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generalfrevious said:

I just say It's got to be a unanimous effort to cut down pollution when it concerns global warming.


Haha, I just watched the South Park episode "Two Days Before the Day After Tomorrow" the other day. Its a classic, ranks among the greats such as "Something Wal-Mart This Way Comes" and "Cartman Joins NAMBLA".

I tend to think Global Warming is a bunch of BS, mostly because it is. It is unfortunate that I get globbed into the category of right-wing fanatic, Fox news watching, Bill O'Riely/George Bush lover/idiotic religious fanatica who is obviously to dull to comprehend science/ etc. because I drive an SUV and snicker when I hear someone pontificate about global warming going green (hey, I did my part to take care of the enviroment before I was told bs about killing the earth). It is always good practice to question things, too bad we don't. I question most bits of data that come my way, and I discover that a vast percentage of everything is pure BS. When there are as many muffled voices in the scientific community crying out against it as there is, maybe it is time to stop and think... or not. Just a thought.

As for the evil Westerners greedily supporting China for their own personal gain, it is true and I am completely against it. For one, I do not believe we should be supporting a communist nation in this way, and there are plenty of countries with just forms of government with poor economies that could use the help. But for saying such a thing I am at risk of once again being globbed into a category that is seen in a negative light, so scratch what I said before... and... uh... I don't think we should be supporting China's economy in such a way because they are causing... global... warming...

"We didn't listen!!!"

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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From the series I posted a link to;

"Environmental woes that might be considered catastrophic in some countries can seem commonplace in China: industrial cities where people rarely see the sun; children killed or sickened by lead poisoning or other types of local pollution; a coastline so swamped by algal red tides that large sections of the ocean no longer sustain marine life.

China is choking on its own success. The economy is on a historic run, posting a succession of double-digit growth rates. But the growth derives, now more than at any time in the recent past, from a staggering expansion of heavy industry and urbanization that requires colossal inputs of energy, almost all from coal, the most readily available, and dirtiest, source."

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f20/stonetriple/chinastorecoalmine.jpg

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f20/stonetriple/china_olympics.jpg

http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f20/stonetriple/Tiananmen2008.jpg


That last picture is smog in Tiananmen Square, taken this year. Air pollution from China is being felt all the way to Los Angeles. We're going to have to deal with their disregard for the planet - whether we want to or not.

Add to that, the fact they are killing us in other ways also, through their disregard for any form of self-regulation. Around the world, products from China are killing;

Adults - contaminated medicine
Children - dangerous toys with lead paint
Animals - contaminated food

The sooner we stop supporting that government, the sooner they'll be forced to stop killing the planet.



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I can't help but snicker when people say that humanity is "killing the planet". You know what it takes to kill a planet? Asteroids. The size of Texas. If we piled every nuclear, biological, and otherwise unsavory weapon into one spot and set off the biggest fireworks display in the past 65 million years, I guarantee you that, 100 million years later, intelligent life would still be alive and kickin'. Would they be human? Probably not. But the point is that this planet is a tough old bird, and it's nothing short of arrogant to think we could take her down for the count. And that's not even taking religious beliefs into account.
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Johnboy3434 said:

it's nothing short of arrogant to think we could take her down for the count.


Ahhh, fresh breeze... my feelings on the matter exactly.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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Johnboy3434 said:

I can't help but snicker when people say that humanity is "killing the planet". You know what it takes to kill a planet? Asteroids. The size of Texas. If we piled every nuclear, biological, and otherwise unsavory weapon into one spot and set off the biggest fireworks display in the past 65 million years, I guarantee you that, 100 million years later, intelligent life would still be alive and kickin'. Would they be human? Probably not. But the point is that this planet is a tough old bird, and it's nothing short of arrogant to think we could take her down for the count. And that's not even taking religious beliefs into account.

Ofcourse some life will find a way and something will survive. But if we continue like we are doing now and in 100-200 years there are 15-20 billion people on this planet it can no longer sustain us and there won't be much untouched wilderness left. We are killing the natural world as it existed 100 years ago.
Fez: I am so excited about Star Whores.
Hyde: Fezzy, man, it's Star Wars.
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Johnboy3434 said:

I can't help but snicker when people say that humanity is "killing the planet".


