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STAR WARS: EP IV 2004 REVISITED ADYWAN *1080p HD VERSION NOW IN PRODUCTION — Page 258

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adywan said:

i'm afraid you are totally incorrect there. Slowing it down does not create any extra artefacts at all. the encode is done at the 25fps speed and then the frame rate is changed only. No other encoding process is happening at all. so its impossibly for any extra artefacts to be there. And Europe does have 1080p braodcasts because the BBCHD channel broadcasts 1080p and not 1080i which is the more common.

 

 

 Please explain how you can take something that's captured at 25fps, slow it down and stretch it to 24fps and NOT include any artifacts?  Unless you're not doing the stretch, that would be impossible. 

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digitalfreaknyc said:
adywan said:

i'm afraid you are totally incorrect there. Slowing it down does not create any extra artefacts at all. the encode is done at the 25fps speed and then the frame rate is changed only. No other encoding process is happening at all. so its impossibly for any extra artefacts to be there. And Europe does have 1080p braodcasts because the BBCHD channel broadcasts 1080p and not 1080i which is the more common.

 

 

 Please explain how you can take something that's captured at 25fps, slow it down and stretch it to 24fps and NOT include any artifacts?  Unless you're not doing the stretch, that would be impossible. 

 

 ok, we're all going to learn something here (and no i don't know much about film, except

that is 24fps)... and yes i knew about the PAL speedup too... but i just figure Adywan

accounted for it, i just didn't know how... so maybe we'll all find out ... i thought the

video editting software would fix that kind of stuff...

[shows how little i know]..

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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digitalfreaknyc said:
adywan said:

i'm afraid you are totally incorrect there. Slowing it down does not create any extra artefacts at all. the encode is done at the 25fps speed and then the frame rate is changed only. No other encoding process is happening at all. so its impossibly for any extra artefacts to be there. And Europe does have 1080p braodcasts because the BBCHD channel broadcasts 1080p and not 1080i which is the more common.

 

 

 Please explain how you can take something that's captured at 25fps, slow it down and stretch it to 24fps and NOT include any artifacts?  Unless you're not doing the stretch, that would be impossible. 

you just change the framerate after the encode in the video information. its really easy and quick. you're only changing the information specs that the equipment reads to play it back and nothing else. its exactly the same encode right down to the last pixel. it plays back at the different frame rate. nothing else. the video is speeded up for PAL, with no extra frames added, so slowing it down to 24fps is easy. and with HD resolutions they are universal. its only when you come to DVD with the differences between PAL & NTSC that you have to re-encode the video, due to the horizontal lines being 480 for NTSC and 576 for PAL, but if you are working from a lossless master then they will still be the same

 

 

 

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I wholeheartedly agree with Ady on this one,I have done ALOT of PAL2NTSC custom DVD's and have seen NOTHING that would show any kind of quality drop at ALL,hell depending on filter chains,and the way you set up your avs script,it could look better,I LOVE taking rare OOP PAL DVD's that we do not have here and converting them,this is actually what I have been doing lately LOL.

 

So Ady you are dead on and correct.

 

DJ

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adwyan, if i'm getting this right:

----------------------------------------

source material (1080p/24fps) -> PAL -> hardware speeds it up imitate 1080p/25fps (no frames added)

 

source material (1080p/24fps) -> NTSC -> hardware plays it normally at 1080p/24fps

 

is that right?

 

later

-1

[no GOUT in CED?-> GOUT CED]

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dark_jedi said:

I wholeheartedly agree with Ady on this one,I have done ALOT of PAL2NTSC custom DVD's and have seen NOTHING that would show any kind of quality drop at ALL,hell depending on filter chains,and the way you set up your avs script,it could look better,I LOVE taking rare OOP PAL DVD's that we do not have here and converting them,this is actually what I have been doing lately LOL.

 

So Ady you are dead on and correct.

 

DJ

 I've done my own PAL2NTSC projects as well so I know what I'm talking about.

 But are you slowing them down or keeping them at the same speed?

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If you're changing the framerate at which it's played, you're not changing the encode at all, just the number of times an image is displayed per second.  Now there are artifacts introduced when the *sound* is slowed down, but they're negligible.

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Adywan, why did you change the alderaan explosion? I liked the previous one better. You should've used this one. When you get to the ROTJ, please take out the celebrations outside of Endore. I don't want to be reminded of those. Of course, irt's your decsision, but I'm just warning you ahead of time I think a lot of fans here would like to see the extra celebrations on different planets at the end of ROTJ gone.

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Janskeet said:

Adywan, why did you change the alderaan explosion? I liked the previous one better. You should've used this one. When you get to the ROTJ, please take out the celebrations outside of Endore. I don't want to be reminded of those. Of course, irt's your decsision, but I'm just warning you ahead of time I think a lot of fans here would like to see the extra celebrations on different planets at the end of ROTJ gone.

