Kingdom of the Crystal Skull Edit Suggestions — Page 30

Thanks for the kind words Info. Our edits WILL be very different, though we may have the same climax.. :)

I can't wait to see what you're doing with this. 

Looking forward to seeing the rest of your plans as well.

My color palette:

Slightly desaturated.  A little darker.  A little more contrast.

All right, Sluggo has spoken.  Pancho Villa stays.  :D

HeKS said:   From what I can tell the color looks good. As for the arrangement ... just a thought ... I think the B&W Raiders bit is an interesting idea because of the warehouse tie in, but I wonder if putting the Orellana's Cradle scene next might disconnect the Raiders bit from the warehouse scene a little too much.

HeKs, I chose Orellana's Cradle as the first scene for three reasons:

1) It's very close to the tone and feel of the opening scene of both Raiders and my Temple of Doom edit.  The pace is perfect for the credit sequence.  It slowly draws you in to the movie.

2) It sets up the whole Crystal Skull plot and poses the question to the audience "What IS this thing"?

and 3) (and this is an important one) The stone spire in the graveyard is the ONLY triangular-shaped object in the entire movie that you could fade into from the Paramount logo, which is an essential thing to have....other than the "gopher mound" which I refuse to use.  That was one of the stupidest things I've ever seen.

So, I appreciate your suggestions, HeKs.  They're good ones, and I understand what you're saying.  But, I think I'll be keeping this arrangement.  It works for me.  Keep in mind also, that film flow and music flow is also a big factor in making these decisions. 

As far as the titles for "a few days earlier" are concerned...I'm a big fan of Oliver Stone, so I've always enjoyed mixing up the timeline on movies.  Quentin Tarantino's strategy also is a big inspiration.  It's all about "rate of revelation" to the audience.  It's about building questions in their mind and then choosing when to let them in on the answer. 

George Lucas' strategy has always been to lead the audience from point A to point B.  First people talk about what they're going to do.  Then we watch them do it.  I try to limit that as much as possible, and for me, it makes it so much more interesting to watch.  And to avoid making Indy look dumb, the audience should never know more than the main character knows, except for a few Hitchcockian exceptions.  This film suffers from a lot of that.  So, personally, I'd rather jump around the timeline a bit and "suffer through" a couple title cards rather than be bored to tears by an A to B to C storyline which is dull to begin with.

Imperial Fighter said:

InfoDroid, this radical re-structuring edit you are working on sounds terrific.

 

Good luck with this project, as a heavily re-structured version will be VERY appealing.

Thanks!  And yeah, my edits are normally referred to as "radical" because, while I have respect for the material that has come previously in the series and I beleive in keeping it in the same spirit of what has come before (especially Raiders) I don't really feel the need to be restrained by the traditional Lucas template. 

The way I see it, there are two kinds of fan-edits, there are those that edit annoying bits and pieces out of otherwise good movies to make them less annoying and more enjoyable.  And then there are those that try to create a new experience out of the same material.  Mine usually end up falling into the second category, because I enjoy the challenge of trying to be creative with it.  I think, however, the world needs both kinds.  I'll be the first to admit, my versions are not for everyone.  People who know my edits, know to expect something different.  But, then again, some people like Indy 4 except for a few scenes or whatever and that's fine...Personally, I think it's deeply, deeply, flawed and a radically bad movie calls for a radical edit.  :D  But, that's just my opinion.

--ID

Nice work ID. Looking very promising. 

1.) I was wondering what liitle bits of cheesy dialog and failed attempts at humor you were looking to cut. 

2.) What are your thoughts on the awkward head spams when Indy is looking into the eyes of the skull and

3.) What are your thoughts on OX? Do you plan on cutting his goofiness a good deal (dancing, all of the Henry Jones Jr.s, etc)

I ask mainly because I cut all of these things and was wondering if it would save you sometime if I sent you what I had so far? Might be different formats I guess, but since I cut the cheesiness (haha...) already it could at least serve as a quick guideline if you intend on doing the same. Lord knows this film has a load of Lucas cheese in it. Cutting it really helps the tone.

Heks, you make some really good points here - especially about the pacing. ID's edit WILL have a chase followed by a chase and that could be an issue. Interesting. 

But as far as using the island where the ark was opened, I think that would put too much emphasis on Raiders (which this movie is nowhere near in any fashion) and the Ark (which is featured for only 2 seconds). 

In fact, I'm curious (and excited) to see how opening with anything frmo Raiders is gonna work. Have to say though, ID is good. He's very very good. So if anyone could make it work...

Infodroid, please don't take this the wrong way (since everyone has their own tastes, and that's okay), but perhaps you should start your own thread.

