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lol at "lit up first."
Someone want to post that Yoda smoking pic again?
“It’s a lot of fun… it’s a lot of fun to watch Star Wars.” – Bill Moyers
STAR WARS: EP IV 2004 REVISITED ADYWAN *1080p HD VERSION NOW IN PRODUCTION — Page 366
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Very cool to hear what Ady might alter in ANH:R:R. The proposed changes vary in their importance for me, but I think all will improve an already superb edit.
I know Ady's not entertaining suggestions, but I just wanted to put this out there for discussion...
I was always surprised Ady never ended up changing R2 in the background of the Millennium Falcon reveal shot. Specifically, R2 can be seen descending the stairs of Docking Bay 94 with our heroes, but is only about halfway down when the camera pans right to reveal the Falcon. Then R2 waddles into frame only seconds later, something that wouldn't be possible given how slowly he was moving.
Given that Ady altered a similar shot just moments before this one (i.e., where he recoloured R2 red to seem like a different droid and placed a new R2 element in the foreground to maintain continuity as the camera pans right before entering Docking Bay 94), I always found it curious that he didn't modify the subsequent shot which exhibits a similar continuity error.
Just curious if anyone else A) ever noticed this and/or B) cared :)
BTW: thanks to 005 and Ady for saving me the trouble of grabbing these screen caps myself.
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I'm kind of hoping that Red R2 goes away...
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doubleofive said:
I'm kind of hoping that Red R2 goes away...
Really? I profess that, upon first viewing, I noticed the red R2 unit but wasn't sure if it was a change or if it had always been there. I assumed the former, but the fact I wasn't sure, to me, indicated it must've been a good tweak.
I wonder if it'd be possible to track the original R2's movement and superimpose a different droid head on him (a là R5 or perhaps the cone-headed droid being marched down the hallway on the Tantive IV).
“It’s a lot of fun… it’s a lot of fun to watch Star Wars.” – Bill Moyers
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The problem was brought up years ago, but I ignored it then. The problem is that the shot is framed with the characters in center, but now its framed with the characters and some random droid who happens to be next to 3PO and going their direction. Maybe if the droid could be removed altogether, but I'm fine with the droid switches they had to do on set, especially since Ady didn't fix the one in the next shot.corellian77 said:
doubleofive said:
I'm kind of hoping that Red R2 goes away...
Really? I profess that, upon first viewing, I noticed the red R2 unit but wasn't sure if it was a change or if it had always been there. I assumed the former, but the fact I wasn't sure, to me, indicated it must've been a good tweak.
I wonder if it'd be possible to track the original R2's movement and superimpose a different droid head on him (a là R5 or perhaps the cone-headed droid being marched down the hallway on the Tantive IV).
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doubleofive said:
I brought this up with Adywan a while ago and he is considering it. He made Obi-wan light up first because he did in Episode III, but I pointed out that I think Luke failed at the cave in ESB because he lit up first.topdawg193 said:
Those proposed changes were among my few nit-picks with the original release as well, so I'm happy to hear that they may be getting addressed. My only other suggestion would be to restore Obi-Wan's and Vader's confrontation aboard the Death Star, such that Vader's sabre is already lit when Obi-Wan meets him. In Revisited, Obi-Wan is the first to ignite his sabre, and I always thought that that had a significant (and unwelcome) narrative effect; it appears that Obi-Wan is not acting defensively, but rather offensively, which seems to go against both his and, later in Empire, Yoda's instructions about using the Force for knowledge and defence, never for attack. And likewise, by being aggressive and very much on the hunt for Obi-Wan here, it seems more in keeping with Vader's character and motivation to have him make the first move, as it were.
I've had a lot of time to think about this whole scene since then and it will be staying the way it is now in the HD version. I've heard it so many times that having Obi-wan igniting first changes it from the "defensive" point of view to "the attacker", but this is not the case. Obi-Wan was never being defensive. So many have failed to notice one thing about the duel: Obi-Wan is the one that attacks Vader first and is not, as many state, taking the defensive stance. Vader doesn't even make a move before Obi-Wan lunges at him.
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adywan said:
I've had a lot of time to think about this whole scene since then and it will be staying the way it is now in the HD version. I've heard it so many times that having Obi-wan igniting first changes it from the "defensive" point of view to "the attacker", but this is not the case. Obi-Wan was never being defensive. So many have failed to notice one thing about the duel: Obi-Wan is the one that attacks Vader first and is not, as many state, taking the defensive stance. Vader doesn't even make a move before Obi-Wan lunges at him.
For me it was never about who attacked first, I always just really enjoyed the visual of vader at the end of the hallway with his saber lit....waiting. It just always looked so badass. But I can definitely live with it being changed if its coming with all the other improvements that you've made
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Fair enough. Maybe Vader just wanted to talk and Obi-wan just comes up and hits him? ;-)adywan said:
So many have failed to notice one thing about the duel: Obi-Wan is the one that attacks Vader first and is not, as many state, taking the defensive stance. Vader doesn't even make a move before Obi-Wan lunges at him.
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To be honest, that red R2 is pretty distracting. I understand that it fixes a continuity issue, but it really draws the eye and attention towards it, because it's such a familiar character and yet.... not. It's very distracting.
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When I first saw the scene I thought "Why is R2 red?" and then noticed that there were two. So yeah, I agree.
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I didn't have a problem with the red droid, we see so many similarly placed droids in the saga but if it is possible to go for a more radical head change (like the almost totally white one seen in the street as the speeder comes into town) it would put more focus on the star at the front of the pack.
The original body looked different from the conventional Artoo anyway.
I think the reason why some people saw the red droid as still Artoo (but red) was through familiarity with the original shot rather than the framing.
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The white panels could darkened. That could make a big difference.
