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SE Trilogy on DVD coming this Fall — Page 6

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That really saved Star Trek? Wow.

I think an organized march on Skywalker Ranch would be great. But the logistics would be near impossible.
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
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Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
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Damn. What if everyone just sent back their Special Edition VHS sets with a note that said "NO Thanks", directly to Lucas himself? COuld you imagine having to accept 50000 copies of the Star Wars trilogy on VHS?

Hey. Desperate times/measures/etc.
Matt

Wannabe polygamist and damn proud of it!

FYI: 'Lord of the Rings' is the new 'Star Wars'.

Frankenblog.com!
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For as often as I never watch it...
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
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Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
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It's settled, then. I'm sending back my special editions. Straight to Lucas himself with a nice letter telling him that I will not purchase the new DVDs until he makes the original versions available.

There is no good reason to not put out the original versions on DVD. It's the kind of thing DVD was made for.

F Lucas! F him raw!
Matt

Wannabe polygamist and damn proud of it!

FYI: 'Lord of the Rings' is the new 'Star Wars'.

Frankenblog.com!
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Get the address.
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
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Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com
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Done.

Although nothing direct. All PO BOXES with those Lucasfolk.

Still, it'll get to the right person. And people will start to talk...
Matt

Wannabe polygamist and damn proud of it!

FYI: 'Lord of the Rings' is the new 'Star Wars'.

Frankenblog.com!
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Frankenblog has a helluva idea, get me the PO Box and ill send my SE vhs back too, IM all about getting lucas to understand just what he is dealing with, make him just like Spielberg.
You must unlearn what you have learned.
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While I like the idea of making him "just like Spielberg" in the sense of releasing both versions of their movies on DVD, I think both need to be schooled in the concept of "leaving well enough alone."
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
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Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com
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must admit, the nice avatar guy has a good idea...
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent."
Qui-Gon Jinn (R.I.P.)
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George Lucas is a very rich and powerful man. He doesn't need Star Wars to make another penny to be well off. He's also made clear that no amount of petitions will make a difference, and frankly 50,000 or even 100,000 signatures is nothing compared to the millions of fans who don't care or even know there is a difference. A boycott is neither practical or realistic. Flooding mailboxes and annoying people with demands or threats will only raise their ire and fundamentally cast ourselves in a negative light, and open to ridicule and dismissal. Certainly if someone made demands or threats to me, I would promptly ignore them.

But we have to do something.

Besides being rich and powerful, George considers himself an artist. "We realize there's a lot of debate out there," says Jim Ward. "But this is not a democracy. We love our fans, but this is about art and filmmaking. [George] has decided that the sole version he wants available is this one."

An artist who was hurt when some of his fans thought his later more personal work was inferior to work he did as younger man in collaboration with others. An artist who is rich and powerful enough, and now arrogant enough to defy his nay-sayers and critics and forge ahead alone.

But he is still an artist, and art benefits everyone. It is the very meaning of culture. George the artist must be reminded that art in all its forms or variations benefits everyone in its continued existence. We don't bury our art history or replace it with something new, we treasure our history. We study it and learn from its natural growth, its changes from ere to era.

My point is that we don't make demands. I'm a patron of the arts, and a patron of George's for many years, as I'm sure everyone else here is. We established a relationship early on by paying for work that we enjoyed. George has moved on now and so he should. But regardless of whether we enjoy his current work or not, the work from the past must not be forgotten. It must be cherished and valued. That is what we must do. Not beg or plead. Never that. We must remind him of the value of of historical art. The original Star Wars trilogy is that art. It has touched so many, myself included. So that is what we should remember.

We have to convince him that there is artistic and creative value in preserving the originals for everyone now, and for future generations to see and learn from. I think that is something that everyone, including George might agree with.

I won't purchase the release in Sept'04, but I remain hopeful for the future after that.

The original Star Wars trilogy: Our cultural history deserves to be preserved and should be available to the public like all great works of art!
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I never would have thought that Lucas's preference of art to money would be our downfall.

Or that the announcement of the OT on DVD would be the worst day of my life.

My stance on revising fan edits.

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Originally posted by: Hal 9000
Or that the announcement of the OT on DVD would be the worst day of my life.

Who'd've thunk it?
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
-------------------------
Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com
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Originally posted by: sweyland
George Lucas is a very rich and powerful man. He doesn't need Star Wars to make another penny to be well off. He's also made clear that no amount of petitions will make a difference, and frankly 50,000 or even 100,000 signatures is nothing compared to the millions of fans who don't care or even know there is a difference. A boycott is neither practical or realistic. Flooding mailboxes and annoying people with demands or threats will only raise their ire and fundamentally cast ourselves in a negative light, and open to ridicule and dismissal. Certainly if someone made demands or threats to me, I would promptly ignore them.

But we have to do something.

Besides being rich and powerful, George considers himself an artist. "We realize there's a lot of debate out there," says Jim Ward. "But this is not a democracy. We love our fans, but this is about art and filmmaking. [George] has decided that the sole version he wants available is this one."