 

The explosion you mentioned is the same as the original in that youtube clip. the new one is much better. It more like a planet blowing up now. The original one in the SE was too much like the Death Star exploding. hell do you actually like anything about this edit? lol

Just because you don't like the end celebrations you really can't "warn" me that others don't. the only thing i hate about the celebrations is the "weessa free" line. I'm keeping the celebrations so you better stick to your 2006 GOUT if you don't like them because you'll hate my edit :)

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adywan said:
digitalfreaknyc said:

 I've done my own PAL2NTSC projects as well so I know what I'm talking about.

How do you do your PAL2NTSC conversions then?

 

 

 I use TPMGenc.  You'd do a conversion from 25fps to 23.976 which has more of an effect visually than on the audio. 

You're doubling frames to keep up with the correct speed.

The audio is totally fine.

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digitalfreaknyc said:
adywan said:
digitalfreaknyc said:

 I've done my own PAL2NTSC projects as well so I know what I'm talking about.

How do you do your PAL2NTSC conversions then?

 

 

 I use TPMGenc.  You'd do a conversion from 25fps to 23.976 which has more of an effect visually than on the audio. 

You're doubling frames to keep up with the correct speed.

The audio is totally fine.

Well that's why your getting artefacts then. TMPGenc isn't what you should be using if you want a high quality PAL2NTSC conversion. you should be adding any frames whatsoever and that's why it'll look bad. you want to manually change the framerrate in the files information only. no adding of frames. If i do a NTSC2PAL or a PAL2NTSC this is how i do it:

rip the DVD to one large file (no file splitting) using dvddecrypter. demux the audio & video seperately using the stream processing tab. make sure you select "demux" for each stream you want to rip separately . then load the VOB into virtualdubMod. then go to the "video>framerate" settings. change the framerate to 23.976 in these 2 sections: "source rate adjustment> click on "change to.." enter 23.976 then in "framerate conversion" click on "convert to fps" and again enter 23.976. now click on OK and close the box. Next got to "video>filters." ad the Resize filter. change the width to 720 and the height to 480 and filter mode needs to be changed to Lanczos3. now again click OK. now select your compression in the "video>compression section. i always use lagaryth lossless codec because its a lossless codec. it does produce a large file but you lose no quality whatsoever. now export the video. once this is done use a high quality Mpeg encoder like Procoder or CCE as these are the best out there.Remember to add the 2:3 pulldown when encoding for NTSC

to change the speed of your audio just load the AC3 file into Besweet , change the framerate from 25fps to 23.976 and export your audio to ac3. you get an almost exact copy and it plays at the correct NTSC speed.  Now just load your new MPEG" & AC3 file into a DVD authoring program. Add your chapters and create a new DVD. you'll see that this way may be longer but the results produce a DVD that is almost the exact same quality as the original(if you are doing it do a DVD-5). if you are going to be adding it to a DVD-9 then the quality is as good as the original. no artefacts whatsoever if you ahve done all the steps correctly. in fact using a PAL DVD as a source for an NTSC conversion will probably give you better results than the actual NTSC DVD because this way it retains most of the detail of a PAL encode

Using TMPGenc to do a PAL2NTSC conversion is almost as bad as using a 1click program to do it. You can't expect to take short cuts and get quality results

 

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I'm not saying that what I've done looks bad by any means...I've just always used dvdrhelp as my guide for doing this.  I use Procoder as well.

Thanks for the info and, again, no disrespect to what you're doing here.  I downloaded the clip last night and it played perfectly on my PS3.  My DVD's are going to gather dust at this point. I might as well sell them.

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adywan said:

the only thing i hate about the celebrations is the "weessa free" line. I'm keeping the celebrations

Ditto. And good! ;) Of all the SE additions, I thought the celebrations were a nice touch. I like the new music, too.

Thinking back to when I read through this whole thread, I gotta say that at least the naysayers now don't seem as nasty as they used to be. I hope no one is harrassing you about ESB:R now like did happen with ANH:R.

 

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@ Digitalfreak,

OFCOURSE I am slowing it down and making it correct,I do not do any of that tricking the player BS like most other people do.

TMPGenc, holy shit you use this,well I guess to each their own,and I am glad YOU know what you are talking about though,are you insinuating we don't?

I have had NOTHING but compliments on my PAL2NTSC conversions,and I have done a crapload,I am even converting the menu's and stuff now to,but now we are going off topic again.

Thanks Ady for all these FINE projects you are doing,keep up the great work!

 

DJ

 

EDIT:

I just read what Ady responded to you,I use Avisynth scripting to do most of my conversions,but it is very similar,to do it right,you have to do it all manually,if you want a 1 click,hell just use ConvertXtoDVD.

