logo Sign In

Hypothetical — Page 2

Author
Time
Sluggo said:

I think whore is a strong word.  Maybe a business man with a product to sell would be more appropriate.  I don't agree with his business plan, but I don't think he is a whore. 

 

I agree, that is a very strong word to use for the guy, and it fits him in no way whatsoever!

You might be able to get away with calling him a pimp, as he is whoring out his franchise. I am sure I have used that one as an analogy before myself, but just as that, an analogy, not an insult.

He is a business man. I have great respect for business men. Some of them are dogs, and some of them are decent people, but they are what makes the world go round.

No, I cannot blame George for this, it is his right. I am sure I'd do the same thing if I were him. Sure, it pisses off some fans to see something they love being spread so thin over every cereal asle and toy section of every store, but it makes even more fans happy. To some fans, being able to buy a Darth Tater Mr. Potato head is a dream come true, to others, the very existence of that toy is offensive. This stuff doesn't bother me so much, George is getting rich because of it, and it is all due to his business savvy. Who can honestly fault him for that? Anyone who calls him a whore for that, is very likely in turn showing themselves to be a lover of whores, unless they can prove themselves not to be in possession of any of the countless things marketed and produced by business men.

The only thing I can truely fault ol' George for is the attitude represented in Vaderisnohayden's post. It annoys me to no end. Especially coming from the guy who spoke out against film coloration (something of which I truely agreed with him about). The other thing I can fault George for is the prequels, he obviously didn't give a lick about them, and put about as much care into writing and directing them as I put into scrubbing my own toilets. The prequels could have been quite a treat for the fans, but rather ended up being a quick buck. He could have much just about as much from them by hiring writers and directors who actually cared about them, but no sense lamenting this now.

 

Also, if George wanted to make money off the OOT, he would have done so by now (and actually, he did with the GOUT). I believe he is at the point where he doesn't care so much about what money could come from the OOT, he is much more interested in the things he was quoted saying in Vaderisnohayden's post. I am quite confident we will never see a proper restoration of the OOT as long as George is alive. Even if there are future releases of the original trilogy, I am certain there will always be some excuse for them to be subpar to the quality standard of the day.

 

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

Author
Time

I only WISH he was a whore! He's more like the hostile psycho ex-girlfriend who still has all your CDs!

Author
Time

Wow, Baronlando, that was perfect! Lol. Far, far more fitting than "whore".

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

Author
Time
AxiaEuxine said:

So lets say that the GOUT is released in perfect anamorphic, unmolested, non-raping your childhoods, blu-ray perfection, OK? Its sitting on your shelf and you like to curl up with it when you go to bed each night. OK? You are happy.

Then George releases a new 6 disk set that does have changes to the OT. Are there any that you would like? These can be both already existing and theoritical. Thoughts?

 

 If there was a great version of the OOT, then I might just also want to have the latest Lucas-version next to it on the shelf. I'd watch either, depending on my mood.

I'd also not have any beef with Lucas afterwards. The ONLY thing that I think Lucas is kind of a douchebag about is that he refuses to release the OOT, and kind of talks down to people who want them. It's disrespectufl to fans, to the people he collaborated with, and to the idea of film as an artform.

Author
Time
C3PX said:

I am quite confident we will never see a proper restoration of the OOT as long as George is alive. Even if there are future releases of the original trilogy, I am certain there will always be some excuse for them to be subpar to the quality standard of the day.

 

That's exactly how I feel.  Honestly, I never give it any thought anymore.  I got what I came for - a DVD of the 1977 theatrical release of Star Wars.

I don't dislike the guy for it at all.  I do, however, find his attitude very interesting from a psychological standpoint.  His desire to try to erase the past is fascinating, particularly considering the fact that it's impossible - especially with something as landmark as Star Wars77. 

When I see him in interviews, or read interviews, or see photos of him on the set of Indiana Jones - he comes across to me as someone who is very uncomfortable in a social atmosphere.  On some of the extras on the Kingdom DVD, he's occasionally asked questions and can't seem to answer coherently.

Spielberg, Ford, Allen,  Ray, & Shia all give normal, interesting answers, as do the crew members. George, on the other hand, kind of nervously laughs and says something mildly related to the questions. To me, it's borderline uncomfortable to watch.

He has a very possessive obsession with Star Wars.  I don't mean that to sound flip. I mean he seems not to be clear in his thinking anymore. He's pushed people away and let it cloud his judgment. It also seems to have gotten worse with age. 

In previous interviews, I've heard him mention  the future and how Star Wars is remembered.  It sounds as though it's something that's on his mind a lot. He must realize by now that there is no way he can control that.  The moment he's gone, someone will start working on a proper restoration\release of Star Wars77 - just as they have with many other films from the past.