An artist who was hurt when some of his fans thought his later more personal work was inferior to work he did as younger man in collaboration with others. An artist who is rich and powerful enough, and now arrogant enough to defy his nay-sayers and critics and forge ahead alone.

But he is still an artist, and art benefits everyone. It is the very meaning of culture. George the artist must be reminded that art in all its forms or variations benefits everyone in its continued existence. We don't bury our art history or replace it with something new, we treasure our history. We study it and learn from its natural growth, its changes from ere to era.

My point is that we don't make demands. I'm a patron of the arts, and a patron of George's for many years, as I'm sure everyone else here is. We established a relationship early on by paying for work that we enjoyed. George has moved on now and so he should. But regardless of whether we enjoy his current work or not, the work from the past must not be forgotten. It must be cherished and valued. That is what we must do. Not beg or plead. Never that. We must remind him of the value of of historical art. The original Star Wars trilogy is that art. It has touched so many, myself included. So that is what we should remember.

We have to convince him that there is artistic and creative value in preserving the originals for everyone now, and for future generations to see and learn from. I think that is something that everyone, including George might agree with.

I won't purchase the release in Sept'04, but I remain hopeful for the future after that.



Your pretty much correct. There are millions of Star Wars fans who either prefer the Special Editions or just don't care. I bet the number of fans who are willing to boycott the DVDs for lack of orginal versions is in the 10,000s at most. Those 30,000 - 50,000 lost sales won't hurt Lucases wallet enough. I will be surprised if the orginals do become availble.
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Come on Jimbo, no pessimism allowed from now on, you may be happy with CGI crap, but Ill be damned if anyone will tell me the people who signed this petition mean nothing. Thats asonine to think that over 50,000 fans mean nothing. So Jimbo you have fun in September, waste your money on that faux star wars you call the special editions, I and many others will continue to wait for what we believe is one of the greatest, unaltered, films of all time to come out in an advanced format we all can enjoy, yes even you Jimbo deserve to watch the OT on dvd, even if you laughed with Jar Jar.
You must unlearn what you have learned.
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I am not against the original versions being released I just doubt it will happen. If it does it will be Lucases own descign and no fan petition is going to change that as Bill Hunt said it. Plus other then Han and Greedo I prefered the Special Edition. The new effects made the whole universe come alive much better. According to the Digital bits the 2004 DVDs will be different then the 1997 versions. It has not been officially announced but then again The Phantom Menage, Attack of the Clones, The Indiana Jones trilogy DVDs all included slight changes to the films that were not in the original official announcement or on the pakageing. All I really want is fixed lightsabers and Han and Greedo scene restoration. These will probably the versions that should have come out in 1997. I recommend you read Bill Hunts comments they are very informative on both this release and releases to come. Including the future Ultimate Editions which According to Hunt will be out in 2007 for the HD-DVD format.
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Maybe the petition won't stop Lucas, but if he sees 52,000 people across the country going to Best Buy and Wal-Mart early in the morning to try and convince people NOT to buy Star Wars on DVD and the first day sells are "poor." You better believe he would respond to that! We can do this, just got to get organized! Start getting people assigned to stores, if we can get enough of this moving and have 10,000 people across the country by June ready to go to stores on the 21st to try and convince people not to buy the DVDs that would probably be enough!!!

WE HAVE TO AT LEAST TRY!
WE MUST DO SOMETHING!

DON'T BUY STAR WARS ON DVD UNLESS IT INCLUDES THE ORIGINAL!!!!!
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Originally posted by: jimbo
I am not against the original versions being released I just doubt it will happen. If it does it will be Lucases own descign and no fan petition is going to change that as Bill Hunt said it. Plus other then Han and Greedo I prefered the Special Edition. The new effects made the whole universe come alive much better. According to the Digital bits the 2004 DVDs will be different then the 1997 versions. It has not been officially announced but then again The Phantom Menage, Attack of the Clones, The Indiana Jones trilogy DVDs all included slight changes to the films that were not in the original official announcement or on the pakageing. All I really want is fixed lightsabers and Han and Greedo scene restoration. These will probably the versions that should have come out in 1997. I recommend you read Bill Hunts comments they are very informative on both this release and releases to come. Including the future Ultimate Editions which According to Hunt will be out in 2007 for the HD-DVD format.


I may even do the unthinkable. Buy the DVD's second hand so Lucas doesn't directly get my money and take all of the SE scenes out and reinsert the original scenes from the LD set. I'll have to try to match the audio and color as best as possible. The sound won't be too difficult if they include a 2.0 track. I'm sure someone is going to try this if I don't. I know they won't be perfect, but they can be made to be pretty close.

I do have to admit though that I have a major inner conflict. I'm very angry about the whole situation. Part of me just says to say the hell with it and not even worry. Then there is that part that won't let go. There is no part of me that says I will run out and buy the SE only versions unless it is to attempt what I mentioned above.

