Did anyone follow through on sending GL back the '04 DVD with the GOUT set?

I didn't and it sounds like little or no one else did. I don't know why, sounded like a good ploy to get back at GL for all he's done to us. I know some people were suggesting that they would have us mail our DVDs to one person who would put them all in a big box with a letter to GL stating we didn't want these included. I still might do that and in the letter tell him in his upcoming Blu-ray DVD set he better have the OOTs restored and properly transfer in there or I'm gonna buy a plane ticket to San Fransico and personallly come to his house and kick his ass.

Hello?

Unfortunately, these things are too hard to organize, because everyone who is a SW fan doesn't log onto SW forums.  So even all of us here that log on and post daily, it would still be a small number compared to how many discs they sold.  You have to think guys, how many people do you know post on SW boards?  I know loads of people who love the SW movies, but not one of them ever posts, let alone the fact that the movie series is essentially over except EU/Cartoon stuff.

I say we just give up on DVD and focus on BluRay and an eventual boxset of the SW movies.  Somewhere in the next few years, BluRay will become more mainstream and the studios will be putting all their 'A' titles out, so if there is a purpose to this site:  'Getting the OOT fully remastered in 1080 for a BluRay release in the near future.'

Mielr said:

"Fanboys"? No, "fanboys" are people with their lips krazy-glued to Lucas' ass. In other words, people who can't think for themselves and frequent TF.N.

I disagree. You certainly are fanboys. Just not of GL. You see the OOT as the perfect version of the Star Wars trilogy, despite several (mostly unavoidable) flaws that were fixed in the SE's. Your ability to look past these technical flaws parallels the gushers' ability to look past GL's flaws as a storyteller. Hence, you are fanboys, and there'e nothing wrong with that.

Johnboy3434 said:

You see the OOT as the perfect version of the Star Wars trilogy, despite several (mostly unavoidable) flaws that were fixed in the SE's. Your ability to look past these technical flaws parallels the gushers' ability to look past GL's flaws as a storyteller. Hence, you are fanboys, and there'e nothing wrong with that.

As I have always said, if you like or enjoy the SE, I have no beef with you, as they don't bother me as much as others here except that insertion of Hayden in ROTJ, that is a ridiculous change.

But in saying that, I totally disagree of someones ability to look past the technical flaws that you say were fixed in the SE.  I grew up seeing the movies in 77,80, and 83, and EVERYONE I know never said anything like, "God, if they would just redo some of that end battle on the deathstar with better effects, I would love this movie!"  or "Man if Cloud City looked cooler outside the windows, ESB would be the shit!"  My whole point is that this conversation of fixing the OOT was not an issue before 1997, as no one I know ever complained about effects, etc.   Sure people talked about the Ewoks and Luke/Leia kissing in ESB, and being siblings later on, but they were plot points not effects. 

So please don't say there were flaws in the OOT when it comes to effects because there wasn't one complaint from fans from 1977-1996.  Sure you have a fanbase who grew up on the SE, and now a fanbase that wants the OT redone to fit the PT, but that is all a frame of reference BECAUSE Lucas keeps updating them everytime he releases them on Home Video/DVD (1997 and 2004) and I guarantee if Lucas never updated the films, the films would be just as beloved as they were in 1977.  

Just check how many generations still love Wizard of Oz and its '1939-like' sets that I am sure could have been updated sometime in the last 60 years to make up for its flaws as you would describe.  The movie has stayed the same for 60 years, and it is one of the most beloved movies of all-time, the same way Star Wars from 1977 would be if everyone saw the 1977 version today.

CO said:

So please don't say there were flaws in the OOT when it comes to effects because there wasn't one complaint from fans from 1977-1996.

Actually, I wasn't talking about aesthetic changes like those made to Cloud City. I was referring to matte lines and such.

Johnboy3434 said:

CO said:

So please don't say there were flaws in the OOT when it comes to effects because there wasn't one complaint from fans from 1977-1996.

 

Actually, I wasn't talking about aesthetic changes like those made to Cloud City. I was referring to matte lines and such.

 Exactly, I didn't know about any matte lines until I went on the internet post-1997.  I am really not going at you personally, I am just trying to give you a frame of reference of what it was like to be a SW fan from 77-83, and nobody knew what the hell a matte line was on the playground, nor did anyone care.  The orange fuzz under the Lukes landspeeder on Tatooine was another thing that bothered Lucas as he says in the SE Documentary on the 97 Laserdisk.  Again, I probably noticed somtime in my 100 zillion times I watched the movie, but didn't care, or did it have any effect on the movie.