 Considering I watch Star Wars once every two years or so, compared to listening to the NPR version 5 or 6 times a year, plus the occasional reading of the script - I don't really have a horse in the race. Like I said in my previous post, if there's ever a proper release, I'll get it.  If not, that's fine too.

 

 

Forum Moderator
Author
Time
 (Edited)

Here's what I own of SW on DVD:

The 04 Set.

A set from here of the Laserdisc collector's edition(which I own too)

That's it.

I also have the original separate releases of each prequel.

And I wont be buying anything more until Lucas stops this love/hate thing he has with his audience and releases a mega box set of original theatrical versions, NO FIXES, and whatever else he wants to put on it.

I used to have a list of stuff I'd want for a mega box set but it's obvious Lucasfilm has lost touch so why bother?

 

Author
Time

There's two problems I have with what George is saying,

1) Change the movie all you want, but at least provide the older "drafts" in acceptable quality. Is there a reason they need to stay buried?

and

2) I'll grant him the "director's perrogative" argument when it comes to ANH, which he actually directed. But guess what? He didn't direct Empire and Jedi. He could at least be more accurate by saying "I wrote the story for the saga and executive produced episodes V and VI. The movies all now belong to me legally."

Yes, I know Kershner didn't have a problem with the changes made to Empire.

Yes, I realize there are unsubstantiated accounts of how Lucas directed some of Jedi.

....

By the way, I completely agree with Axia that Lucas will remaster the OOT eventually.

Author
Time

If Lucas ever remasters the OOT- no, that won't happen for decades.

Author
Time

The truth is it doesn't matter if he remasters it or not. Some fan will do it for the love of it if they haven't already.

Author
Time

WE are the fans who do such things. This community has made some impressive attempts, but we are very limited with poor quality source material. Nothing, and I mean nothing we can possibly make will ever amount to anything LFL could make. Not because we don't have the will to do it, but because we don't have the sources or the technology.

Countless manhours have been put into these efforts already, you can find them in old threads on this site, but quite honestly, the GOUT, as pathetic as it is, looks better than the vast majority of them, if not every single one of them. Maybe someday some fan will come along with the means to pull off something really fantastic, but I don't have my hopes up about it. Anything really worthwhile will come out of official channels.

 

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

Author
Time

I'm skeptical about that at this point at least regarding the OOT. Perhaps the SEs, but even then I'm doubtful.

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Well, I do think we'll all be able to make something that's close enough in the near future (adywan already erased that stupid dinosaur from Mos Eisley, and that's one of the trickiest shots, very cool). If lucasfilm is too lame to get AHEAD of the ball for once and do something now, that's their loss.

Author
Time

Well, I bet in the future the remastered OOT will be more like the reconstructed OOT, because no matter what we have to accept the GOUT, even if it was worse than LD quality.

Author
Time

Are you suggesting that the only way we will ever get the OOT would be to reconstruct it from the DVDs/future Blu-rays of the SE? Because that isn't happening. There is too much footage missing. And the 04 DVDs are incredibly messed up. Since LFL made the claim that they were intentially messed up as a creative decision, I suspect they will perpetuate their continual messed uppedness.

And I am not sure what you mean by needed to accept the GOUT. I am probably on a completely misunderstanding you, so don't take it the wrong way when I say that we absolutely don't have to accept the GOUT. It is unacceptable. It looks fine enough on old technology, which works for me because I tend to prefer keeping antiques around the house and saving my money (i.e. ten years from now I might have an HD TV, if I find one in the trash or if someone sells me their old one on the cheap), but for anyone using modern technology, the things are way, way, way below standard, and not just by today's standards, they were way below the standards of five years before their release. Far from needing to accept them, we need to take them into the backyard and pee on them.

Of course, I imagine you meant that we need to accept the fact that they are the best official release we will ever get. In this case, you may well be right, but I think there will be a better release down the road. My prediction is that eventually we will see a Blu-ray release of the OOT following the DVD standards of today, or a few years ago. This will of course be pretty freaking awesome, just as the GOUT was awesome in its own severly belated way, but it will once again be too little too late as well as a very transparent attempt at keeping the OOT looking like a second hand VHS tape in comparison to the SE.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

Author
Time

Eventually, couldn't some bizarro adywan make a version that was skillfully and substantially de-changed? I think I could probably live with it (if the only alternative is nothing ever). I just want out man! I'm too old for this shit, Riggs! I feel like I'm flattering this billionaire too much just by caring at all and by pining away for the privelege of buying the movies again.

Author
Time

I meant to say that we would have to reconstruct the OOT from the GOUT- definitely not from any version of the SE! Plus, I am confident that the GOUT will be the last legitimate release of the OOT because Lucas has seen the sales figures of the GOUT and is certain that no one wants the OOT. Therefore, we have to accept the unacceptable and consider ourselves members of a lost cause. It a bitch to say that but Lucas put us in this situation and ruined his own creation in the pursuit of his "vision." 

