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STAR WARS: EP V "REVISITED EDITION"ADYWAN - 12GB 1080p MP4 VERSION AVAILABLE NOW — Page 380

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adywan said:
AxiaEuxine said:

Hey Adywan can we get some Ewoks in Empire revisited? Maybe have a couple walking alongside an ugnaught and talking? Maybe they could help put Han into Carbon freeze?

Or maybe have some Gungans walking around in the background? Maybe a Neimodian or two?

Oh god, please tell me you are joking

Last April you were all about it!

Wait, that was my pretending to be you as part of April Fools.  Nevermind then.

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Chrille said:

...I thought most capital ships in the pt looked fake, like from a video game.

This argument is really tired, not to mention inaccurate. They did not look like a videogame.

 

"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain.
"A myth is a religion in which no one any longer believes"...James Feibleman (1904-1987)
www . axia . ws/axia

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AxiaEuxine said:
Chrille said:

...I thought most capital ships in the pt looked fake, like from a video game.

This argument is really tired, not to mention inaccurate. They did not look like a videogame.

 

sorry but it is pretty accurate to describe the way the larger ships looked in the final 2 films of the PT. there was just something about them that looked more like a piece of artwork than a real object. CG can work really well for smaller ships but larger objects should always be a real object. combine the two and that video game look is eliminated. you can tell that physical models were made for TPM. it had a whole different feel to it.

 

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adywan said: There was just something about them that looked more like a piece of artwork than a real object.

Nice, I ve never look the CGI definition with that way. Artwork is a good description.

I still like the Venators at the end of ROTS.

 

Btw at the end of ESB we see the rebel fleet with some faded distant ships. Any Clue what ships are they? ( evidence of models or names? Im curious to know because even in HD are not visible)


-Angel

 

–>Artwork<–**

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AxiaEuxine said:
Chrille said:

...I thought most capital ships in the pt looked fake, like from a video game.

This argument is really tired, not to mention inaccurate. They did not look like a videogame.

 

I think part of this is down to videogames looking increasingly like films. If you scaled down some of the ships in even a relatively old game like Rogue Squadron they could fit into a film like ROTJ (as it currently stands) quite well.

Another problem is that some sequences in modern fantasy and Sci-Fi are designed much like computer game sequences.

One thing that detracted from my enjoyment of the new Star Trek film was the amount of jumping around from one polished surface to another (I half expected a subplot where Kirk had to collect golden rings or defeat Romulans by throwing turtles at people).

Some of the prequel sequences are very much like that too and in a world where you can play much more exciting scenes than that, just passively watching them losses it effect to emotionally engage.

ESB doesn't have anything really like that (some games have got close to the feel of the Hoth sequences but they are copying the film sequence the film sequence isn't structured around a game).

The key is to hammer out the story and use effects to illustrate the story.

A lot of film makers make the mistake of working out action sequences first and then work out a plot to hang the sequences on (a mistake usually made by computer game designers).

With the first two Revisited projects the story is pretty much there to start with but with Jedi and the prequels the story needs to be unearthed a bit and reframed to put the focus back on the story (which in some cases needs a bit more story injected in as well as some cut away).

I was amazed by the link to the computer models though, they do look in the gallery shots just as convincing as any physical model I've seen.

I understand people talking about ROTJ:R after ady drops a few bombshells but please remember the other threads for general prequel and ROTJ ideas.

It would be a shame to lose good ideas on a thread which isn't dedicated to gathering them together.

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Chrille said:

Concerning models versus cgi, I'm glad ady is gooing the model route. I am still of the opinion that models look better thn cg, at least with bigger ships, because they are actually there. Something about them actually existing rather than just being rendered in a computer. For instance, I thought most capital ships in the pt looked fake, like from a video game.

 

Yeah I got that feel as well. I think a mix of CGI and practical effects is really the best way to go in most modern cases.

“Lifes a song you don’t get to rehearse, and every single verse can make it that much worse”

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adywan said: 

It seemed more concentrated on the Ewoks than the struggle the Rebel fleet was having in orbit. it should have been the other way around.

