So is Lucas going to learn from his mistakes and film the live action show actually on film?

skyjedi2005 said:

If it was actually shot on film had minimal cgi, good character writing and scripts i would watch it.  Especially if it tried to emulate the style of the true star wars trilogy and not that shitty add on series.

If Lucas was going to learn from his mistakes he wouldn't be making the stupid live action show. Yeah, we haven't seen it yet, but when has a Lucas work had any depth since the 80s? It's going to be Daniel Logan as Boba Fett and will likely be full of silly crap and prequelish nonsense, all with pretensions of being Battlestar Galactica. I'm utterly dreading what he's going to do in it. Lucas should show some mercy and quit working on Star wars and go and make Red Tails or something. 

EyeShotFirst said:

skyjedi2005 said:

If it was actually shot on film had minimal cgi, good character writing and scripts i would watch it.  Especially if it tried to emulate the style of the true star wars trilogy and not that shitty add on series.

I will watch the pilot and if it isn't up to my standards I will not get worked up. Of course several TV shows have shitty pilots. I just don't believe in Lucas anymore.

 

Sounds wise. I think the chances of him making something worthy of the name "Star Wars" is nil. I mean, the recent cartoon was watchable, but Star Wars it was not. Nor was there much in way of emotional depth. It was tolerable mainly because it wasn't meant to be much and therefore you hold it to a less high standard than a live action film.

I've seen this live action show compared to Firefly and Battlestar Galactica and Deadwood and Sopranos and I think that's pretentious striking poses, because no way do I think they can come out with something like that. So the show will be pretentious as WELL as dumb.

I keep forgetting this show even exists.  I first heard of it years ago and nothing seemed to come of it for a long time, so I wrote it off as apocryphal.

I suppose it's possible they could produce something worthy of the name, if it's left in the hands of competant people who respect the original movies.  But honestly I doubt it's going to be anything worthwhile.  If it's even ten percent as good as Firefly, I'd be really amazed.  Can't they just leave Star Wars alone?  Hasn't enough damage already been done?  I'm way more interested in Timothy Zahn's new SW book than anything more officially produced.

hairy_hen said:

I keep forgetting this show even exists.  I first heard of it years ago and nothing seemed to come of it for a long time, so I wrote it off as apocryphal.

I suppose it's possible they could produce something worthy of the name, if it's left in the hands of competant people who respect the original movies.  But honestly I doubt it's going to be anything worthwhile.  If it's even ten percent as good as Firefly, I'd be really amazed.  Can't they just leave Star Wars alone?  Hasn't enough damage already been done?  I'm way more interested in Timothy Zahn's new SW book than anything more officially produced.

"Can't they just leave Star Wars alone?  Hasn't enough damage already been done?"

My feelings exactly.

"I suppose it's possible they could produce something worthy of the name, if it's left in the hands of competant people who respect the original movies."

I think it'll be impossible unless the people working on it reject all of Lucas's bullshit (SE, PT, and the ideology and mentality that goes with it), because as long as they acknowledge that stuff it's going to be part of the foundation of their work and infect it with shit.

"I keep forgetting this show even exists."

The live action show has been put off because of the success of the animated show, but they seem to be implying it'll appear circa 2011 or so.

EyeShotFirst said:

Vaderisnothayden said:

EyeShotFirst said:

skyjedi2005 said:

If it was actually shot on film had minimal cgi, good character writing and scripts i would watch it.  Especially if it tried to emulate the style of the true star wars trilogy and not that shitty add on series.

I will watch the pilot and if it isn't up to my standards I will not get worked up. Of course several TV shows have shitty pilots. I just don't believe in Lucas anymore.

 

Sounds wise. I think the chances of him making something worthy of the name "Star Wars" is nil. I mean, the recent cartoon was watchable, but Star Wars it was not. Nor was there much in way of emotional depth. It was tolerable mainly because it wasn't meant to be much and therefore you hold it to a less high standard than a live action film.

I've seen this live action show compared to Firefly and Battlestar Galactica and Deadwood and Sopranos and I think that's pretentious striking poses, because no way do I think they can come out with something like that. So the show will be pretentious as WELL as dumb.

 

After the prequels he kinda proved that he can't really do a decent movie little less a Live Action show. Maybe he will hop off of the horse he is on and give us OT fans a real good treat. Maybe not. I am not going to expect it to be good. Maybe I should have it in my mind that it is going to suck so if it is good I will think it is really good.

 

The only real good treat I want from Mr Lucas is for him to drop this vendetta against the OOT and restore it and promise to keep it in circulation in future formats.

