Info & Ideas: ESB and ROTJ Wishlist — Page 19

ChainsawAsh said:

I'd rewritten the crawl based on some of the ideas presented in the "Fan-O-Matic" thread.  Note that this crawl assumes the movie plays out in this order:

1. Vader arrives on DSII
2. Leia delivers Chewie to Jabba
3. Luke is on Dagobah, Yoda dies, Obi-Wan tells Luke of Leia (which works well because the next scene is...)
4. Leia frees Han, is captured
5. Luke arrives on Tatooine.
6. Droids attempt to deliver message, but are taken captive

 

please please please do this!

ben_danger said:

ChainsawAsh said:

I'd rewritten the crawl based on some of the ideas presented in the "Fan-O-Matic" thread.  Note that this crawl assumes the movie plays out in this order:

1. Vader arrives on DSII
2. Leia delivers Chewie to Jabba
3. Luke is on Dagobah, Yoda dies, Obi-Wan tells Luke of Leia (which works well because the next scene is...)
4. Leia frees Han, is captured
5. Luke arrives on Tatooine.
6. Droids attempt to deliver message, but are taken captive

 

please please please do this!

There's no need to massively re-write (other than adjusting the bit about Luke to have return to Dagobah to complete his training instead) the crawl to do that but a really interesting edit idea.

It may be easier to reshoot the sabre construction/hologram scene on Dagobah than on Tatooine too (making his new sabre could be the final part of his training).

Getting around the black glove would be a bugger though.

It would add a bit more menace to Boussh and really start Jedi off on a the same downer ESB ended on.

Yoda dead, Vader his dad, new Death Star , Chewie captured, droids captured, Han and Leia (his sister... which he snogged) captured, Rancor, Sarlacc...it never rains but it pours...

You'd have to remove Luke's return to the fleet though (not that I'm fussed that whole scene needs working on).

If you are going down that route you could start with Luke have a little dogfight on his way to Dagobah (Star Wars films start better with a battle) have him shoot down a few TIE's in his X-Wing one last time then land.

Then Vader, The Dagobah stuff, the mighty Boushh, Droids, Han/Leia and then the return of the not quite Jedi.

Add another peril into an already really bad day.

It's just a mock up so I can add as many dots as you like Chainsaw (I missed a full stop after DEATH STAR anyhoo).

you should really check out the rotj fan o matic. there is a really good edit of the rebel briefing scene. luke is assumed to already have joined the fleet, so i guess his xwing would just follow the falcon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f19SnqUkAlA&feature=channel

love the idea of the saber reconstruction on dagobah. would be great!

ben_danger said:

you should really check out the rotj fan o matic. there is a really good edit of the rebel briefing scene. luke is assumed to already have joined the fleet, so i guess his xwing would just follow the falcon.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f19SnqUkAlA&feature=channel

 

love the idea of the saber reconstruction on dagobah. would be great!

I appreciate it's rough and ready but it certainly puts the brief into briefing.

Oh Gods ! That set (what a piece of junk!), Admiral Ackbar channeling Robin Day and General Madine phoning his performance in.... hells bells I hate that scene even the OT cast can't save it.

It's years since I listened to the radio version are there any better vocal elements in that that can be used?

 Double post!

Sorry.

Here's an idea. artificially slow down all of the emperor's lines and add the deep vocal effect from ROTS. The emperor sounds so stupid in ROTJ IMO. Make his eyes more like ROTS too.

Octorox said:

I don't know about showing Luke on Dagobah before we see his entrance on Tatooine. The way the new and improved Jedi Luke is presented is pretty effective.

 I agree.

Octorox said:

I don't know about showing Luke on Dagobah before we see his entrance on Tatooine. The way the new and improved Jedi Luke is presented is pretty effective.

The idea for that edit is to make it seem like Luke spent more than a week becoming a Jedi.  This way, he has spent an indeterminate amount of time on Dagobah - we assume after ESB he returned there to finish training, then he finishes, Yoda dies, and he leaves.

(The Fan-O-Matic thread is even more radical, changing Ben's scene to take place on Tatooine, though I think that's technically infeasible given the footage available)

And honestly, even if I didn't do all that, I would rewrite the crawl anyway.  The only reason is that it's boring.  Look at ANH:  "It is a period of civil war."  ESB:  "It is a dark time for the Rebellion."  ROTJ:  "Luke Skywalker has returned to his home planet of Tatooine in an attempt to rescue his friend Han Solo from the clutches of the vile gangster Jabba the Hutt."  Wow.  Talk about boring, and a mouthful to boot.

ChainsawAsh said:

Octorox said:

I don't know about showing Luke on Dagobah before we see his entrance on Tatooine. The way the new and improved Jedi Luke is presented is pretty effective.

The idea for that edit is to make it seem like Luke spent more than a week becoming a Jedi.  This way, he has spent an indeterminate amount of time on Dagobah - we assume after ESB he returned there to finish training, then he finishes, Yoda dies, and he leaves.