 

Should it, thought? If you rephrase that, to "it seemed more concentrated on Endor than the struggle the Rebel fleet" it seems entirely the right decision. At least in the context of the narrative of the OT, given that none of the major trilogy characters are in the rebel fleet (the only characters who have even appeared in the previous filsm are Lando - who is B-list when it comes to characters, and Wedge  - who's role is little more than turning up a lot). If the OT story is the story of Han, Luke and Leia, and to a lesser extent R2 and 3PO (and I'd suggest that it is), the rebel assault is happening in the background for the most part is the correct decision. It's happening in the background for our lead characters too. Yeah, there's too much ewok, but the stories being told by our characters are Luke aboard DS2, and the rest of our heroes attempting to get the shield down. I'd worry that stronger focus on the rebel fleet will take the focus away from the story of the central characters- who, at the end of the day, are what we all loved about the OT, and what made it successful. More whizz pop in space, drawing focus away from the character stories seems an oddly PTish editorial decision.
 
Just my 2p, there. Feel free to ignore.

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In defence of the PT here (in this respect) there are very few scenes that have nothing to do with the main characters and those that do exist are very short.

But in a sense the whole Star Wars Galaxy is the main character in the whole saga and the space battle is pivotal to the resolution of the six part story so it makes sense to make it look as epic and conclusive as it can (it doesn't have to be longer just more convincingly decisive).

But the same is true of the ground battle too (the lightsabre duel needs a clean up and the sabres sorted out but there not much more that needs to be done there), as it stands the ground battle is even less convincing than the space battle but I being drawn into a ROTJ conversation here so I shall sit on my hands and post elsewhere from now on.

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adywan said:
Sevb32 said:

It's cool to enjoy building this stuff, but it all costs money, and sure you could build some of it, but I am sure some people would donate their time and/or models & skills to helping out. Maybe this will encourage some people to get to work on some things, get people who are not gonna worry if their models get banged up a bit while filming. I'd like to see this before I die, and I don't wanna be 50 to 60 years old when I do. Life is too short.

You 've said you don't wanna add things "just because you can" but explain to me the real difference, that gray area, is everything absolutely necessary? Just like not everything in ANH:R was absolutely necessary. Not that I didn't think it was terrific, because it sure was. I guess the key thing is OPINION, not fact.

"I cannot teach him. This boy has not patience." (just kidding)

why rush something just to get it out there when i could take a little more time and money to do it right. Sure there are only a few things that need replacing in ESB:R. you can't argue that the asteroid canyon and Rebel shield generator desperately need replacing along with the rebel hangar mattes. the best way to do this is with models.

I understand where you're coming from, but at the same time even Lucas didn't do EVERYTHING when making STAR WARS: he had tons of people to help him.  Now I know this is a bit different, but to take 2 to 3 years to do something is one thing... when you start getting into 5+ years (which it sounds JEDI is going to take) that is something else.  I'm already 38 1/2 and it would be cool to see what you do with the Prequels.  If these take 3 to 5 years apiece, that will mean EPISODE 3 will come out anywhere from 12 to 20 years from now.

There is nothing saying that you cannot collaborate, create storyboards and section off work for others to do that would fit with the direction of your edit while still taking your time to script and create the story you want and doing it with a decent time frame.  In a way, you have become a director of these edits and I'm sure there are those who would take direction to achieve your vision no differently than those hired (with pay or without) to do the same for any other director.

At the same time, maybe this is your zen - it's what you want to do with your life, with family and the rest - that this isn't so much (or just) about releasing these as it is the work in creating them, as they give you the reason to learn about computers and how all this stuff works and fits together.

No one is saying these have to be out in a month; at the same time you don't have to be afraid of other SW fans that can genuinely help.

Now Jedi needs a lot of work. this is supposed to be the finale to the whole saga yet the whole battle is pretty lame and seems rushed. It seemed more concentrated on the Ewoks than the struggle the Rebel fleet was having in orbit. it should have been the other way around. This should be the battle to end all battles...and it will be. There will be the new ending that completes the saga. you will get to see the reason why they seem to be celebrating around the galaxy so early after the Death Star was destroyed. I need to use models for some of the replacements and extra shots. i don't want to fully use CGI. I haven't yet seen a CGI stardestroyer on the net that looked as convincing as a real model. sure the smaller ships can be replaced by CGI but i don't want a fully CGI scene as it just won't fit in. Having the larger ships be real models and smaller ships be CGI will create a great balance that will fit with the original FX.