I've come to the conclusion that there's not a chance in hell of him making anything Star Wars that won't piss me off somehow.

skyjedi2005 said:

I don't think lucas will ever come to his senses.  The original versions will probably cease to exist in the future, if he has not already burned them on funeral pyre.  Like Luke Burning Vaders suit in rotj.

I think i officially stopped caring about the Lucas canon and the main film series, when he added hayden to return of the jedi.

I enjoy some eu from time to time, but the even the quality of the fiction and video games are hit and miss.  And mostly miss.

Besides the new tv show will be in the Alternate Universe continuity where the original films the real star wars from 1977-1983 don't exist.  But the special editions do, and the prequels.  It is really a third branch of continuity because in there the 1997 versions also cease to exist.

If he has Daniel Logan as Boba Fett, and has Boba Fett being a clone of jango, again alternate universe tangent of continuity i vote for a boycott of the show.  He may just a well have Hayden as Vader,it is not as if he is going to make true star wars he stopped doing that in 1983.  He rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone.

I don't think lucas will ever come to his senses.  The original versions will probably cease to exist in the future, if he has not already burned them on funeral pyre.  Like Luke Burning Vaders suit in rotj.

 

That's depressing. I hope you're wrong. There are other copies of the films out there apart from the ones Lucas has. They could be used to restore the films. And I don't know if I believe Lucas really has gotten rid of the copies he had. I still hold out hope.

Besides the new tv show will be in the Alternate Universe continuity where the original films the real star wars from 1977-1983 don't exist.  But the special editions do, and the prequels.  It is really a third branch of continuity because in there the 1997 versions also cease to exist.

Yeah, there's that continuity break. Like you said, he really did reboot the franchise. Which gives us every justification of course for saying the SE and PT are not canon. Because if the OOT is not canon in the SE and PT universe then the SE and PT are not canon in the OOT universe, and it's the OOT universe that's the real thing and the question of what's the real thing is the real issue behind the idea of canon, not the whims of "creators" and companies.

If he has Daniel Logan as Boba Fett, and has Boba Fett being a clone of jango, again alternate universe tangent of continuity i vote for a boycott of the show. 

Yeah I'm expecting Daniel Logan to be totally inappropriate in the role. And adult Boba Fett, in Lucas's continuity, is supposed to look like Temuera Morrison and adult Logan's looks bear out my view that he looks nothing like Morrison and never did.

The thing that gets me about the EU is you can get all these video games and comics and novels, all the ones you want, and they have no relation to the real Star Wars story, but while you can get all that irrelevant stuff to your hearts content, the original films that made the legend are still not being restored, are only available on second rate dvds and may not be available on future formats. And the money from the eu stuff goes into Lucas's pockets while he craps on Star Wars and treats the original films the way he does. Personally I think there shouldn't be much Star Wars merchandise out there unless it's fundiing restoration and preservation of the original films. Books like The Making of Star Wars are fine (though preferably at a less flashy size -Star Wars has too much of a business in milking fans for money by selling them lots of luxury coffee table books), that's the sort of stuff that SHOULD be published by Lucasfilm (and they should offer to publish a mass-produced uncensored edition of Kaminski's book too), but all this EU stuff is money into Lucas's pockets while selling Star Wars fans the illusion that it's relevant Star Wars, all while the OOT rots.

xhonzi said:

"He rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone."

Man, that is awesome. That's going in my sig.

 See? |

         V

Yeah, he did capture it in a nutshell. For a while now I've been carefully meticulously hammering out the detailed theory equivalent of that statement. So much hinges on when Lucas decided to make the SE as the "definitive" version of the OT (as it's described in Star Wars Insider 23 in which the rumors of the SE are confirmed in 1994) -definitive as in it replaces the original. And we got the "Last chance to own the original" video campaign (in 1995) which told us the OOT was being replaced for all time. The OOT was kicked out of his canon, which in reverse kind of kicks the SE and the PT (which was made to be in continuity with the SE) out of the OOT's canon. It's a break in canon and continuity, loud and clear. Hayden Anakin and Jar Jar and all that just don't exist in the same universe as Han shooting first and nor does anything that's in continuity with them, like anything Lucas is doing now or does from now on. So for people who go by the OOT, all the prequels and more recent shit just doesnt happen and isn't real.

Did the prequels really make more money if you take inflation and the change in money from one era to the next into account? They certainly had a lot less cultural impact. The originals were a massive presence in the film years. The Phantom menace was a big cultural event because of the expectation created by years of waiting for something to follow the OT (in other words it was big because of the OT), but the other prequels were just big blockbusters like any other. They weren't this huge event that the old films were in their time.

