Kingdom of the Crystal Skull Edit Suggestions — Page 16

jones1899 said:

Surely you understand the difference between somebody who takes a crash course in such software as opposed to the quality you get from an experienced professional. No edit is worth doing unless it is entirely seamless. 

Understand?

Also, this "obsessive asking" you're refering to is simply a hope that someone finishes the fine work they've started. I've made it a point to express my understanding that Laser (for instance) is busy and that I just hope someone  who has the experience for what looks to be some pretty heavy edits can do an edit of this film. You mentioned yourself that the Superman Returns edit is being done by a special effects professional. 

And you want US to just pick up some software and learn it? Come on...

I would LOVE to do it myself, if I could...

I understand, but you don't understand the process.  You think just because someone has ideas that its going to get done.  These things generally take a long time to produce, especially when there is digital manipulation going on.  I've been working on an edit of Episode III for over a year and really just got it to a point that I'm happy with.

As for you not having editing experience, there's no way to get it unless you actually do some editing.  You can find an old version of Vegas or a comparable editor on eBAY for a considerably reduced rate, and can gain some experience while working on the project and making it what you want it to be. Clearly those really interested in this project don't have the availability to do this edit, so here is a perfect opportunity to take up a new hobby. 

As for the "obsessives asking":

You ask nearly every day for updates, which amounts to a kid in the backseat asking his dad "Are We There Yet?"  Things like this take a lot of time.  If you were to start editing you would quickly realize this.

"Now we're in the creative and artistic area, which for the most part CAN NOT be learned. " 

Shhhh..don't tell Adywan. 

INv8r_ZIM said:

"Now we're in the creative and artistic area, which for the most part CAN NOT be learned. " 

Shhhh..don't tell Adywan. 

I wish Adywan edited this movie. If he did, it would surely end up being a masterpiece. ;)

^ Ha ha! 'Indiana Jones: Revisited'! Heck, why stop at KOTCS? Let's have a TOD de-Willied and de-Shortrounded while we're at it! And hey, I always thought that the Raven bar shoot-out in ROTLA could use a little touch of back ground music, ala Obi-Wan and Vader's duel in ANH:R!

Ah, wishful thinking...

This is to Jones1898:

My point is valid and I am just saying what needs to be said.  You want this edit done.  Yet no one wants to/ can do it.  So because its not getting done, you are pushing this thread everyday saying your hoping for progress.  You even go as far as to go to threads for other edits asking if that editor will be doing an edit.  You just don't understand that this edit ain't getting done unless someone who is really motivated wants it done.

You want it done, so why not do it.  As I said, you cannot learn something unless you try, and with a little work and practice and trial and error, you can accomplish what other editors have.  Yes, you likely won't be able to achieve the degree immediately, but at least you can get this edit done which you've obviously invested a great deal of time to in the past few months. 

As for editing ideas, I really feel that much has been said.  I'm not the kind of person that would ever share an edit I do, as I do it simply for personal enjoyment.  I'm not harking on your ideas, just trying to point out that you're beating a dead horse.  Give the thread a few days (even a week or two) and time to breathe.  Posting everyday wondering what people's progress is will not get this edit done.  The fact that no one seems to be actively editing it will also hinder progress greatly.  :)

OperationBedlam said:

This is to Jones1898:

 

My point is valid and I am just saying what needs to be said.  You want this edit done.  Yet no one wants to/ can do it.  So because its not getting done, you are pushing this thread everyday saying your hoping for progress.  You even go as far as to go to threads for other edits asking if that editor will be doing an edit.  You just don't understand that this edit ain't getting done unless someone who is really motivated wants it done.

You want it done, so why not do it.  As I said, you cannot learn something unless you try, and with a little work and practice and trial and error, you can accomplish what other editors have.  Yes, you likely won't be able to achieve the degree immediately, but at least you can get this edit done which you've obviously invested a great deal of time to in the past few months. 

