Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side (the TM edit) (Released) — Page 95

MTHaslett said:

"The mock-up was originally for a coda to Episode One."

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For when, after Qui Gonn's funeral?

After Yoda tells Obi Wan to teach Anakin?

After the victory march on Naboo?

I never thought of Ep 1 as needing yet another coda.

Well, yes if you just tacked it on to the end of the film as it stands.

I'd merge the celebrations into the Obi-Wan permission scene (cutting out the photo moment tableau at the end and continuing the muted crowd noise in the background)

So there's a parade and afterwards Yoda and Obi-Wan have a chat (they are on the steps of the palace so it makes sense that at some point they go up the steps and inside).

Then I'd have the funeral with Dooku hanging around outside like Banquo's ghost.

Then then the actual coda.

The other sequences would then be scenes proper instead of just an epilogue.

Sticking it in Episode One and only getting a brief mention in Episode Two creates anticipation for the character (like mentioning or briefly seeing Jabba and the Emperor in ANH and ESB).

I mention it only to describe the context for that mock up as originally devised, obviously anyone can do whatever they want with the idea.

I agree!

That's the moment for the audience to twig who this guy really is and why he has been bumping off Jedi left right and centre.

You could even work into the Dooku being still a Jedi idea and have Maul fan the confusion from his side of the divide (with Sidpatine pulling the strings on the Republican side).

Not exactly working together but working towards a common goal.

It may be possible to pull off there were some nice mock-ups of Dooku standing on a hill looking down at the cremation from a distance.

Having him appear as a hologram during the council meeting may also be doable.

I had the notion that Palpatine had organised events like the Naboo invasion all around the galaxy and the people duped into performing them would end up being the original Separatists (because nobody in the Republic trusted them any more).

So he could be off world when the bulk of what happening in Episode One goes on investigating other disturbances only to come back and find his former student slain because the council wouldn't mount a proper investigation. 

As for the coda all you'd need is a shot of a bacta tank in a lab and a reveal to the torso bubbling away (Resident Evil style).

When we see Kamino in Episode Two we know where it was but don't know the connection.

Blacking out the face in Palpatine's cape would create the impression that maybe Dooku was the other Sith (you could even make it so Maul and Sidious are never refered to by name or seen together at the same time so he could even be seen as the Master) taking the heat of Palpatine for the first time viewer (Lucas really screwed up there).

MTHaslett said:

I guess the reason I always wanted to set it up for the audience before the opening of episode 3, was to improve the impact of a lot of Grievous' wheezy/coward behaviour. If I knew that was Maul, I'd think "he's doing pretty good for a dead man" instead of "who is this new, awkward character and why can't he be more bad-ass?"

The suggested way for Obi Wan to learn the Maul/Grievous connection is for Grievous' eyes to be shaded most of the movie and then revealed as Maul's when he and Obi Wan finally face off in close-ups. It's a very good spot because it's directed as the moment when "it gets personal"... except that there really isn't anything personal about it. This story change is, in part, to help add the element that would have made that fight totally work.

That works for me.

It would be interesting to see if we could tweak the situation of Obi-wan blasting Grevi-maul and toss away the weapon so his "How primitive" line refers to Maul or the fact that Maul was only after revenge or something.  But this is a discussion for another time.

I mentioned earlier how Maul is could be in pretty good shape (aside from being cut in half) the last time we saw him.  How does he end up from a cup topper

to cyborg road-kill?

I am thinking about the possibility of modifying the chute.  They are in the power plant, after all.  Maybe there could be lots of electrical bolts and currents down there.

EDIT: Episode 2 is 10 years later than Episode 1.  Work on a cybernetic Maul needs to be done in Episode 1's time frame.  Unless they had Maul's body in some kind of Bacta-stasis the whole time. 

If I had my way the fight would be happening on a Federation cruiser and the chute would lead directly to an escape pod (if you know which tube route to wiggle to).

mrbenja0618 said:

Sluggo said:

*raises hand*

I gotsta question.  If we coda the Grevious/Maul bit in Episode 2, would it lose anything for the audience when Obi-wan finds out in Epidose 3?

And more importantly, how does he realize?

I've thought about this a lot (which I shouldn't really be doing as I'm still working on Episode 2) but I think it would be amazing if Obi Wan realises it's Maul in the closeup of Grevous' eyes where he originally says "you must realise you are doomed" (redubbing Grevious and replace the eyes with Maul's)

Of course, ignoring the complexities of replacing the eyes in motion throughout the film,  if you leave the scene with Obi Wan meeting him on the bridge (which 'TheCutter' has excised in his recent edit) it seems a bit implausible that he won't have recognised the eyes sooner.

It could be really creepy like Maximilian Schell's eyes appearing inside Maximilian(the robot)'s body at the end of The Black Hole.

I gotta agree with this.  It is great that the Shroud is back up.

The walk-by I was talking about is simply not working.... But I may have another idea.

Let me ask this question.... If we go through with this Maul/Grevious idea, would it be acceptable that maybe Maul received new eyes resulting in the eyes he has as the general? Maybe his old eyes no longer function due to the fall?

In my search for inspiration I found this.....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHmWciSRWjI

Wonder if he would want to shoot some new scenes. =)

mrbenja0618 said:

The walk-by I was talking about is simply not working.... But I may have another idea.

Let me ask this question.... If we go through with this Maul/Grevious idea, would it be acceptable that maybe Maul received new eyes resulting in the eyes he has as the general? Maybe his old eyes no longer function due to the fall?

It seems we need some type of connection between Maul and Grevious to bridge the gap.  The eyes always seemed to be the best (or easiest) way to do this. 

Nothing about this will be easy I'm afraid......

I'm trying to figure out how to make this work, but also work in a storytelling sense... And hopefully meet Trooperman's approval...

But, I won't show off anything until I think it looks ok.

New thought....  I thought I read someone say that they thought it would be interesting if Maul were to fall into something energy-based.... something hot.

What if Maul was scorched? Much like Anakin would be later.... What if we took small snipits of Anakin being constructed into vader, and give the guys some charred horns... His tattoo would be burned off, we could be more subtle about it I think... Motion tracking horns may not be too difficult... And then maybe we could give Grevious Maul's voice... General Grevious to me was supposed to be a precursor to Vader anyway, why would it be so hard to have it look similar.. We could change the mood with some mild color correction..... This may be stupid, because I'm not sure a scene like this even belongs in ep. 2...  Thoughts?

I'm starting to really like the idea of Maul=Grievous, and for the reveal to be given at the end of Dooku's meeting with Sidious on Coruscant Ep II...But for the bacta tank to just be off to the side of the hangar seems a bit strange; to me it'd make sense for this new Sith weapon to be constructed in the same room Vader was created. It could go something like this: (Sidious' lair, Coruscant) "I have good news for you, my lord. War has begun." "Excellent...." Cut to darkened operation room. Door opens to reveal the silhouetted figures of Dooku and Sidious striding toward the camera to gaze up, their faces lit by an eerie glow. "....Everything is going as planned." Shift to their view to see medical droids surrounding the half completed General...at this point, it'd be nice to hear what seems to be Maul's leitmotif in TPM, the whispered chant, "korah rahtahmah"

Well, that's my imaginations take on it, at least. Nothing too drastic, but perhaps a little less subtle than, "hey, look behind them!" 

So, are we not for what I mentioned?