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Let's Talk Indy For A Sec

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 (Edited)

I didn't know whether to put this in SW discussion or off-topic, but its about Lucas so I think it'll work here.

There's already talk of a 5th Indiana Jones film in the works and Spielberg and Harrison are willing to make one.

Now I love Indiana Jones. I immediately fell in love with the man in the hat when I was about 6 years old. Over the summer I was excited to see the new film and I thought it was okay. The first half of the movie was great. The warehouse chase, the American Graffitti like opening, the Nuclear bomb (yes, I like nuking the fridge), the chase through the university. I started to get a little bored when Indy and Mutt reach Peru. The whole scene where they find and skull and discuss the whole history of the skull (again) was boring. Indy already explained the skull in the coffee shop at the university, why does he have to explain more? Plus the revealing of the skull wasn't great. When they find the ark the music builds up and we have to wait until they remove the lid until we finally see it.

Another reason for my excitement about this film was Karen Allen's return. Karen is great actress who hasn't gotten a lot roles in many years. Marion Ravenwood was the best Indy girl and one of its best characters. But her and Indy didn't have a lot of interaction with each other. When they finally reach the temple (or whatever it is) its basically walking from one room to the next. 

Overall I enjoyed it. Steven's direction was great (as always), the special effects (less CGI please), the stunts, the lighting, and of course Harrison (even though he has a couple corny lines).

What don't I like? George Lucas and David Koepp's writing. The Monkeys, the dragging plot. In the previous movies they spend one scene where detail the artifact. Radiers (university), Temple (village, jungle), Crusade (Donavan's Apartment, there are discussions about location of the grail but they're short and interesting). The scene where they're in the Russian camp went on too long.

So now George wants another. I'm drawn two ways. One: I want another to get Crystal Skull out of my mouth. Two: I don't want Lucas screwing up Indy like he did with SW. Lucas has said in an interview that Steven didn't really want to do another Indy film, which I can understand after doing Munich and Saving Private Ryan. But now Steven is excited about doing another film. Problem is that Steven wants to the next film the old way like the older films (you know, the good ones) and Lucas wants new stuff (like Crystal Skull). In the other films it was mostly Steven who mapped out most of the film's great action sequences. He story boarded the entire Airplane Fight in Raiders and the trap scenes from Crusade. Lucas primarly came up with the artifact and put his money in as executive producer, which he had should have done with this film. It was also Steven who came up with the idea of bringing Indy's father into the mix.

I have great respect for Steven. He's a filmmaker who still holds onto the 70's way of filmmaking. While he does use CGI, he likes to keep it down and still works on sets. Unlike lucas where EVERYTHING including the floor is CGI and green screen. I have some respect for Lucas too. After watching THX-1138, American Graffitti, and SW I felt that was Lucas was a master of storytelling and direction. And then I watched the trailer for Star Wars: Clone Wars.... need I say more? Lucas is always trying to make his films kid friendly. I watched Raiders when I was 6 and the melting head had no effect on me. I thought it was awesome. You don't see Steven putting a cute pink bow on Jaws.

So I feel that Lucas should let Steven do most of the storytelling in this film. Lucas he can play with your Yoda and Jar-Jar dolls all you want. But leave Indy alone! (I'm starting to sound like that "Let Britney alone" guy).

Anyone share the same opinion? 

 

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CS said:

Anyone share the same opinion? 

I'm guessing yes (to one degree or another). Star Wars is much more important to me than the Indiana Jones series, but other than that I wholeheartedly share your sentiments.

"Now all Lucas has to do is make a cgi version of himself.  It will be better than the original and fit his original vision." - skyjedi2005

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 (Edited)

From slashfilm.com

 

Lucas explains to the AP: “They wanted to go off on some other tangent. I said, ‘I’m not going to do that. I’m going to stick with this no matter what, so we either do this or we don’t. That’s it.’ Finally, we got something that we could all compromise on and all be happy with. It wasn’t quite as wacky as I wanted it to be, but it still is subtle and nice and works really well and has the same idea behind it.”

 

Wow, if it wasn't for Spielberg and Harrison's protest over the story, this film could have been worse.

 

 

 

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And I'm still "Indy4 free". I don't want to suffer like I did after watching SW prequels...

I saw the original theatrical release of the Old Trilogy on the big screen and I'm proud of it...
How did I accomplish that (considering my age) is my secret...
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 (Edited)

i'm just glad the dvd versions, and high def versions are here,

just finished watching them...