If ROTJ:R takes the longest to do then so be it. I have a vision of how i want ROTJ:R to turn out and i have to be prepared to put the extra work in to accomplish this. i'm not going to cut corners just to get the movie out as soon as possible because people are becoming impatient.I will never be working on these films again once they are done. there will be no special editions or revisited. So it has to be done right the first time around because i don't want to be sitting there watching them in a few years time saying " damn i wish i had done this or that" because my whole purpose for doing these edits is to do the versions i wanted to see , and if i begin to wish i'd taken a bit more time and added something else then i would have failed.

 

Again, you don't have to worry about that.  That is why you write a script as to what you want to do before doing any work, even regardless of having others collaborate.

Regardless, in regards to the plot points to a possible JEDI:R, when you say:

"There will be the new ending that completes the saga. you will get to see the reason why they seem to be celebrating around the galaxy so early after the Death Star was destroyed."

Does this mean we'll hear storm troopers or someone muttering in the background along the lines of Grand Moffs challenging the Emperor or they are already starting to break off to form smaller, personal empires (thus the Death Star 2 is not just to wipe out the rebels, but is a means of forcing the other Moffs back into the fold or be destroyed)?  Maybe this could be dealt with and mentioned in the title scroll.... anyways, just saying that storywise it has to be something big apart from the "Empire vs. Rebels" mano-y-mano match-up.

I know you want to keep this a secret, so I'm just asking if we're going to see something like this to help explain the SE ending.

 

         

 “You people must realize that the public owns you for life, and when you’re dead, you’ll all be in commercials dancing with vacuum cleaners.”

– Homer Simpson

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In regards to the whole "CGI versus Models" arguement, I think it has everything to do with how light reacts to a model, as well as things CGI artists do NOT take into account such as how parts of a model may be out of focus due to proximity and lighting, atmospheric effects, etc.

Most CGI stuff (from Pete Jackson's KONG to the Prequel's ships and sets) look a little fake to the degree that there is so MUCH detail and effort to get every little thing right that something almost subconcious stands out as... well, wrong.  It also amazes me how certain shots in movies (a lot of the scenes in ID4 or the subway scene in the first MATRIX.. or hell, the helicopter roof fight as well) where you find out that said "model" was CGI or the set that the actors were fighting in didn't even exist.  Now THAT amazes me.

Even then, CGI is all over the place.  When the dinosaurs in the first JURRASIC PARK can look damn near real and yet we still have $150 million + movies where the CGI stands out, you just have to wonder what the hell is going on in these FX houses.

__________________________________

To me, CGI works the best when enhancing something like a set, model or guy in a creature suit (hell, for that matter, just cleaning up the FX work: getting rid of zippers and wires) or when used for things in the background.  Models or photography using existing locations (cities or otherwise) work the best due to what I described above.  So models in the foreground and CGI in the back...

         

 “You people must realize that the public owns you for life, and when you’re dead, you’ll all be in commercials dancing with vacuum cleaners.”

– Homer Simpson

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Interestingly, I also think we have as situation where we're sometimes looking for 'fake looking' CGI, and filling in the fakenes ourselves on a subconscious level. The thing that springs to mind is the locking mechanism near the end of Indiana Jones 4. I remember being pretty disappointed at what I thought was shoddy CGI work on that when I saw it at the cinema. It was only months later that I saw the making of, and found out it was a practical effect. Sometime knowing (or just thinking) something is CGI is enough to blow the effect, when actually it's more than adequate.

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Histeria said:

Interestingly, I also think we have as situation where we're sometimes looking for 'fake looking' CGI, and filling in the fakenes ourselves on a subconscious level. The thing that springs to mind is the locking mechanism near the end of Indiana Jones 4. I remember being pretty disappointed at what I thought was shoddy CGI work on that when I saw it at the cinema. It was only months later that I saw the making of, and found out it was a practical effect. Sometime knowing (or just thinking) something is CGI is enough to blow the effect, when actually it's more than adequate.

You know, I feel ya.

While I didn't have that much of a problem with INDY 4 (or that scene in particular) I know what you mean.  It is like the scene when Indy drives his truck through the wall in the opening action sequence and the 2 guys go flying towards us as the wall explodes from the truck impact.  I figured that was CGI but it was filmed on set (!)