As an aside, I looked up books about Lucas on Amazon. There were a good dose of Lucas books coming out in 97 through 2001 (from circa the SE to after TPM and before AOTC) and then it drops off. The only book of significance in more recent years was the 2005 The Cinema of George Lucas, which seems to be a big coffee table luxury book that doesn't have a huge amount of depth. But it seems to me that there's been no biographies in recent years and no studies of his films in general (ones with his name in the title, anyway) other than that one big coffee table book. It's like he got a lot of attention when he got back into action with the SE and TPM and then it dropped off. Did people give up on reading about him after AOTC was so bad? I mean, I know that for me AOTC was the turning point. I was way too tolerant of the SE back in the old days and while TPM was a disappointment it had its good points, but AOTC had no merits whatosever and was for me the sign that told me Star Wars was fucked (though I should have figured that out in 97 with Han shooting second and Roger Rabbit Jabba).

I mean, I know that for me AOTC was the turning point. I was way too tolerant of the SE back in the old days and while TPM was a disappointment it had its good points, but AOTC had no merits whatosever and was for me the sign that told me Star Wars was fucked (though I should have figured that out in 97 with Han shooting second and Roger Rabbit Jabba).

This was my view of it exactly, too.  I actually really liked the special editions when they first came out--they were the same movies, just a bit different.  I liked Phantom Menace too; the thrill of "new Star Wars" kept me from seeing how silly it actually was.  But when Episode 2 came around and so obviously chugged it, I realised something was really wrong.  Even then I still had hopes of Episode 3 turning it around, and I sort of enjoyed that at first (mainly because of Ian McDiarmid) before getting tired of it.  Then I saw the 2004 dvd's and the suckiness of those--particularly the dreadful sound mix for ANH--finally convinced me it had all gone to crappe.  At that point I revisited the original versions for the first time in several years, and was struck anew by how infinitely superior they were, and how they never needed to be changed in the first place.  I've only ever watched them since.

I agree that the SE's really did reset it all under everyone's noses.  As such I take a nihilistic view and negate their very existence from my reckoning, and that of everything that follows their view of things.

Well, in effect Lucas tried to kick the orignals out of the canon by making the SEs to replace them and, seeing as the originals are the definition of Star Wars canon (by being the real Star Wars -canon is ultimately about what's the real thing), that basically had the effect of kicking the SEs and all Lucas's later work out of the canon.

 Even then I still had hopes of Episode 3 turning it around, and I sort of enjoyed that at first (mainly because of Ian McDiarmid) before getting tired of it.  

I never had much hopes for ROTS. After seeing AOTC I knew ROTS was going to be absolute shite and that Lucas had lost the ability to do good star wars. But ROTS suprised me, because it was significantly worse than even I expected. It was so uninvolving that I had trouble staying awake during it.

Vaderisnothayden said:

Well, in effect Lucas tried to kick the orignals out of the canon by making the SEs to replace them and, seeing as the originals are the definition of Star Wars canon (by being the real Star Wars -canon is ultimately about what's the real thing), that basically had the effect of kicking the SEs and all Lucas's later work out of the canon.

 Even then I still had hopes of Episode 3 turning it around, and I sort of enjoyed that at first (mainly because of Ian McDiarmid) before getting tired of it.  

I never had much hopes for ROTS. After seeing AOTC I knew ROTS was going to be absolute shite and that Lucas had lost the ability to do good star wars. But ROTS suprised me, because it was significantly worse than even I expected. It was so uninvolving that I had trouble staying awake during it.

 

 

It's very clear for me that Lucasfilm entered a downfall path since producer Rick McCallum entered in the company.

When did Rick McCallum join?

Vaderisnothayden said:

When did Rick McCallum join?

Rick McCallum joined Lucasfilm producing The Young Indiana Jones Chronicles, wich I see like the first failure, then produced Radioland Murders (!!!) , and after that Star Wars SE and Prequels.

In fact, all the real shit from Lucasfilm xD

He was there as early as 1990. The Young Indy stuff was crap.

Ugh, Rick McCallum.  Every time I hear that guy speak I want to get out a tape measure and see exactly how far up Lucas' large intestine he's managed to get his head buried.  I think his sole purpose in life is to say how great everything is that he does.  Lucas surrounding himself with people like that, it's easy to see why things have sucked lately.  Most of the things McCallum says don't even make any sense, the rotscum.