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Where do you get info saying the GOUT didn't sell well?

It seems to have sold well enough to be reissued last year, and I heard that on Amazon UK at least the OT set containing the GOUT was outselling the PT. And now, the only in-print OT set is the one including the GOUT.

 

 

Author
Time
 (Edited)

Maybe amazon should put up a listing for a restored anamorphic oot trilogy and see the interest it draws.

I don't know how we can all prove to Lucas that fans of the originals exist and in large numbers.

Start a new petition, write to film preservation groups.  Write to Afi. BFi,  ASC.

Lucas thinks the fans of the originals is a niche market and will not spend the money to restore films he thinks are inferior to his final cut.  He claimed the 2004 were his final version so can we take him at his word, or is he just waiting for technology to advance for his 3D ultimate cut.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

Author
Time

If anyone thinks that Lucas is going to make a 3D version of his films, they are just plain crazy.

Author
Time

Lucas is the one who talked about making a 3D version. Not sure why somebody would be crazy for thinking that he might. I suppose there was a time when you could have said, "If anyone thinks that Lucas is going to make episodes 1, 2, and 3, they are just plain crazy.

I suppose you could also compare it to the sequel trilogy, but that would have been all the hard work of writing new scripts, getting a director, hiring actors, etc. With Star Wars 3D all it would take is throwing money at it to have people set it up for 3D, then rerereleasing it in theaters and raking in several times the amount of money he put into it, assuming it goes over well.

I don't think anyone is crazy for thinking he just might continue to capitalize on his movies. I for one think it is a horrible idea, but I might have to consider myself just plain crazy if I thought Lucas wouldn't do it if he thinks he can make money off of it.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

Author
Time

He was going to do the entire "saga" (hate that phrase) in "Lucas 3-D" (ok it wasn't really called that.) in 2007. It was supposed to be for the 30th Anniversary, but that fell through. I hope it does not happen. I would much rather see a general rerelease of the OT as in 1997. This would mean that George would release the 04 HD version to be digitally projected. The horror. 1997 was probably SW's last breath.

The problem of restoration would actually be getting the materials themselves. 35mm prints and access to the negatives. I don't believe for one second that Lucas would have been stupid enough to splice the 97 footage directly into the 77 original negative. It wouldn't have looked as good as if he had put it in a 97 restored copy print.

Robert A. Harris offered to do the restoration, and got no response. I think our only option may be to go to the Film Preservation Board/Library of Congress and make an appeal. SW entered the National Film Preservation in 1989-before any changes. This must mean that they have a pristine 35mm archival quality print-one that George could never get his hands on. They might listen as they did on the issue of B&W film colorization-for the issue is very similar. At the very least it should be decided that all versions should be available in acceptable transfers ala Blade Runner.

Otherwise, I think the GOUTS will stand for years to come. Blu-Rays of the OT will be a long time coming as they were on DVD. If this release ever comes to fruition, original versions will only be present if: we keep up pressure on Lucasfilm, George relents, a restoration commences, or we will simply see the GOUTS in HD.

Lucasfilm: keeping Laserdisc and VHS alive well into the 21st century and beyond!!!

VADER!? WHERE THE HELL IS MY MOCHA LATTE? -Palpy on a very bad day.
“George didn’t think there was any future in dead Han toys.”-Harrison Ford
YT channel:
https://www.youtube.com/c/DamnFoolIdealisticCrusader

Author
Time

If anybody has any news on how well the 2006 GOUT dvds sold, I think a lot of us would be happy to hear it.

News on the 2008 GOUT set too.

Author
Time
captainsolo said:

I don't believe for one second that Lucas would have been stupid enough to splice the 97 footage directly into the 77 original negative.

 

I know it sounds stupid, but that's actually what happened. With any movie that was shot on film, the original camera negative is the highest quality source that there is. That's why Lucas cut the alterations directly into the negative instead of making a copy first and cutting the changes into the copy.

It feels like it's been forever since we've heard anything about what's happening with the films. Lucas was quoted sometime last year as saying that the process for converting the movies into 3D is kinda expensive, something on the order of 10 million dollars per movie I think. Apparently he was considering cutting his losses and not going through with it. But we've gotten multiple reports from people who've seen demonstrations of converted scenes from A New Hope, so I wouldn't be at all surprised if the release ends up happening after all.

Right now there are rumors from thedigitalbits.com that we could see some of the movies on blu-ray as early as next year. I somehow doubt that's going to happen. If what happened with dvd is any indication, Lucas will wait at least a couple more years until blu-ray is selling better than dvd. By that point the 3D conversion will probably be finished, so 2012 could see the 3D theatrical release and then the blu-ray (hopefully with remastered OOT) later on in the year.

Author
Time
If only Lucas would put his money into restoring the OT rather than wasting it on putting the SE and PT into 3 fucking D.