the content of TPM is more suited to be exposition for later movies than a whole movie itself. I'd have made AOTC the first movie and put some kind of explanation points in it that told the basic outline of the important points of TPM; like how Obi-Wan met Anakin, how Anakin came to be a Jedi, how Anakin met Padme, and all that good stuff.

So we'd have AOTC as the first film (starting with the beginning of the Clone Wars, not ending with it) to establish the Republic hero that Anakin was, then we'd have Episode II to deal with Anakin's eventual corruption and fall to the dark side (at the end, giving it that dark unsure nature that made ESB good), and then ROTS could deal with Anakin's transformation into Darth Vader, Padme's death, Order 66, the Jedi Purge (showing just how far Anakin had fallen), the Fall of the Republic, the Rise of the Empire, and the formation of the Rebel Alliance (at the end, leading into ANH).

But that's just me.

Keep Circulating the Tapes.

END OF LINE

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@Tyrphanax:

I totally agree with your outline of the PT, as I always thought it should have started in Episode II.

I think the first scene of Episode I should have been Obiwan/Anakin on the elevator talking about that adventure where Anakin saves him.  In fact all through Episode I they should have been friends, so the damn audience can actually like the character of Anakin!

The idea of having 2 actors play Anakin 10 years apart was a bad decision by Lucas, because youre asking the audience to like 2 different actors, and it is jarring at the beginning of Episode as you get used to an older Anakin.  What makes ESB so great is that all the characters are there from Star Wars, the audience doesnt need any introductions, and the movie can get right into the plot.

As for Episode II, Lucas should have had Palpatine play on Anakin the whole movie and then he turns at the end of the movie, or some type of cliffhanger that makes you wonder if he turns.

Then ALL of Episode III can be a 2+ hour movie of the last hour of ROTS that is on screen now, as it wouldn't seem like a connect the dots movie as it is now.

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Yep. Good points there, CO.

Keep Circulating the Tapes.

END OF LINE

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Ziggy Stardust said:

That's actually a great idea!

Thanks!

Maybe someone should do an edit of TPM which replaces all the CGI with the type of special effects there were in 1946!

I meant in terms of style. Everything would be stylised to look like the film was made in 1946 (Hair, clothes, technology i.e. buttons and switches and valves, lighting.) but the special effects would be done with models, a la the original films.

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CO said:

The idea of having 2 actors play Anakin 10 years apart was a bad decision by Lucas, because youre asking the audience to like 2 different actors, and it is jarring at the beginning of Episode as you get used to an older Anakin.

LOL, that reminds me, I've once seen some EU book cover, or something like that, with some face morph picture on it, of Anakin between I and II. He looks like both of them :D

Hehe, CG can make any child-adult transition believable ;)

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Oh God...

whoever made this picture



FUCK YOU! :D

Ruined forevah...

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Tyrphanax said:

twooffour said:

but I somehow hadn't thought of the fact that TPM doesn't have any decent main character, which is a main contributing factor while it's so... "flat".

I never liked that argument of his.

I don't think a movie needs a single "main character" to be considered good. There are a lot of good movies with multiple "main characters;" The Seven Samurai springs immediately to mind, and even the OT has something of an ensemble cast.

I just think the failing with TPM was that they tried and failed to pull it off; none of the characters are well-defined enough to warrant an ensemble cast, and that makes it seem like it's a movie full of secondary characters that's missing a main character.

That was actually his point ;)

A lot of people seem to misunderstand that part. There is NO MAIN CHARACTER. Not MANY MAIN CHARACTERS.

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The prequels were supposed to be about Obi-Wan, and how his hubris brought about the Fall of the Republic and the deaths of his brothers in arms.

Instead they were about a whiny sissy-boy who was tricked into turning evil and then just embraced it for no apparent reason.

Fuuuuuuuuuuuuck.

“It is only through interaction, through decision and choice, through confrontation, physical or mental, that the Force can grow within you.”
-Kreia, Jedi Master and Sith Lord

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theprequelsrule said:

The prequels were supposed to be about Obi-Wan, and how his hubris brought about the Fall of the Republic and the deaths of his brothers in arms.

Instead they were about a whiny sissy-boy who was tricked into turning evil and then just embraced it for no apparent reason.

Fuuuuuuuuuuuuck.

*facepalm*

I know what you mean

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greenpenguino said:

Maybe someone should do an edit of TPM which replaces all the CGI with the type of special effects there were in 1946!

I meant in terms of style. Everything would be stylised to look like the film was made in 1946 (Hair, clothes, technology i.e. buttons and switches and valves, lighting.) but the special effects would be done with models, a la the original films.

That's what I meant.

How long do you think it would take to do an edit like that?

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Ziggy Stardust said:

greenpenguino said:

Maybe someone should do an edit of TPM which replaces all the CGI with the type of special effects there were in 1946!

I meant in terms of style. Everything would be stylised to look like the film was made in 1946 (Hair, clothes, technology i.e. buttons and switches and valves, lighting.) but the special effects would be done with models, a la the original films.

That's what I meant.

How long do you think it would take to do an edit like that?

depends...