 

As for editing ideas, I really feel that much has been said.  I'm not the kind of person that would ever share an edit I do, as I do it simply for personal enjoyment.  I'm not harking on your ideas, just trying to point out that you're beating a dead horse.  Give the thread a few days (even a week or two) and time to breathe.  Posting everyday wondering what people's progress is will not get this edit done.  The fact that no one seems to be actively editing it will also hinder progress greatly.  :)

 

Personally, I think that coming up with the edit ideas (both issues and solutions) is significant progress and will greatly speed up the time it will take to do the actual edit. That's why I'm posting lengthy descriptions of exactly how I think scenes should be edited, even posting sample pics of the suggested edit. Not having to figure those things out at edit time will certainly speed up the work.

Take care,

Ryan

Hmmm - I've been meaning to check out ADigitalman's TOD for a while now, Doctor M. Like you said, it is meant to be a gentle and subtle edit, which is right up my street, as I don't think TOD needs to be completely ripped apart - I actually think it's a great sequel, more action-packed and with greater spectacle than the first, but with key instances that just take you right out of the flick (Willy's noise levels being one).

I'm dying to know, though - could you tell me if the camp-fire scene has been cut from Adigitalman's version? I always thought that that scene could be easily excised, what with doing so making the treck to Pankot Palace seamless (those journeying-on-the-elephants scenes could easily flow together without the camp scene). That was one instance when Willy just got a bit too much for me, even Short Round a little bit as well, and I couldn't imagine how that scene could be trimmed to help this without being completely cut altogether. Heck, there's barely any necessarry exposition or anything at all in that scene; just pure annoyance!

CONTINUING WITH INTERROGATION...

ROSS: Relax, boys. I can vouch for Dr. Jones.

INDY: What the hell is going on?

INDY: KGB on American soil? Who is that woman?

FBI 1: Describe her.

INDY: Tall, thin, mid-30s,

INDY: carried a sword of some kind, a rapier, I think.

Spalko's folder gets thrown on the table

- Now, we need to move up Indy's next line, "Yeah, that's her", so that he says it right after he turns the file towards him on the table, before we pan up to see him.

- Next we use FBI 2 walking across frame as a wipe to cut between two frame sequences. By the time FBI 2 walks far enough to start revealing Indy again, we've already jumped to right before Indy says, "Who is she?" on the underlying video layer. So FBI 2 and everything to the left of him is one frame sequence on the upper video layer, and everything to the right of him is the later video sequence on the lower video layer.

- In the actual movie, as FBI 2 walks across, the camera zooms out a bit. In order to avoid a visual inconsistency, we will need to zoom in as he walks across frame to the same degree that the movie zooms out. This way, when he walks across frame and reveals Indy and Ross behind him, they will not look like they have magically moved a little further away.

- Zooming in like this will also help us by having FBI 2 eventually move all the way out of frame as he walks around the table to stand beside Indy before saying, "General Ross!" and taking away the folder. This helps us because it gives us a point where we can seemlessly switch entirely to the underlying video layer so we're synched up again.

The dialog now goes, "Yeah, that's her .... who is she?" removing the kinda lame...

FBI 2: You sure she's here?

INDY: Here and gone.

Of course Indy's sure she's here. But he can't really know she's gone. She may very well still be relatively close.

I've attached some photoshop manipulations to show this edit in action...

If you take a look at the movie, you will see that this is NOT how it looks when FBI 2 walks across frame.

Ryan

Here's a sample of before and after the wipe with the lower level frame zoomed after the wipe to maintain the appearance of a consistent distance. I think it looks pretty good ... wouldn't even notice there was a change.

Ryan

I'm still tackling the Jungle Chase, so here are some more color-correction comparisons for that sequence:

In spite of my initial hesitation of adding additional camera-shake to the shots, I've changed my mind, and will add them now, as it looks like the scenes feel at least a little more intense with them. I wish I had some good engine sound-effects (like trucks accelerating or driving at high speed), as adding them to some shots might give a better feeling of velocity, so if anybody can help out here...

I'll post some clips when I'm a little further into it.

I'm amazed at what a difference the colour correction makes. I mean, Indy actually looks like he's outdoors in those corrected shots.