Let me see if I can make myself a little more clear Johnboy.

I was speaking of the health issues and devastation of the current plant & animal species.

There's no denying that the planet will survive whatever we throw at it, but it's going to be a real mother fucker for the people that have to deal with it while it's happening.
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Arnie.d said:

Johnboy3434 said:

I can't help but snicker when people say that humanity is "killing the planet". You know what it takes to kill a planet? Asteroids. The size of Texas. If we piled every nuclear, biological, and otherwise unsavory weapon into one spot and set off the biggest fireworks display in the past 65 million years, I guarantee you that, 100 million years later, intelligent life would still be alive and kickin'. Would they be human? Probably not. But the point is that this planet is a tough old bird, and it's nothing short of arrogant to think we could take her down for the count. And that's not even taking religious beliefs into account.

Ofcourse some life will find a way and something will survive. But if we continue like we are doing now and in 100-200 years there are 15-20 billion people on this planet it can no longer sustain us and there won't be much untouched wilderness left. We are killing the natural world as it existed 100 years ago.


First, that is a drop in the bucket compared with the entire history of this planet. Second, the last ice age wiped out a lot in its path and that happened, what, millions of years ago? Maybe it was thousands, not exactly sure.

The point is that 100 years is NOTHING compared to what this planet has been through. Considering that a ME event (Mass Extinction Event) is pretty much what it seems to take to wipe out life (think asteroids that size of Texas like Johnnyboy said) and I think "global warming" is just being politicized WAY to much.

Scientists know that the climate is changing, but they don't know exactly why. They think it might be caused by humans (what a great way to get more funding), but they're not entirely sure. How do we know that it's not a natural cycle? How do we know we can even stop it? We don't. We think we're so great and can do anything as long as we put our minds to it. The reality is the exact opposite. Sure we can recycle and do what we can with what we're given, but if climate change is a naturally occurring process, then there isn't a damn thing we can do to stop it. And even if we tried, we're more likely to screw things up in the process than we are to actually prevent anything.

If you want to survive this planet, then you're better off putting effort into space exploration. The only sure way to survive this rock is to get off this rock.
F Scale score - 3.3333333333333335

You are disciplined but tolerant; a true American.

Pissing off Rob since August 2007.
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Johnboy3434 said:

I can't help but snicker when people say that humanity is "killing the planet". You know what it takes to kill a planet? Asteroids. The size of Texas. If we piled every nuclear, biological, and otherwise unsavory weapon into one spot and set off the biggest fireworks display in the past 65 million years, I guarantee you that, 100 million years later, intelligent life would still be alive and kickin'. Would they be human? Probably not. But the point is that this planet is a tough old bird, and it's nothing short of arrogant to think we could take her down for the count. And that's not even taking religious beliefs into account.


Nobody is worried about "the planet" you shithead. People are concerned with our being able to live on it. When people say that they want to "save the earth", there is a reason why they focus on very specific air, water, and food issues.

HARMY RULES

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The abundant lack of intelligence of people who post on this forum just floors me.

http://www.pointlesswasteoftime.com/knowgraph.gif

"The ignorant can be trusting and thus can be governed. The misinformed are impossible to govern because they cannot be talked out of the skewed rubbish they think they know. - Dr. Albert Oxford, PhD

“First feel fear, then get angry. Then go with your life into the fight.” - Bill Mollison

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FanFiltration said:

The abundant lack of intelligence of people who post on this forum just floors me.

Than leave. Unless you're talking about Rob. He just likes to stir up trouble.

A Goon in a Gaggle of 'em

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Funny thing about your graph FF, is that I am pretty sure you feel you are represented by that red line... which kind of proves your point.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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lordjedi said:

Arnie.d said:

Johnboy3434 said:

I can't help but snicker when people say that humanity is "killing the planet". You know what it takes to kill a planet? Asteroids. The size of Texas. If we piled every nuclear, biological, and otherwise unsavory weapon into one spot and set off the biggest fireworks display in the past 65 million years, I guarantee you that, 100 million years later, intelligent life would still be alive and kickin'. Would they be human? Probably not. But the point is that this planet is a tough old bird, and it's nothing short of arrogant to think we could take her down for the count. And that's not even taking religious beliefs into account.