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The dark panels are the thing that made the unit in shot different from the conventional Artoo in the first place.
To make that unit look really different would take something like making the some of the coloured panels the same colour as the dome and/or vice versa.
Red and Blue both being primary colours register in the mind in a similar way so as a pattern they still look Artooish, if the pattern was broken up more it would look less Artooish eg.
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^ That does look better. I think it benefits from the duller color also. It pops out less.
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I agree, but I think I'd still prefer to see a different droid altogether, now thats its been brought up
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Breaking the pattern up is probably a more important factor.
I was having a meal a The Picturehouse in Edinburgh the other month and the walls were decorated by some really nice silk screen prints representing classic films, all original work by the same artist (I wish I got some now).
For ANH she had chosen Artoo as the iconic image and it was very minimalist but by just blocking in the blue in the right place she captured the image.
It was a small print but you could see what it was from a long distance away.
As Star Wars fans the pattern of Artoo's panels are so etched in out minds that just changing the colour isn't enough, especially when we have seen the film so many times that we expect to see him in that position even though it makes no sense and the bottom of the body is different anyway.
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what got me though is that the only other time you see a large number of droids SHAPED like R2 is on the death Star......the tatooine ones all look older and clunkier....so I definitely would prefer to see one more akin to all the other outdated ones as opposed to one that looks like a differently color schemed R2
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topdawg193 said:
Those proposed changes were among my few nit-picks with the original release as well, so I'm happy to hear that they may be getting addressed. My only other suggestion would be to restore Obi-Wan's and Vader's confrontation aboard the Death Star, such that Vader's sabre is already lit when Obi-Wan meets him. In Revisited, Obi-Wan is the first to ignite his sabre, and I always thought that that had a significant (and unwelcome) narrative effect; it appears that Obi-Wan is not acting defensively, but rather offensively, which seems to go against both his and, later in Empire, Yoda's instructions about using the Force for knowledge and defence, never for attack. And likewise, by being aggressive and very much on the hunt for Obi-Wan here, it seems more in keeping with Vader's character and motivation to have him make the first move, as it were.
Hmmm...I never thought about that.
But my fifth and final nitpick did have to do with the duel.
I was surprised when Ady reversed Vader's last two lines. I always liked "You should not have come back" being the last thing Vader ever says to Obi-Wan. It is cooler, more sinister.
Ady reversed this with the line,"Your powers are weak, old man."
I have to say that I liked it the way it was originally.
“Anakin had those qualities so rarely seen, exuding an unmistakable confidence and yet still able to touch one’s heart in simply knowing how he was so flawed… wounded.”
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Hmm... based on the preceding comments, it would seem Ady's decision not to solicit any other suggestions was a smart move after all :) I guess, at the end of the day, ANH:R will satisfy 99% of everyone's expectations, with only a minor thing here or there each individual wishes were different. I'd say that's a pretty amazing achievement.
“It’s a lot of fun… it’s a lot of fun to watch Star Wars.” – Bill Moyers
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TV's Frink said:
lol at "lit up first."
Someone want to post that Yoda smoking pic again?
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corellian77 said:
Hmm... based on the preceding comments, it would seem Ady's decision not to solicit any other suggestions was a smart move after all :) I guess, at the end of the day, ANH:R will satisfy 99% of everyone's expectations, with only a minor thing here or there each individual wishes were different. I'd say that's a pretty amazing achievement.
Agree 100%.
Perfectly stated.
“Anakin had those qualities so rarely seen, exuding an unmistakable confidence and yet still able to touch one’s heart in simply knowing how he was so flawed… wounded.”
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Darth Hade said:
corellian77 said:
Hmm... based on the preceding comments, it would seem Ady's decision not to solicit any other suggestions was a smart move after all :) I guess, at the end of the day, ANH:R will satisfy 99% of everyone's expectations, with only a minor thing here or there each individual wishes were different. I'd say that's a pretty amazing achievement.
Agree 100%.
Perfectly stated.
Which would suggest that Star Wars fans all want (more or less) the same things. And Ady seems to have his finger on that pulse (though I DO know that he's making these for himself when all is said and done)
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muddyknees2000 said:
adywan said:
I've had a lot of time to think about this whole scene since then and it will be staying the way it is now in the HD version. I've heard it so many times that having Obi-wan igniting first changes it from the "defensive" point of view to "the attacker", but this is not the case. Obi-Wan was never being defensive. So many have failed to notice one thing about the duel: Obi-Wan is the one that attacks Vader first and is not, as many state, taking the defensive stance. Vader doesn't even make a move before Obi-Wan lunges at him.
For me it was never about who attacked first, I always just really enjoyed the visual of vader at the end of the hallway with his saber lit....waiting. It just always looked so badass. But I can definitely live with it being changed if its coming with all the other improvements that you've made
Couldn't have said it better myself: Darth standing there with light saber already drawn, waiting, is far more arresting than Obi-Wan drawing first. For me, the sense of foreboding it conveys is the natural prelude to Obi-Wan's corporeal demise. I've always interpreted Obi-Wan's last words to Luke in the Death Star comm room - about their destinies lying on different paths - as effectively acknowledging that his was a suicide mission to ensure that Luke and the others could escape.
For that reason, I think a little something is lost when Obi-Wan draws first. Having said that, whether or not Obi-Wan makes the first move in his confrontation with Vader doesn't alter the nature of his actions; one could even argue that if Obi-Wan attacks first, it is precisely because he has accepted his fate and has chosen to meet it without fear or hesitation. To me, the analogy with Luke's failure in the cave doesn't hold water.
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Speaking of the Obi-wan/Vader duel, I know you're not taking suggestions ady, but you might want to enlist the help of this guy for some ideas and maybe even a few extra shots ;)
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Joke?
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