(The Fan-O-Matic thread is even more radical, changing Ben's scene to take place on Tatooine, though I think that's technically infeasible given the footage available)

And honestly, even if I didn't do all that, I would rewrite the crawl anyway.  The only reason is that it's boring.  Look at ANH:  "It is a period of civil war."  ESB:  "It is a dark time for the Rebellion."  ROTJ:  "Luke Skywalker has returned to his home planet of Tatooine in an attempt to rescue his friend Han Solo from the clutches of the vile gangster Jabba the Hutt."  Wow.  Talk about boring, and a mouthful to boot.

Yeah. I still feel that the scope of some of these edits is beyond an OT revisited projects. The revisited projects have generally been about fixing and adding, not moving around and taking away. I guess if Ady did a Purist DVD9 for this edit I wouldn't mind the radical changes however I couldn't consider it the "definitive edition of ROTJ" like I do with ANH because if you change too much it ceases to become ROTJ anymore. small tweaks along the way like the ADM prequel edits I wouldn't mind but I wouldn't want to see the movie completely gutted and rearranged. I'd prefer another editor tackle that or even Ady on a separate project.

Octorox said:

Here's an idea. artificially slow down all of the emperor's lines and add the deep vocal effect from ROTS. The emperor sounds so stupid in ROTJ IMO. Make his eyes more like ROTS too.

IMO, his eyes (and entire face) were terrible looking in ROTS. He should be altered in ROTS to look like he does in ROTJ

I thought everything about his ROTS appearance - makeup, eyes, clothing, voice, acting in general - was FAR inferior to his ROTJ appearance.  I almost walked out of the theater on "No!  No!  YOU will DIE!" and the subsequent Emperor/Anakin scene.

i must admit, why the hell did they make him all prune like in ROTS, was it just to help the slower members of the audience make the link? i always assumed we was just INCREDIBLY old by ROTJ.

darthmunky said:

Octorox said:

Here's an idea. artificially slow down all of the emperor's lines and add the deep vocal effect from ROTS. The emperor sounds so stupid in ROTJ IMO. Make his eyes more like ROTS too.

 

IMO, his eyes (and entire face) were terrible looking in ROTS. He should be altered in ROTS to look like he does in ROTJ

Palpatine in ROTJ and most the prequels is one of the best things in the whole of Star Wars.

But as soon as he puts on that stupid voice in ROTS he becomes an utter tit, I agree change ROTS to match ROTJ not the other way around.

ChainsawAsh said:

I thought everything about his ROTS appearance - makeup, eyes, clothing, voice, acting in general - was FAR inferior to his ROTJ appearance.  I almost walked out of the theater on "No!  No!  YOU will DIE!" and the subsequent Emperor/Anakin scene.

I don't know. I feel like he spit out some of his lines too fast and without much inflection in ROTJ and it kind of made him seem like just a shriveled up old guy as opposed to pure evil/the devil incarnate which is how I have always seen Palpatine. I hate the lightnng scene to but I think it's important that he snaps from being a kindly old senator to some sort of demonic being. The eyes looked better because they had a truly evil glow to them. Palpatine ROTJ just looks like he hasn't been keeping up on his sleep lately. "No, no, no" was  not what I was thinking, I agree with you on that line.

ChainsawAsh said:

Octorox said:

I don't know about showing Luke on Dagobah before we see his entrance on Tatooine. The way the new and improved Jedi Luke is presented is pretty effective.

The idea for that edit is to make it seem like Luke spent more than a week becoming a Jedi.  This way, he has spent an indeterminate amount of time on Dagobah - we assume after ESB he returned there to finish training, then he finishes, Yoda dies, and he leaves.

(The Fan-O-Matic thread is even more radical, changing Ben's scene to take place on Tatooine, though I think that's technically infeasible given the footage available)

And honestly, even if I didn't do all that, I would rewrite the crawl anyway.  The only reason is that it's boring.  Look at ANH:  "It is a period of civil war."  ESB:  "It is a dark time for the Rebellion."  ROTJ:  "Luke Skywalker has returned to his home planet of Tatooine in an attempt to rescue his friend Han Solo from the clutches of the vile gangster Jabba the Hutt."  Wow.  Talk about boring, and a mouthful to boot.

But doesn't Luke say at the end of ESB that he is going to Jabbas palace pretty much right away?

Octorox said:

ChainsawAsh said:

Octorox said:

I don't know about showing Luke on Dagobah before we see his entrance on Tatooine. The way the new and improved Jedi Luke is presented is pretty effective.

The idea for that edit is to make it seem like Luke spent more than a week becoming a Jedi.  This way, he has spent an indeterminate amount of time on Dagobah - we assume after ESB he returned there to finish training, then he finishes, Yoda dies, and he leaves.

(The Fan-O-Matic thread is even more radical, changing Ben's scene to take place on Tatooine, though I think that's technically infeasible given the footage available)

And honestly, even if I didn't do all that, I would rewrite the crawl anyway.  The only reason is that it's boring.  Look at ANH:  "It is a period of civil war."  ESB:  "It is a dark time for the Rebellion."  ROTJ:  "Luke Skywalker has returned to his home planet of Tatooine in an attempt to rescue his friend Han Solo from the clutches of the vile gangster Jabba the Hutt."  Wow.  Talk about boring, and a mouthful to boot.