Compare that to the tanker truck getting blown up by Kyle Reese at the end of the first TERMINATOR.  I thought for the longest time they blew up a real truck.  Then I saw the making of with the model work... went back and watched the movie again.. and it still looks like a real truck is getting blown up!  When you can show how you did a trick and you can still pull it off, that's magic.

 

         

 “You people must realize that the public owns you for life, and when you’re dead, you’ll all be in commercials dancing with vacuum cleaners.”

– Homer Simpson

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SuperCGIman returns

 

 

Thats all I'm gonna say 

 

*sigh*

Bingowings said: Do you want to see the project finished as a playable film or a flick book?

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adywan said:

yeh, i'm hoping to do something about that.

I find that shot with the MF running away from the 2 ties shifting on it's Y-axis through the cannyon quite good, it's a great example of superb piloting from Han and how the 2 ties collide with each other funny, what changes are you gonna do? detail? opticals or remove the shot? :(

the German HD broadcasts, along with the SKYHD ones were transmitted in 1080p so the source used is true HD

True Hd, music to my ears.

 

"For over a thousand generations, the Jedi Knights were the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic. Before the dark times... before the Empire." - Obi-Wan Kenobi, ANH

"Now the Jedi are all but extinct" - Obi-Wan Kenobi, ANH

"I hate old times" - Batman to John Stewart, A Better World
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Jedi Dark Knight said:

adywan said:

yeh, i'm hoping to do something about that.

I find that shot with the MF running away from the 2 ties shifting on it's Y-axis through the cannyon quite good, it's a great example of superb piloting from Han and how the 2 ties collide with each other funny, what changes are you gonna do? detail? opticals or remove the shot? :(

It's going to be the same, but newer, cleaner, better.  All new set, all new models.

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Ripplin said:

I would think that official Blu-Ray releases from LFL would look way better than anything shown on TV thus far, especially if they were done right. ;)

 

 

 Keyphrase: "if they were done right" the fact that Adywan is fixing so many mistakes proves LFL can't do it right.....

 

As a side note: is incredible that established companies can't do the work of a lone hell-bent fan in his PC, this is why I think hover cars and holograms and that sort of thing will come from modders and hackers rather than "big industry", ok rant over. carry on.

"For over a thousand generations, the Jedi Knights were the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic. Before the dark times... before the Empire." - Obi-Wan Kenobi, ANH

"Now the Jedi are all but extinct" - Obi-Wan Kenobi, ANH

"I hate old times" - Batman to John Stewart, A Better World
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adywan said:
AxiaEuxine said:
Chrille said:

...I thought most capital ships in the pt looked fake, like from a video game.

This argument is really tired, not to mention inaccurate. They did not look like a videogame.

 

sorry but it is pretty accurate to describe the way the larger ships looked in the final 2 films of the PT. there was just something about them that looked more like a piece of artwork than a real object. CG can work really well for smaller ships but larger objects should always be a real object. combine the two and that video game look is eliminated. you can tell that physical models were made for TPM. it had a whole different feel to it.

 

I must disagree in most regards, but then again this is an opinion topic. What I find really funny when someone describes something and insists you can tell it is CG when I know from the books and making of docus a large model was used. Not that this applies here necessarily.

Also remember, people working on movie effects have deadlines, not an endless amount of time to work on something with no set date.

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Yeah, I too was blown away by those 3d CG star-destroyers at that one guys site. Amazing detail, and very real looking. But the models will look great too I'm sure, just as all of Adywan's stuff. I still wish someone from LF would just hire Adywan to re-do these films. Someone that actually cares, and that would put the time in that is needed, but have at his disposal all of that talent and help! Lucas, swallow your pride, and admit that Adywan is the guy to do this!

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Can we countdown to the trailer? How many days until?

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vaderios said:

 

-Angel

It's hard to believe that they got away with the original version and I'd certainly like to see something more like your mockup here, it would fit in with the overhaul ady is giving the film.

Though the gap in in the city line still feels a bit too convieniant (more like a painting in composition than a real city).

Love the colours in the clouds.

 

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The windshield (spaceshield?) is my favorite part.  Looks a lot more solid.

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