I'm happy to stay patient for this one, Laser, though these glimpses of your excellent work doens't make it easy.

the colours generally look better, but still don't look quite right, also be mindful that you are beginning to lose detail, especially in the brighter areas. The high contrast and low saturation just look out of place here.

Johnny Ringo said:

also be mindful that you are beginning to lose detail, especially in the brighter areas. The high contrast and low saturation just look out of place here.

I've read the "losing detail"-argument regarding my color-correction before, and I dare to disagree. The movie itself is already boosted in the highlights, but grading pushed them down a bit again. This doesn't change the fact that those areas are already (nearly) over-exposed, but grading changed those pure-whites into some yellow/orange tones, and not white anymore. As I'm taking out that ugly color-tinting (which turns the yellowish highlights into greys), there's no reason to not expand the luminance to the full spectrum again, thus pushing the brightest whites to the maximum again.

I'm pretty sure that my correction makes the movie look more like when it was shot (which can be seen in some of the first teasers, which weren't color-graded as strongly as the final movie). Furthermore the criticised "high contrast and low saturation" is - in my opinion - the look that was established by the first three films, and as we're aiming for consistency with those, I think this is the right way to go. (By the way, I didn't desaturate the whole image, but mainly the greens, as they were obviously boosted)

Lasershwert, those latest 'colour correction' shots really seem to make this whole thing look a lot better already.  Terrific stuff. 

Like Adywan's work, I would far prefer to see the likes of what you are achieving throughout this movie, rather than the colouring that was actually put on the DVD release.  This thing can yet be great!  :)

I seem to remember someone posting a while back somewhere, that they had access to professional 'libraries' of 'sound FX', and that they were happy to help out with someone.  Can't remember who that was at the moment, but will try to find out sometime.

HeKS said:

OperationBedlam said:

As for editing ideas, I really feel that much has been said.  I'm not the kind of person that would ever share an edit I do, as I do it simply for personal enjoyment.  I'm not harking on your ideas, just trying to point out that you're beating a dead horse.  Give the thread a few days (even a week or two) and time to breathe.  Posting everyday wondering what people's progress is will not get this edit done.  The fact that no one seems to be actively editing it will also hinder progress greatly.  :)

 

Personally, I think that coming up with the edit ideas (both issues and solutions) is significant progress and will greatly speed up the time it will take to do the actual edit. That's why I'm posting lengthy descriptions of exactly how I think scenes should be edited, even posting sample pics of the suggested edit. Not having to figure those things out at edit time will certainly speed up the work.

I've enjoyed what I've seen on this thread so far, and if something can come of it all by someone, then that's great for us all.  Some nice ideas along the way too, by the way HeKS. 

I'm just glad the likes of Adywan didn't feel the same way as OperationBedlam did here, or we'd never have even seen his 'Star Wars:Revisited', or much else from anyone....  ;)

Great stuff Laser - that colour correction really does tie in with the older films, and I think the detail and quality look excellent!

And cheers for the info Dr. M - I've decided to hunt down Adigitalman's Temple of Doom edit; think it might be just what I'm after.

Laser,

That color correction is looking pretty great. For the first time it looks like this movie is set in the same universe as the first three ... and for the first time I'm starting to believe that the Jungle Chase actually might take place in a real jungle. The only one that looks washed out to me is the 6th sample image you posted, but since it's incredibly washed out in the original, too, I doubt there's much you can do about it.

I don't know if you've taken a look at my photoshop edits showing what I think might work for certain scenes, but if you have, do they seem like something you could do in the video?

Take care,
Ryan

Laserschwert said:

I'm still tackling the Jungle Chase, so here are some more color-correction comparisons for that sequence:

 

AMAZING work, Laser! I was afraid that you abandonned this project!

What really pissed me off in KOTCS was Indy's clothes being green, but now everything looks in line with the originals! Great work! Even the jungle looks 100x more natural now!

Please post clips soon!

INDY: KGB on American soil? Who is that woman?

The problem is that Jones already called "that woman" by her name earlier in the movie at the Area 51. Am I wrong?