 

But doesn't Luke say at the end of ESB that he is going to Jabbas palace pretty much right away?

He says that they will meet at the rendezvous point on Tatooine as soon as Lando has tracked down Han.

Presumably there was some planning involved and Lando getting into the Palace without Boba Fett kicking up a stink would take some negotiation (I don't think for a minute that mask would fool him).

Bingowings said:

Octorox said:

ChainsawAsh said:

Octorox said:

I don't know about showing Luke on Dagobah before we see his entrance on Tatooine. The way the new and improved Jedi Luke is presented is pretty effective.

The idea for that edit is to make it seem like Luke spent more than a week becoming a Jedi.  This way, he has spent an indeterminate amount of time on Dagobah - we assume after ESB he returned there to finish training, then he finishes, Yoda dies, and he leaves.

(The Fan-O-Matic thread is even more radical, changing Ben's scene to take place on Tatooine, though I think that's technically infeasible given the footage available)

And honestly, even if I didn't do all that, I would rewrite the crawl anyway.  The only reason is that it's boring.  Look at ANH:  "It is a period of civil war."  ESB:  "It is a dark time for the Rebellion."  ROTJ:  "Luke Skywalker has returned to his home planet of Tatooine in an attempt to rescue his friend Han Solo from the clutches of the vile gangster Jabba the Hutt."  Wow.  Talk about boring, and a mouthful to boot.

 

But doesn't Luke say at the end of ESB that he is going to Jabbas palace pretty much right away?

He says that they will meet at the rendezvous point on Tatooine as soon as Lando has tracked down Han.

Presumably there was some planning involved and Lando getting into the Palace without Boba Fett kicking up a stink would take some negotiation (I don't think for a minute that mask would fool him).

 

yeah, I guess it would work then. But, how does Luke know when the leave Dagobah. He justs seems to leave when Yoda dies. Isn't that rather convenient timing?

Octorox said:

Bingowings said:

Octorox said:

ChainsawAsh said:

Octorox said:

I don't know about showing Luke on Dagobah before we see his entrance on Tatooine. The way the new and improved Jedi Luke is presented is pretty effective.

The idea for that edit is to make it seem like Luke spent more than a week becoming a Jedi.  This way, he has spent an indeterminate amount of time on Dagobah - we assume after ESB he returned there to finish training, then he finishes, Yoda dies, and he leaves.

(The Fan-O-Matic thread is even more radical, changing Ben's scene to take place on Tatooine, though I think that's technically infeasible given the footage available)

And honestly, even if I didn't do all that, I would rewrite the crawl anyway.  The only reason is that it's boring.  Look at ANH:  "It is a period of civil war."  ESB:  "It is a dark time for the Rebellion."  ROTJ:  "Luke Skywalker has returned to his home planet of Tatooine in an attempt to rescue his friend Han Solo from the clutches of the vile gangster Jabba the Hutt."  Wow.  Talk about boring, and a mouthful to boot.

 

But doesn't Luke say at the end of ESB that he is going to Jabbas palace pretty much right away?

He says that they will meet at the rendezvous point on Tatooine as soon as Lando has tracked down Han.

Presumably there was some planning involved and Lando getting into the Palace without Boba Fett kicking up a stink would take some negotiation (I don't think for a minute that mask would fool him).

 

yeah, I guess it would work then. But, how does Luke know when the leave Dagobah. He justs seems to leave when Yoda dies. Isn't that rather convenient timing?

 

Yoda hangs on to life long enough to complete his training (but to be a Jedi Luke has to face some home truths).

Ben's spirit now tells him Leia is his sister and like Luke has the potential to be both a Jedi and a Sith (and going by the way she stands over Lando while Chewie chokes the life out of him a tactic she later uses on Jabba, she has enough of her Father in her to be just as much of a danger in the wrong hands as Vader was).

The rescue is already on the way but now he has an added Jedi reason to protect Leia (to stop her from being discovered by Palpatine and turned into his new apprentice).

When he rushed to save Han, Leia etc in ESB it was out of pure emotional attachment, when he saves the gang in ROTJ it's now part of a bigger picture.

doubleofive said:

Bingowings said:

Here's my first stab at beefing up the crawl :

I love this new crawl.  Can you type it out for us in whole?

 

"STAR WARS 

Episode VI 

THE RETURN OF THE JEDI 

The Alliance is doomed.

Hunted by the Imperial Star Fleet and suffering terrible losses the Rebels have retreated to the rim world of SULLUST hoping to strike back against the tyrannical EMPIRE.

Sensing ultimate victory LORD VADER and his cruel EMPEROR have begun construction of a new battlestation even more powerful than the first dreaded DEATH STAR.

Luke Skywalker has returned to his homeworld of TATOOINE to rescue his friend Han Solo from the vile gangster JABBA THE HUTT unaware of the sinister plots laid against him...."

Ripplin said:

Nice work yet again. I especially like the last frame. The deflection flash looks much better. The original looks like...something I can't quite think of. Part of some comapny's film logo. Paramount? I dunno. Sorta lens flarish.

It's rather like the torch of Columbia