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Not me; the PT unmasked Lucas's alleged talet.
Every 27th customer will get a ball-peen hammer, free!
State of the Trilogy/ annual SW depression — Page 8
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Not me; the PT unmasked Lucas's alleged "talent."
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In general, I agree with you entirely. Until being exposed to ADigitalMan's fanedits, I avoided the PT as much as possible. Too many cringe-inducing moments. But a good slapstick/juvenile humor/silliness-reducing edit of the PT can actually be quite enjoyable. Not on the same level as the OT, of course, but the prequels - for all their absurdity and cheesiness - definitely had their moments. I've always thoroughly enjoyed Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan. When I think about each prequel movie, I have to admit that the core stories GL came up with on which to base the movies are actually pretty good. The problems are in the details (too many "Star Wars babies" subplots, contraditions with the OT, etc.) and in the execution (fart & poo jokes, Jake Lloyd/Jar-Jar silliness, too much CGI, Hayden's woodenness, etc.).
All that to say that I don't think he's totally talentless; he'd probably do a great job as a conceptual consultant for a movie or series of movies. But as a filmmaker responsible for all the creative decisions including screenwriting, directing, and micromanaging every individual element? He's absolutely the wrong man for the job.
Seems to me that ESB and ROTJ were made to shine because of Kershner and Kasdan. With ANH, GL didn't have the wiggle room necessary to fill the film with silliness and immaturity, what with the well documented time and budget constraints he had to work with.
What seriously bugs me is the lack of respect he's repeatedly shown toward his original fanbase. "They're my movies; I can change 'em any way I want to" seems a pretty egotistical philosophy to me. One ought not to ostracize the fans that made one rich in the first place.
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There's a big difference between a desire to see some proper preservation done, and Lucas bashing. And the flat out bashing that DOES go on around here is positively mild and limited, compared to well...everywhere on da internet that isn't TFN. Poor Lucas is a constant punchline out there man, look around. At least this place is celebrating that he did do something great once, something we all want out there more than he does! This forum might be the most genuinely flattering thing ever done about Lucas!
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Akwat Kbrana said:
Blindly accepting everything that comes out of Lucas' mouth is as absurd as blindly hating everything the man has ever done post-1980. Criticism isn't about being slanderous; it's about thinking for ones' self and discussing a myriad of views intelligently. I don't think you'll be crucified over here if you happen to enjoy The Phantom Menace. You may get a good deal of arguments and heated discussions as to why it's an inferior movie, but not crucified as seems to be the Modus Operendi on most gusher forums I've visited.
I can pretty much attest to this as well. We've had plenty of new folks join recently and quite a few of them love the PT. Myself, and others, have wondered why they love it so much, but none of us have tried to keep them from having their own opinion.
I haven't visited TFN forums in more than 3 years (ever since ROTS came out), so I don't really know how bad it's gotten over there. I don't care to find out either. The last time I went there, one of the headlines couldn't help but feel sorry for GL that he couldn't find a home for the latest Clone Wars series. Despite everything that's happened, as far as they were concerned, it was the network executives fault for not simply taking Star Wars on the name alone.
You are disciplined but tolerant; a true American.
Pissing off Rob since August 2007.
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TFN really exasperated the whole basher/gusher thing, and it is sad because there are alot of people who are in the middle, and got caught taking one side or another. What happened at TFN to me and most people I knew, was that we loved the OT, kinda liked the PT, but felt it could have been better and we aired our grievences there. Those people did not want to hear it, as if you ever spoke ill about ANYTHING towards the PT, you were considered a basher.
I remember defending the PT before ROTS, cause I always said to people, "Lets see the story out, then evaluate if it works as a trilogy." But I would still post that Jar Jar was annoying, and the romance was pretty bad, and always said my 2 favorite SW movies were SW & ESB. I got loads of PM's telling me to leave the site and they wondered why I would post here. People like Shelley who would chastise me for criticising the PT, would then turn around and say, "Well, the OT always had bad dialogue, bad acting, and cater to kids, etc." I used to laugh at the irony that they were trying to bring the OT down, by criticising that trilogy to make their points defending the PT! Isn't that an oxymoron?
I got permabanned 2 years ago after I said Lucas was a being really disrespectful to the fans for the '06 OOT release, and man they shouted me down there, "You are getting what you deserve!!!" I used to respond, "Before 1997, those were the versions you fell in love with, and now you are laughing cause Lucas is putting them out in shitty quality?" Finally Darth Sapient permabanned me and sent me a PM, "Nobody cares about the OOT anymore, the saga is 6 movies, as you will never post here again."
Thank god those people weren't our founding fathers in America, as we would have had a dictatorship instead of a democracy. Strange bunch there......
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CO, your above post is the reason why I'll never go there.
A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em
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CO, you got banned? Wow, time flies. It seems like just yesterday that you and zombie were posting there. The thread about the big announcement of the unaltered versions hitting dvd is what first springs to mind.
I lost a great deal of respect for TF.N when I saw this interview:
http://www.thedigitalbits.com/mytwocentsa127.html (scroll to a little more than halfway down. When you see a picture from Empire of Yoda, click on it. It's an embedded video. Yes, after almost two years it's still there.)
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Thanks for that video- I hadn't seen it.