 

and thankfully this movie wiped out the horrible memories

of temple of doom, and the last crusade, so i can finally

forget that those existed..

 

can't wait for another great indiana jones

story to come out..

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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I can understand Temple of Doom.

But Last Crusade!? That's the second best after Raiders.

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negative1 said:

aha... more good news about the next indiana jones..

 

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/herocomplex/2008/10/harrison-ford-s.html

 

later

-1

You should have just wrote, 'more news about the next Indiana Jones movie.'  because not everyone wants to see more sequels.  Temple of Doom was OK, Last Crusade was a rehash of Raiders, and Crystal Skull was an utter joke.  Some of us feel that the Indy series should be put into the grave and nailed shut.  Although Raiders is still one of my favorite movies of all-time, so if Lucas could put the RIGHT Indiana Jones movie out on BluRay he may actually get some money from me:)

 

I’m an original member here dating back to 2004. Haven’t posted in years, but looking forward to posting again.

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For me it's:

1. Raiders

2. Last Crusade

3. Crystal Skull

4. Temple of Doom

 

I actually liked CS... aside from the monkeys, the spaceship and the cheesy ending. I HATE Temple of Doom however. It's just a terrible film. I'm sorry, Temple of Doom sucks. From the racist views on Indians to the shitty plot revolving around a ridiculously stupid artifact, this movie just screams crap.

 

Star Wars Renascent

Inspired by the Godfather Part II and a revamp of Star Wars: Reborn

View the discussion thread

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You're not alone. Even Speilberg does not care for it. 

But I have to admit that the opening 20 minutes of the movie was great. The movie picks up again when Indy breaks out of his spell and starts kicking some ass.

How is the film racist? I don't see anything racist about.

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Chewy72 said:

You should have just wrote, 'more news about the next Indiana Jones movie.'  because not everyone wants to see more sequels.  Temple of Doom was OK, Last Crusade was a rehash of Raiders, and Crystal Skull was an utter joke.  Some of us feel that the Indy series should be put into the grave and nailed shut.  Although Raiders is still one of my favorite movies of all-time, so if Lucas could put the RIGHT Indiana Jones movie out on BluRay he may actually get some money from me:)

 

 

 well,

i could have said, hmm... after 'raiders of the lost ark' came out,

no sequel should EVER have been made, because it will never be equal

to it right?           

 

but life isn't like that, right?(i feel the same way about 'star wars',

the rest shouldn't have been made right?).....

 

movies, and entertainment are ALWAYS about money,

yeah, some of you think they're art, and maybe some are..

 

but not these movies, they were made for money, made to earn

money, and made to generate more money, and you think

that's going to stop?  if we're lucky, sometimes it does.... but most

of the time it doesn't, and what do you get? sequels, prequels, spin-offs..

 

it's not going to stop now, and probably never will..

so you hope for the best, and if you like it great.

if you don't, just ignore it, and pretend it never happened..

 

some people take these movies way too seriously, and too

personally, which is why they get all worked up when someone

criticizes something they like..

 

they're ONLY movies, ENTERTAINMENT, nothing else to see hear,

move along, nothing to see here..... (if they did change your life, ie: star wars did for me,

more power to you)...indiana jones, as great as it was, never did..

 

later

-1

 

 

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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CS said:

You're not alone. Even Speilberg does not care for it. 

But I have to admit that the opening 20 minutes of the movie was great. The movie picks up again when Indy breaks out of his spell and starts kicking some ass.

How is the film racist? I don't see anything racist about.

Are you really that ignorant? Seriously... the "tribesmen" from Raiders, the Indians from Doom, and the South Americans in Skull? What about the Chinese people in Doom and the middle easterns in Raiders? Man, go do some research on the people's actual cultures and get back to me.

 

Star Wars Renascent

Inspired by the Godfather Part II and a revamp of Star Wars: Reborn

View the discussion thread

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 (Edited)

Wow, thanks for insulting me.

 

People take Indiana Jones way too seriously. It's an action adventure film based on the old serials so of course things are over-the-top. It's a movie, not a documentary. If I wanted to learn people's cultures I would watch National Geographic. 

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negative1 said:

 

it's not going to stop now, and probably never will..

so you hope for the best, and if you like it great.

if you don't, just ignore it, and pretend it never happened..

 

some people take these movies way too seriously, and too

personally, which is why they get all worked up when someone

criticizes something they like..