What Lucas and many SE fans don't get is that the story and characters are what made the movies great from 77-83, and the SPX were just gravy, as they were awesome at the time, and I still think hold today when you look at a Star Trek film from that time, or a movie like the Last Starfighter.  But I constanty hear that the effects this and the effects that, but the SE don't make the movies any better in my view or they wouldnt have been the top grossing trilogy of all-time. 

So as I said, if you like the SE, thats fine with me, but take it from me and the many SW fans I grew up with and know today, THEY DON"T CARE ABOUT MATTE LINES, its the story and the characters that make us revisit the movies.

Johnboy3434 said:

CO said:

So please don't say there were flaws in the OOT when it comes to effects because there wasn't one complaint from fans from 1977-1996.

 

Actually, I wasn't talking about aesthetic changes like those made to Cloud City. I was referring to matte lines and such.

By your logic anyone that DOESN'T wish for films to be altered decades after their release is a fanboy. I wouldn't want Wizard of Oz updated; or Lawrence of Arabia (CGI camels!! Its "better"!!); or Metropolis. Or Star Wars. Its a film made in 1977--of course the effects do not hold up to today! Duh! Does that mean they are "flawed"? In the sense that they do not compare to todays, yes, but seeing as these films are not madde today this is a logical fallacy--you are asserting films are flawed simply based on the virtue of their being made prior to today.

I don't think anyone disagreed these "flaws" existed--clearly, the matte lines are visible. Its not a question of opinion; they are there. No one ever pretended these technological limitations didn't exist, there simply is no need to update it in the first place. Its like people who can't watch any film made before 1990, or anything in black and white--its not "up to date". No shit. Movies are products of their time. Either watch them or don't.

I still say it is Lucas that opened up the can of worms in this debate, and this whole debate wouldn't be going on this level if he never touched the OOT.  Sure there would be a small minority that would cry that the special effects are outdated, probably like there are small minority of people who won't watch The Wizard of Oz cause it feels and looks like an older film.  But the majority of people wouldn't care, wouldn't even bother to debate, and just enjoy the movie, cause Star Wars is one of those rare movies that is timeless, it sorta transcends generations.  I think there are alot of films that seem to get stuck in that time period that new generation don't embrace, but movies like Jaws, Raiders, Star Wars, and Back to the Future are still beloved years later simply because of the characters & story. 

The reason I say that is that my nephews have watched and loved Raiders, SW, and BTTF, and don't bitch to me about any effects.  There is something cool about watching an older film as a kid that kinda makes you feel abit older.  Of course I haven't shown them Jaws yet, there are bit too young:)

Ditto on what Tiptup said.

originally posted by zombie84: I don't think anyone disagreed these "flaws" existed--clearly, the matte lines are visible. Its not a question of opinion; they are there. No one ever pretended these technological limitations didn't exist, there simply is no need to update it in the first place. Its like people who can't watch any film made before 1990, or anything in black and white--its not "up to date". No shit. Movies are products of their time.

That's why I think GL had no business messing with the films 20+ years to begin with. I think one thing about movies that is cool is seeing them as a product of their time. I would much rather see a movie as it was during the time of its initial release in theaters with all the dated effects and all than to see it changed and updated years later. It is one of the beauties about cinema. From the sound of it, we are just seeing the tip of the iceberg of what GL wants to do to the SW films. I remember rumors passing all over the boards saying that GL is in the works of not only updating the SFX more, but also the technology used in the film as part of the props to meet modern standards. It sounds like he wants to have the films continually updated to modern technological standards forever and attemp to destroy the previous versions from existence. GL doesn't even seem to be that pationate about SW anymore, I mean, for god sakes, he couldn't even recognize the iconic cloud city music theme in ESB in a recent interview! I don't know why he neglects fans of a franchise he is not even that fond of.

Even if GL does eventually give us the OOT how we want it, I will still think he is a moron for changing the films and continue to criticise him on forums, unless he apologizes (fat chance in hell). I think he is lucky he didn't get lawsuits on his hands for altering the films without consent from all the creators of the movies. I'm sure he violated some people's rights doing what he did, but it sounds like the people's work he changed, either they're dead now or didn't care enough to retaliate against GL. Plus in the '04 DVD commentary of the films, I don't recall GL ever acknowleding the shameless changes he made.

Janskeet said:

Plus in the '04 DVD commentary of the films, I don't recall GL ever acknowleding the shameless changes he made.

That's what's so silly about this ordeal. Ben Burtt and Dennis Muren both acknowledge it on the commentaries. The Empire of Dreams documentary acknowledges the history of the OT. There are commercials and trailers on that same disc from when the movies were originally released in addition to '97.