I'll tell you more on the hell with it part. I could easily be patient to see what happens in 2007. The reason why is because I had to watch the films over and over when I made my own DVD's from the LD set to make corrections and such. Also, I have seen the films over and over and over over the years before that time. They are really beginning to get boring in a way. To tell you the truth, I didn't get that excited when Indiana Jones came to DVD. I bought them day one and it took me nearly two months to watch all three films. I had to watch Temple of Doom in two sittings because I fell asleep half way through.

Even if he releases both versions, the timing is bad. Life is getting more and more complicated for me. If he had released them 3 or 4 years ago (I know he couldn't), I would have been much more excited.

There is also that last alternative of waiting until the 30th anniversary Jimbo mentioned. By then, he'll either include the Originals, or I won't care by then or both. Again, I don't plan on buying the DVD's unless it is to do what I've mentioned. I'm going to think it over and if it isn't feasable, I won't buy them at all. Actually the waiting until the 30th to see what happens seems to be the best option.

Does anyone else feel similar on any of these points?

Patrick

"When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk." - Tuco from The Good, The Bad And The Ugly
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Originally posted by: Patrick R.
I may even do the unthinkable. Buy the DVD's second hand so Lucas doesn't directly get my money and take all of the SE scenes out and reinsert the original scenes from the LD set. I'll have to try to match the audio and color as best as possible. The sound won't be too difficult if they include a 2.0 track. I'm sure someone is going to try this if I don't. I know they won't be perfect, but they can be made to be pretty close.

Wouldn't it be simpler to just burn your LDs to DVD directly instead of taking all these extra middle steps?
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
-------------------------
Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com
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Quote

Originally posted by: Bossk
Quote

Originally posted by: Patrick R.
I may even do the unthinkable. Buy the DVD's second hand so Lucas doesn't directly get my money and take all of the SE scenes out and reinsert the original scenes from the LD set. I'll have to try to match the audio and color as best as possible. The sound won't be too difficult if they include a 2.0 track. I'm sure someone is going to try this if I don't. I know they won't be perfect, but they can be made to be pretty close.

Wouldn't it be simpler to just burn your LDs to DVD directly instead of taking all these extra middle steps?


It would and I have already done it. However, I was thinking about a couple of things. The first would be that most of the film would be digital and be cleaned up. The other would be that it would be progressive and that I wouldn't need to do an IVTC on it.

In truthfulness, I seriously doubt I follow through with it as it is a lot of trouble. I will probably redo mine from my LD's when the dual layered DVD Burners come out and prove themselves. They are supposed to come out later this year, but they will be expensive and it's going to take time for the media for them to be common.

Patrick
"When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk." - Tuco from The Good, The Bad And The Ugly
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IVTC?
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
-------------------------
Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com
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Sorry. IVTC stands for Inverse Telecine. When film is transferred to video it is Telecined which is a process where duplicate frames are added. Film is 24 frames per second and NTSC TV is 29.97 frames per second. Frames have to be added to the film for them to play smoothly on an NTSC TV. IVTC takes those duplicate frames out and changes the framerate back to that of film. The advantage of this is that the picture will look good on both a TV and PC monitor.

Okay. IVTC has a couple of other advantages. It is easier to resize a file that has been IVTC'ed. This is especially important if you are converting a 4:3 source to 16:9. If you don't do an IVTC, you'll probably end up with a messy video with combing artifacts. The other big advantage is that you can allocate more bitrate to your video quality. Bitrate is applied per second instead of per frame. So, you can have more bitrate if you have 23.97 fps instead of 29.97. I say 23.97 because that is what it really is. Some just round the number up to 24 fps.

I hope this makes sense. It get more complicated if you are talking about mixed sources that have Telecined and Interlaced parts. IVTC should only be performed on Telecined sources and not Interlaced sources. That is why I didn't do IVTC on the Star Wars extras DVD I made. I also didn't resize it to 16:9 because the interviews themselves were full frame, so I didn't have any black bars to crop.

Sorry to get off on a tagent, but I hope this basic explanation helps.


Patrick
"When you have to shoot, shoot. Don't talk." - Tuco from The Good, The Bad And The Ugly
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Here's a killer idea for Luke, or anybody!

Wait until the legitimate DVDs come out.
Then scan them onto your computer, menus and everything.
Then, scan the laserdisc onto your computer.
Then edit them together, so you have the DVD menus with the original movie!

That'd be AWESOME!

My stance on revising fan edits.

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very interesting idea indeed...
ill keep that in mind...

still trying to get my hands on a capture device...
"Never. I'll never turn to the darkside. You've failed your highness. I am a jedi, like my father before me."
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Patrick R was talking about doing that very thing, Hal, since he has the LDs. But he's not quite sure he wants to invest the time into it and I can't say that I blame him. That's an undertaking and a half.
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
-------------------------
Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com