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twooffour said:

I've once seen some EU book cover, or something like that, with some face morph picture on it, of Anakin between I and II. He looks like both of them :D

This one?

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KILL IT WITH FIRE!!!

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DuracellEnergizer said:

twooffour said:

I've once seen some EU book cover, or something like that, with some face morph picture on it, of Anakin between I and II. He looks like both of them :D

This one?

Hehe, yea, although I think the one I remember was him standing with a lightsaber, and somewhat more recognizeable as Lloyd. But it was a long time ago :)

Thanks!

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Ziggy Stardust said:

....On what?

"On how good your manners are. On how good your.....pocket-book is..... he he he..."

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-Episode I - Not a terrible film but horribly mediocre compared to the rest of the films.  The fact that it's related to Star Wars gives it a few extra points.  It's still better IMO than a lot of other crap.

-Episode II - Some parts of this movie I really like while others fall completely flat.  The Phantom Editor's version of this redeems the film almost entirely for me.  I wish the scenes at Padme's parents house had stayed in.  Also, no matter what anybody says, I like Yoda's lightsaber duel.  The Yoda we see in Empire has spent 20 years in alone in a bog contemplating everything that went wrong so he's going to be at least a little different.

-Episode III - Good overall but suffer's severely from dragging on way to long in places.  The whole opening, the duel, the expedition to stop Grievous...pointless filler.  A few cheesy lines still but not a enough to ruin the experience for me.  I liked the Yoda/Sidious duel, however, I feel it should have maybe taken place earlier in the movie so that it wouldn't interrupt the Anakin/Obi-Wan duel.  Maybe Yoda attacking him could have been part of the catalyst for Palpatine to accuse the Jedi of treason or something.

-And I still say that watching the prequels and knowing the story makes Return of the Jedi a much better film once you know more about Vader and Palpatine.

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Darth Bizarro said:

And I still say that watching the prequels and knowing the story makes Return of the Jedi a much better film once you know more about Vader and Palpatine.


From a certain point of view. Always, always, from a certain point of view ;-)

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See, I disagree because Return of the Jedi ISN'T about Vader, again, despite what Lucas would have you think.  It's about Luke and his internal struggles.  His desire to bring his father back to the good side.  Because of that, it's what we know about Luke that's important.  We don't really need to know about Vader or the Emperor beyond what we get in ROTJ to understand their relationship, and, more importantly, Luke's relationship to both of them.  In earlier drafts, Lucas did have more backstory and more scenes with Vader and the Emperor, but those were ultimately jettisoned because it needed to be more about Luke, and because those scenes tore down Vader as a villain and made him too sympathetic.  If we know too much about Vader, and he's made sympathetic, then whether or not he will become good becomes a non-issue.  Luke doesn't know for sure; therefore, we don't need to know until the moment that he does.

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Gaffer Tape said:

See, I disagree because Return of the Jedi ISN'T about Vader, again, despite what Lucas would have you think.  It's about Luke and his internal struggles.  His desire to bring his father back to the good side.  Because of that, it's what we know about Luke that's important.  We don't really need to know about Vader or the Emperor beyond what we get in ROTJ to understand their relationship, and, more importantly, Luke's relationship to both of them.  In earlier drafts, Lucas did have more backstory and more scenes with Vader and the Emperor, but those were ultimately jettisoned because it needed to be more about Luke, and because those scenes tore down Vader as a villain and made him too sympathetic.  If we know too much about Vader, and he's made sympathetic, then whether or not he will become good becomes a non-issue.  Luke doesn't know for sure; therefore, we don't need to know until the moment that he does.

I'd add that the OT already adds too much confusion as it is.

In ROTJ, it appears as though the Emperor has Vader completely enslaved and on his knees with a dead spirit.
"You have no idea how strong the dark side is; I must, must obey my master" sounds either like he'd be horribly tortured if he stepped out of line, or as though he had no will of his own, basically being "compelled" and "addicted" to obeying the Emperor no matter what.
Or maybe the Emperor would threaten to use some Force thing to draw all emotion out of Vader and cast him into wailing and despair?

Vader's "awakening" at the end seems so much more significant, and brave, in that context.

However, not long ago, in the previous movie, Vader was all talking big about overtaking the Emperor with Luke's help.
So there, he takes out the Emperor, why is he now suddenly good?



Then comes ROTS, and what we're basically told, is that Anakin simply sticks to Palpatine, because he thinks this is the right way to go for the galaxy, or because, well, he's done a lot of crap and now he's just stuck with him. Maybe grows more cynical over time.
Maybe needs someone to fill the void left by Padme, har har har.

Or maybe he feels gratitude for Palpy for restoring his limbs, and/or at least trying to help him with Padme's death?
So after all those years of badassery, he's still completely duped?

So that's just the final nail in the coffin.

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DuracellEnergizer said:

 

Darth Bizarro said:

And I still say that watching the prequels and knowing the story makes Return of the Jedi a much better film once you know more about Vader and Palpatine.


From a certain point of view. Always, always, from a certain point of view ;-)

 

Cue the song Obi!

"George, we hate you for making more Star Wars movies.  Please make more Star Wars movies."

-The Internet