The suggestions on this thread are largely for people that want to fix KotCS so it more resembles earlier Jones films.

Your previous ToD and LC edits have shown that you dislike the franchise in general.  It's sort of incompatible with the spirit of this thread.  I would be unhappy to see any of the people that were here earlier taking onboard any of your suggestions.

Again, this isn't meant to be an attack, I'm sure there's people that like your Indiana Jones edits, but I am not one of them.

But then again I feel last Crusade is better than Raiders... so what do I know.

Dr. M is right.  I was just going to suggest that in my last post but forgot.  Sorry.  The conversation just kinda naturally evolved in this thread.  Didn't mean to clog it up.

I will correct you however, on the fact that I AM actually a big fan of the franchise.

--ID

Dr. M, I can't speak for everyone here, but I for one have no trouble differentiating between ID's overhaul and an edit more like my own. We all agree that several scenes need attention and having a dialog about those scene in one location on this board is actually helpful in my opinion. ID's free to make his own thread of course if he wants, but I don't understand your reasoning for it.

I don't plan on changing the entire structure of the film, but I'm open to it. There are lots of folks here who love the idea and who love ID's previous work on  the Indy series. Work that shows to me a love and care for the series. Not a dislike exactly. 

(not to mention that ID's presence here has boosted this thread which helps me on my edit...)

And seriously? LC over ROTLA? (jk)

Here is the updated list of changes on my edit:

1.First of all, I did some color correction on the film as a whole. MUCH less green tint to everything and less bloom lighting. IOW, doesn’t look like a Barbara Walters interview anymore.

2. Increased volume of guns when Russians shoot guards.

3. Used the “not as easy as it used to be” line from the trailer.

 4. Cut Indy going cross eyed. Now we see Spalko put her hand to his head, but she goes right into you’re a hard man to read Dr. Jones. No use getting the move off to an awkward start. 

5. Made the bit where Spalko draws her sword on Indy less awkward – the way she cut Indy’s dialog off when she drew her sword and said you will help us find it always bugged me.

6. Magnetic gunpowder – I cut down on the amount of magic CGI gunpowder we see floating around the warehouse. Now Indy throws it, we see it drift in a certain direction (clear enough to follow), then we cut right to the group walking down the aisle. In fact, made little snips here and there to make the warehouse move a BIT quicker.

7. Cut Spalko asking what the point of this was. Seriously Spalko? You Indy JUST explained it to you. Now she just says don’t toy with me Dr. Jones. Works much better. 

8. Cut the peek at the alien. We see the container opening. We see everyone looking wowed, but not EXACLTY what it is that’s in there. 

9. Cut Indy saying “after all that time we spent spying blah blah blah. Now he just says thought we were friends mac.

10. Toyed with the “damn I thought that was closer” line. Trying to overlap it so that he says the last few words of the sentence AS we see the soldier get knocked out of the truck.

11. Minor fix makes Indy’s jeep burst through the crates more suddenly so that the group of soldiers don’t appear to be just standing there waiting on it. 

12. Increase volume of soldiers screaming as they get torched by the rocket sled. 

13. Cut Indy falling off sled. Now he just grabs his hat and hides.

14. Cut the prairie dogs from the rocket sled sequence. 

15. Cut Indy saying Woa. When he realizes the people on the couch are dummies.

16. Cut one of the “That can’t be goods” in Doom town.

17. Cut Indy saying “Fine then don’t wait for me” as he attempts to catch the soldiers’ fleeing car on foot in doomtown.

18. Cut some of the fridge bouncing to TRY to make it a BIT more believable that he could survive the trip in the fridge. (I know I know, but I at least tried)

19. increased the time it takes for Indy to open the fridge door. So it APPEARS that he is pretty messed up in there. 

20. Indy doesn’t see a prairie dog after he rolls out of fridge.

21. Made FBI scene less redundant.

22. Laser over at OT also did a great photo swap on the pictures of Henry Sr. and Marcus so I will use this as well with his permission. 

23. Cut Indy saying It’s Just a story to Mutt about the skull and Cut him acting like the skull doesn’t exist. This helps Indy’s motivation for going in the first place.

24. In the sanitarium, I cut the second shot of the weird inmate reaching for Mutt. One was enough and the guy looks too much like Sean Patrick Flannery.

25. Cut Indy saying This Way Up when Indy helps Mutt to his feet.

26. I think it was Marion at OT who added gunfire to Indy’s pistol in the cemetery fight scene. I wanted to use this but the formats are different.

27. Also, I’m cutting back on the acrobatics of the fight to give it all more immediacy and brutality if possible. 

28. Cutting the silly noises the little guys make also. Especially when Indy blows the dart back into the baddy’s throat.