 

 

Dude, we are on a message board, please lighten up with the 'people take things way too seriously' babble.

As for forgetting these movies after the original, did you buy the 'Boxset' in 2003?  When it came to DVD, you couldn't buy just Raiders, or just Temple of Doom, or just Last Crusade, you had to buy them all or nothing.  So as I try to forget about those movies, the only way I could watch the classic Raiders of the Lost Ark, was shelling out 70 bucks for the Indiana Jones Trilogy Set:)

 

I’m an original member here dating back to 2004. Haven’t posted in years, but looking forward to posting again.

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Asteroid-Man said:

Are you really that ignorant? Seriously... the "tribesmen" from Raiders, the Indians from Doom, and the South Americans in Skull? What about the Chinese people in Doom and the middle easterns in Raiders? Man, go do some research on the people's actual cultures and get back to me.

 

 

You really call that racist? That is sad. Most people would not see it that way. In foreign media, you'll find exagerated depictions of Americans. Fair enough. I can see how real Indians may take offense, just like Americans get offended when they see how they are depicted or seen through others eyes.

As was mentioned already, Indiana Jones is NOT a documentary, hopefully people are not dumb enough to treat it like one and expect to learn anything real about the world from it.

Maybe the inaccurate and stereotypical depictions in the film could be considered ignorant, but they sure are not racist.

 

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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Chewy72 said:

Dude, we are on a message board, please lighten up with the 'people take things way too seriously' babble.

As for forgetting these movies after the original, did you buy the 'Boxset' in 2003?  When it came to DVD, you couldn't buy just Raiders, or just Temple of Doom, or just Last Crusade, you had to buy them all or nothing.  So as I try to forget about those movies, the only way I could watch the classic Raiders of the Lost Ark, was shelling out 70 bucks for the Indiana Jones Trilogy Set:)

 

actually i bought the boxset for my parents, copied it, and made

a stereo mix, since there was only a surround sound version on it..ughh..

 

now at least you can buy them all separately, and just buy the first part

separately..

 

later

-1

 

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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C3PX said:
Asteroid-Man said:

Are you really that ignorant? Seriously... the "tribesmen" from Raiders, the Indians from Doom, and the South Americans in Skull? What about the Chinese people in Doom and the middle easterns in Raiders? Man, go do some research on the people's actual cultures and get back to me.

 

 

You really call that racist? That is sad. Most people would not see it that way. In foreign media, you'll find exagerated depictions of Americans. Fair enough. I can see how real Indians may take offense, just like Americans get offended when they see how they are depicted or seen through others eyes.

As was mentioned already, Indiana Jones is NOT a documentary, hopefully people are not dumb enough to treat it like one and expect to learn anything real about the world from it.

Maybe the inaccurate and stereotypical depictions in the film could be considered ignorant, but they sure are not racist.

 


 

i'm of asian descent, and i had no problems with the depictions..

of course it was a terrible movie, so it was pretty much a moot point..

 

i'm sure those of german descent probably didn't care for the constant

depiction of nazis..

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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Asteroid-Man said:
CS said:

You're not alone. Even Speilberg does not care for it. 

But I have to admit that the opening 20 minutes of the movie was great. The movie picks up again when Indy breaks out of his spell and starts kicking some ass.

How is the film racist? I don't see anything racist about.

Are you really that ignorant? Seriously... the "tribesmen" from Raiders, the Indians from Doom, and the South Americans in Skull? What about the Chinese people in Doom and the middle easterns in Raiders? Man, go do some research on the people's actual cultures and get back to me.

 

 

 Someone really flew into the defensive.

"Fuck you. All the star wars movies were excellent. none of them sucked. Also, revenge of the sith is the best."

- DarthZorgon (YouTube)

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Well Jar Jar certainly was a racist character.  LOL

Seriously though the scene where Indy shoots the arab swordsman has always been a favorite even though the radical islam  use movies like that as an excuse for 911 and hating the usa.

I am suprised the arab swordsman does not now try running indy through and misses Like greedo shooting first.

The indiana jones special editions trilogy when released will have bad and fakely added cgi and walkie talkies instead of guns.

Another favorite scene is from true lies when the radical islam terrorist is on the missile and arnold says " you're fired!" and blows the helicopter to hell and the dude with the missile, lol.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

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Anyone watch the new South Park? Apparently Stone and Parker hated Crystal Skull.