 

 

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What's happened to the EP V Revisited thread? its suddenly just stopped! is there a glitch or something?

I am a kite dancing in a hurricane …

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I think we all got distracted by the action here, so we forgot that this is the ANHR thread!

Star Wars Revisited Wordpress

Star Wars Visual Comparisons WordPress

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doubleofive said:

I think we all got distracted by the action here, so we forgot that this is the ANHR thread!

 

Well get your asses back over there? its kinda lonely! 

I am a kite dancing in a hurricane …

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First-time poster. Just watched Star Wars Revisited and have to say it's bloody brilliant. IMO, this version is right up there with the OOT. I don't remember being that excited about watching SW since I was a kid, so cheers to Adywan for that. Since I despise the PT (I've seen each of those movies twice - once in the the cinema and once rented on DVD) and like to pretend they don't exist, I was a bit sceptical at first as it was Adywan's goal to make these two trilogies better fit into one another, but I have to say that all those changes were in good taste. The changes that I tought might bother me the most - PT music during the climatic fight between Obi-Wan and Darth Vader and the restructuring of Obi-Wan hut scene, I actually liked the best. One thing that seemed to be a bit off tough was the loudness of the sound compared to the dialog. I had the remote in my hand all the time and when there was a dialog scene I increased the volume and when there was and action scene I had to reduce the volumne again because it was too loud. Anybody else had that problem?

P.S. Slightly off topic. To all those PT fanboys who keep harping on about how Mark Hamill is just as bad an actor (or even worse) as the guy who played Anakin Skywalker in the PT (forgot his name), I have to say this is absolute BS. IMO, Mark Hamill is no worse and probably even better in Star Wars than Harrison Ford and Carrie Fisher (and I say this as a Harrison Ford and Carries Fisher fan). Besides, the work he's done voicing the Joker in Batman - The Animated Series is unsurpassed (haven't seen Dark Knight yet though). I don't see the guy from the PT carrying off something as impressive as that anytime in the future.

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kriegdersterne said:

One thing that seemed to be a bit off tough was the loudness of the sound compared to the dialog. I had the remote in my hand all the time and when there was a dialog scene I increased the volume and when there was and action scene I had to reduce the volumne again because it was too loud. Anybody else had that problem?

 

That's actually a sign of good dynamic range.  When the parts that are supposed to be softer/quieter are the same volume as the big, loud actiony parts, the sound has been compressed too much.  Some people prefer this, as it lets them watch a movie at a consistent volume level without bringing the house down, but the vast majority of DVD players offer a "dynamic range compression" option which does this exact thing, so those of us who like our loud moments to really be louder than the quiet ones can have our way, and those who prefer everything to be about the same can choose to listen to it that way, too.

I will admit, however, to turning compression on when I'm watching a movie at night, before or in bed, so I can hear the dialogue without the loud parts waking others up.

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Ripplin said:
adywan said:

the only thing i hate about the celebrations is the "weessa free" line. I'm keeping the celebrations

Ditto. And good! ;) Of all the SE additions, I thought the celebrations were a nice touch. I like the new music, too.

Thinking back to when I read through this whole thread, I gotta say that at least the naysayers now don't seem as nasty as they used to be. I hope no one is harrassing you about ESB:R now like did happen with ANH:R.

 

I have to say the new music at the end of ROTJ didnt do anything for me...it sounds almost depressing. The original built up to a climax then launched straight into the end titles theme...it was brilliant. If you could find a way to include the original music and keep the SE celebrations (minus gungan garbage) that would be a great compromise.

 

 

But who am I to question the God of Fanedits!

 

 

PS what the hell has happened to fanedit.org? I cant get on to it at all for the last day or so.

 

I assure you we are quite safe from your friends here

 

 

The Rise of Darth Scourge, by Phil West

 

 

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darth_scourge said:

PS what the hell has happened to fanedit.org? I cant get on to it at all for the last day or so.

 

They're having hosting problems again, so they're moving to yet ANOTHER hosting service.  Give it time.

I just managed to get there and this was on their news page:

Site revamp and host change

once again Fanedit.org has switched the host for better reliability. The new one is rather expensive but incredibly fast and we hope to be able to feed the 1500+ daily visitors to the very best of service with it. The web site has also undergone some changes for better comfort. The CSS feature for example is vastly improved now and does not show just the new comments but everything new, neatly listed and displayed so you will miss nothing on FE.

My outlook on life - we’re all on the Hindenburg anyway…no point fighting over the window seat.

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also, there have been some ddos attacks on our service provider for fanedit.org.  The site has been running fine, but the last couple days have been hell because of some IP issues.  Hopefully this will all get worked out asap.  Sorry about the downtime.  We're trying to get the site to run as best as possible.

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