It's amazing - the guy from TF.N is the only one who didn't get it. He really sounds like he's on GL's payroll.
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Well, there are some people who grew up on the Laserdisc/VHS quality; so I almost understood him. Up until he basically made fun of the rest of us for wanting to see it in the quality they see the SEs.
A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em
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Anybody who uses Jar Jar voice clips and jedi rocks in their podcasts is a joke anyway.
I really like how that guy says no one cares about the oot getting restored, apparently Robert Harris is a nobody.
Someone should mention the versions of star wars and empire on the afi lists are the original versions, not the uber super crappy fake cgi bastard editions.
TFN gushers really piss me off. They love the prequels so much they should convince the academy of motion picture arts and sciences to have a special category for racist characters and poop and fart jokes.
“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.
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That clip is interesting. Is the TFN guy really that dense? Or is he a Sansweet-type shill? Either way, he skeeves me out.
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Anyone who doesn't know the difference between film grain & old special effects vs. non-anamorphic & low resolution transfers oughtn't to be interviewed on such a subject to begin with.
Every 27th customer will get a ball-peen hammer, free!
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Baronlando said:
That clip is interesting. Is the TFN guy really that dense? Or is he a Sansweet-type shill? Either way, he skeeves me out.
I'm guessing he's just a dick.
"Now all Lucas has to do is make a cgi version of himself. It will be better than the original and fit his original vision." - skyjedi2005
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Yeah Josh Griffin is a real tool, I remember when that talkshow segment was released. I suspect he might have been recieving a blowjob from George Lucas live on the air.
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Kevin Perrera (spell?), the host, seemed to be on Josh's side. That, or he just thinks no one'll ever be happy.
A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em
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I think the host just wanted to give equal voice to all three speakers, which is fair. The Digital Bits guy tended to dominate since he had the most sensible things to say, so undue attention was given to Josh just to give him a chance to compete.
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The current word on Indy IV is that it will in fact be hitting blu-ray (I never seriously believed that it wouldn't). Digitalbits says an announcement at Comic-Con is likely.
I guess we're looking at LFL's first blu-ray release pretty soon.
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just wanted to bump this thread up..
(yes, this brings the number of LFL's blu-rays up to 2 - including clone wars,
and not including all the different versions)..
i just couldn't find this thread using search,
it took me forever..
later
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[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]
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I'm just horrified they're messing with the old Indy films. Here we go again...
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Wonder if these minor tweaks will make it to the inevitable blu-ray of IJ... hope not.
A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em
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CO said:sent me a PM, "Nobody cares about the OOT anymore, the saga is 6 movies, as you will never post here again."
Question, do we have any idea how numerous OOT fans are? I don't mean actual figures. I mean is there a lot of us? How numerous are we compared to TFN-type fans? How numerous are we compared to older fans who've accepted the SE and don't care about the OOT?
And btw, to hell with the "saga" and six movies and Lucas's bloody "vision". Star Wars is not what resides in Lucas's head, it's what made it onto the screen back in the 70s and 80s. I couldn't care less about the "saga" of the force being balanced with the aid of sub-par movies that didn't need to be made. Star Wars is NOT the story of Darth Vader. It's the story of Luke Skywalker, and Leia and Han -Vader's just the bad guy who gets a handy redemption at the end.
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Well, you could start with all the people who signed the petition here- and there are many others out there. I think it's safe to say that everyone who saw SW and the 2 sequels in their initial runs would qualify.
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Vaderisnothayden said:CO said:sent me a PM, "Nobody cares about the OOT anymore, the saga is 6 movies, as you will never post here again."
Question, do we have any idea how numerous OOT fans are? I don't mean actual figures. I mean is there a lot of us? How numerous are we compared to TFN-type fans? How numerous are we compared to older fans who've accepted the SE and don't care about the OOT?
I look at it this way, what do the majority of SW fans prefer? I still say the OOT. I have many friends who bought the '04 SE DVD because it was the OT in any form, and they all say to me, "I just put up with the changes, what can you do?" You'll never going to know on the internet, because it is only a small fraction of the SW fanbase, so what we see posted everyday on SW websites really can't be judged as anything specific.
The bottom line is if you ask the majority of SW fans these questions:
1. Do you want Han shooting first reinstated?
2. Do you want the Jabba scene in Star Wars taken out?
3. Do you want Jedi Rock taken out in ROTJ for the old song?
4. Do you want the original ending with old man Anakin rather then Hayden?
5. Do you want Vaders line in ESB, "Bring my shuttle!" back
The majority of SW fans would say yes to all these questions, so they are the major changes to the OOT that everyone hates. Now if Lucas did some special effect changes, and didn't take any actors out I believe the OOT vs SE wouldn't exist.
We'll never know, but if Lucas put out on BluRay the OOT in one boxset and the SE in another boxset in the same quality, I still say the OOT would sell more, because the PT/SE fanbase is still a niche fanbase compared to the OOT fans who really never got into the PT movies and dont' have much of a voice anymore, as they probably moved on sometime after ROTJ.
I’m an original member here dating back to 2004. Haven’t posted in years, but looking forward to posting again.
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bkev said:Wonder if these minor tweaks will make it to the inevitable blu-ray of IJ... hope not.
Well, if they're on the HD masters that they've been using for TV then it's likely they'll be on the blu-rays too. :-/