 

In the episode, Indiana is depicted getting raped Deliverance style by Speilberg and Lucas. hilarious stuff.

"Fuck you. All the star wars movies were excellent. none of them sucked. Also, revenge of the sith is the best."

- DarthZorgon (YouTube)

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Well it is pretty true fans got their childhood raped twice.  First the 3 prequels and then indiana jones IV.

While the creators of south park may make light of this fact i want my ten dollars back for indiana jones IV.  The movie was like a huge fuck you to the fanbase, that you wish was an april fools joke that came late in may.  That movie was the biggest peice of shit since the star wars prequels i have ever seen.  I left the theater feeling empty, angry and betrayed.  I wish someone would start a petition demanding Lucas and Speilberg to retire and Stop making movies, they fucking suck as directors now.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.

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I wouldn't go blaming Spielberg, it was George and Koepp's shitty writing. Steven is still a real director while George just puts people in front of green screens.

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i'm surprised both Spielberg and Koepp still have jobs after war of the worlds and kingdom of the crystal skull.

To be honest the last Speilberg Pictures i enjoyed were Minority Report and AI and they were far from perfect, but Speilberg like Lucas has more flops than sucesses.

Amistad, Jurassic Park II, War of the Worlds, Munich, Catch me if you can all terrible movies.  Then their is temple of doom, 1941, hook etc.  With gems like Close Encounters, Jaws and Raiders, as well as e.t. along the way.  As well as modern films that are undeniable classics like private ryan and shindlers list.  With films Like the first Jurassic Park that are middle of the road and far from a terrible movie, you just feel cheated if you read the book first because the book was amazing and the movie was ok to pretty entertaining. 

What on the other hand has Lucas done since 1983 and return of the jedi except bring back beloved franchises and crap all over them.  I would have had no problems if the new star wars and jones features were like the old ones and not video game cutscenes with cgi and zero story.  Lucas and Speilberg are supposed to be directors of films not videogames that you watch instead of play.  Games are great as a medium i just don't pay to see them in the cinemas.  and There are games that have far better stories even witn their recycled cliche plots unlike modern lucas films.

I feel the Same way about Robert Zemechis i do about Spielberg and Lucas, Beowulf was an awful, awful movie.  And that train movie just bored me to tears though my niece and nephew loved the book.  I guess i should be glad he did not make a back to the future 4 following Lucas and Spielbergs example and crap all over the originals with bad cgi and script.  Though II and III while entertaining are pretty crap movies compared to part 1 which stands on its own and is a classic, probably the only good thing bob z ever did right in the film business.

Return of the Jedi and Last crusade were perfect notes to end on and we did not need more.  sometimes less is more and is proven in this case where the franchises have become incridibly lackluster in story but filled to the brim with CGI and technical pizazz.

I guess i can stomach the horrible prequels though, because if they were not made and made so much money we probably would not have gotten the much superior Lord of the Rings trilogy.

I probably could abide the prequels if they were some other bad sci fi movie, but the have star wars on them.  these movies don't measure up at all to the originals.  The thing any new star wars is measured against is empire strikes back Anything comes short of it it sucks.  Similar that in indiana jones every movie is measured against raiders.  Return of the Jedi and Last Crusade were not perfect movies but they still had yet to lapse into total suckdom.

People should recal the first time Lucas made a prequel and shudder, it was Temple of doom.  The next time he made a prequel was young indy and that sucked as well, except for maybe some of the sean patrick flannery ones and still they were no raiders.  I give them that Trenches of Hell was genius.  other than that it was phoned in and riding off nostalgia and the coatails of the trilogy sound familiar?  The same thing happened with Phantom menace, attack of the clones and revenge of the sith and kingdom of the crystal skull.

I don't think their is a single thing i loved as a kid that has come out unscathed in hollywood.  Transformers by bay was an abomination, Gi Joe probably will be too as well as the masters of the universe remake and thundercats remake, and voltron remakes.  Even Superman was ruined by Bryan Singer who was at the time both the savior of the comic book movie and the x-men franchise.  X-3 by that Other dude was frickin awful.

I've been done this road before with the awful batman and robin, the awful superman III and IV, and the ang lee hulk.  Thankfully Iron Man and Dark Knight are good movies.  I cannot believe i payed 10 bucks to see indy 4 instead of iron man.  I also paid to see that gay Spidey 3 movie and passed on Pirates 3 but that is another story.

“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.