29. Cut the dance on your own time line.

 
30. Cut the “what ifs” given by Indy and Mutt after they find the skull. Now the scene ends with Indy asking “What IS this thing?” Then we see the two emerge from the tomb and run into Mac and Dovchenko.

30. Cut any and all clear and direct shots of the alien corpses. Now they are only seen behind the cloth. Cut a bit of the repetitive dialog here as well so it moves a bit more quickly. 

31. Cut OX’s STUPID dancing by the fire and twirling the cane shit. Now they push him into the tent seemingly into Indy who grabs Ox by the wrist to tell him who he is. We do still hear Ox babbling so Indy can tell the dude is messed up. 

32. Cut the AWKWARD Indy head spasms as he get hypnotized by the skull. 

33. Cut Ox saying three times it drops (since it does not in fact drop three times now.)

34. Cut the “or have you retired from Marion’s “you still leaving a trail of wreckage…” to Indy. Just works better. 

35. Cut Indy saying good when Spalko figures out one of the ideograms. Why the F is he complimenting her?!

36. Cut the science lesson from Indy in the quicksand.

 37. Now Indy tells Ox to HELP instead of GO GET HELP (from who exactly Indy?) Now when Ox runs off its kinda funny. AND when he returns with the commies it’s funny too. 
38. Cut Indy insisting Mutt and Marion call the snake a rope. Now he just finally decides to gab it.
39. Cut Indy’s pants ripping and Mutt saying Oh Shit in the truck.
40. Cut one of Mutt’s kicks to Dovchenko. So Indy plays more of a role knocking him out.

41. Cut down on the Doe eyes Marion gives after Indy climbs out of the truck.
42. Cut Ox saying Henry Jones JR! before the jungle chase. Idiot. TO do this I had to reorder the shots a bit, but it works fine. That line Had to go.
43. Cut “HI MAC! “ So that now Indy just punches Mac. 
44. Cut Marion getting hit by the branches while driving AND cut the Mutt crotch shots.
45. Cut the number of Spalko punches to Mutt (silly) and the kicks it takes to knock Mutt back.
46. Mutt sees only one monkey now.
47. Increased immediacy of Indy’s jeep on the edge of cliff and Spalko threatening him and Mutt spying the chase from the trees. Flows much better now. 
48. Cut monkeys attacking Spalko of course.
49. Cut Mutt’s Woa. Now just Indy says it. 
50. Cut the truck landing in the tree bit. Now it just goes right into the water. They climb back in. Rapids take them over the falls. They all fall out. Crawl to shore. 
51. Cut most of Marion laughing with the steering wheel.
52. Now Mutt says they have to go through waterfall Skull and we cut away with Indy looking at the skull entrance. This whole things works better now.

53. Cut Indy saying the skull tells him to return it.  Jesus.
54. Reorganized the obelisk puzzle so that Indy now appears to be the one to figure it out. Did this by cutting Indy asking Ox what he’s doing, what he’s looking for, well done, etc.

55. Cut the awkward double shot of the gang falling/jumping from the stairs booby trap. Now they just fall once. Sloppy editing Steve.

56. Cut Indy asking Ox for the skull (I’ll give it back I promise) bleh. Now Indy just takes it.
57. CLIMAX - ????? We’ll see…
58. Made the water bit more immediate also. Now the water appears right at their feet, hits em quick and fires them upward. Less of the fun WEEEE!!! Feeling. 
59. Cut the second time Indy says knowledge was their treasure. We get it. 

60. Cut Indy saying why don’t you stick around and Mutt saying In don’t know why didn’t you dad? Now Indy says Somehwere your Grandpa is laughing right after Mutt says he’s walking off – so it looks like Grandpa would be laughing at Indy having to raise such a head strong son like he did.
61. Cut SOME of the UFO. Now it leaves a bit more to the imagination.

62. Wedding has just music. No dialog. And I cut it down some as well. 

All right.  I stand corrected.

InfoDroid just tends to have a very unique vision of what to do with IJ films.  But I suppose any idea may spawn other ideas.

Forget I said anything.

Edit: To clarify... my crazy comment is derived from my continued confusion over how many different KotCS projects are actually in the works and the differences between them since all editors are using the same thread.

Good points Heks, but I think the only way I would agree is if they went to the warehouse for the Ark for some reason. As it is now, the only real link would be the warehouse and it is already clearly extablished that the warehouse is the same from Raiders. Now, focusing more in Indy and Marion in that opening B&W bit makes sense since the movie deals with their relationship.

Just my opinion.

That would be great Laser. Agreed, the water wheel is completely out of the blue.

Also, infodroid has a couple questions about your Connery photo replacement edit.

Oh, it was a PM. He just wanted to know about the format of your photo swap and if you posted it.