Ofcourse some life will find a way and something will survive. But if we continue like we are doing now and in 100-200 years there are 15-20 billion people on this planet it can no longer sustain us and there won't be much untouched wilderness left. We are killing the natural world as it existed 100 years ago.


First, that is a drop in the bucket compared with the entire history of this planet. Second, the last ice age wiped out a lot in its path and that happened, what, millions of years ago? Maybe it was thousands, not exactly sure.

The point is that 100 years is NOTHING compared to what this planet has been through. Considering that a ME event (Mass Extinction Event) is pretty much what it seems to take to wipe out life (think asteroids that size of Texas like Johnnyboy said) and I think "global warming" is just being politicized WAY to much.

Scientists know that the climate is changing, but they don't know exactly why. They think it might be caused by humans (what a great way to get more funding), but they're not entirely sure. How do we know that it's not a natural cycle? How do we know we can even stop it? We don't. We think we're so great and can do anything as long as we put our minds to it. The reality is the exact opposite. Sure we can recycle and do what we can with what we're given, but if climate change is a naturally occurring process, then there isn't a damn thing we can do to stop it. And even if we tried, we're more likely to screw things up in the process than we are to actually prevent anything.

If you want to survive this planet, then you're better off putting effort into space exploration. The only sure way to survive this rock is to get off this rock.

100 years is nothing but that doesn't have anything to do with what we are doing to the planet. The last ice age ended 10.000 years ago.

The ammount of fossil fuels we use in a year took the earth 10 million years to produce (or was it 100 million?). But destroying the earth isn't only producing CO2. I agree we can't control the climate and we don't know if and how much we are causing it. But that's not what I consider destroying the earth. It's the destruction of the natural world because of human expansion.

I'm all for space exploration and I think that's where our future lies. I wish we could spend all the money we spend on the military on space exploration.

FanFiltration said:

The abundant lack of intelligence of people who post on this forum just floors me.

http://www.pointlesswasteoftime.com/knowgraph.gif

Is this graph about religion? :P
Seriously what is this based on?
Fez: I am so excited about Star Whores.
Hyde: Fezzy, man, it's Star Wars.
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Why would I leave? This is so fun.

It's kind of like watching rats in a maze, or monkeys in a zoo.

I got that graph from a very entertaining article about how the seeds of the next American civil war can be seen in worthless debates such as this. I'm sure some of you would find it purely entertaining as I had, some will cringe in fear, others will be down right offended by it, and some of you will not have the ability or fortitude to read it at all.

http://www.pointlesswasteoftime.com/civilwar.html

Now please, let the battle continue. Remember, your hate makes you stronger. *Grin*

"Who is influencing the opinions of American youth today? It is a core of cyber peers, massively popular untrained and uneducated writers on the internet that, together, command an audience of tens of millions of future voters and leaders and fighters. They do not have editors or real publishing costs. They answer to no one. They relate to the web surfers as friends.

And, they are morons."

“First feel fear, then get angry. Then go with your life into the fight.” - Bill Mollison

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Here's a question:

Which is a poisonous gas? Or should I say which is poisonous to the planet? CO or CO2? CO. CO2 is what green plants BREATHE....in fact the more CO2 there is the GREENER the planet......you would think tree huggers would know that.....go figure.

I love everybody. Lets all smoke some reefer and chill. Hug and kisses for everybody.

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Err... if that website is satire, it's damn funny. If not, ugh...
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Hmm, after reading FF's previous post, I suddenly feel the need to quote myself.

C3PX said:

Funny thing about your graph FF, is that I am pretty sure you feel you are represented by that red line... which kind of proves your point.



Arnie, of course the statistics shown in that graph are not real. It is actually pretty impossible to get accurate statistics on anything, and for most things it is downright impossible. How could you possibly get statistics on how many people "think they know" and how many really "do know". It is funny that someone who thinks they are the wise man watching fools trip over themselves in a maze would post such a thing. Just the fact that he thinks he is represented by the red line defaults him over to the blue line.

A true mark of wisdom is coming to the realization that you can't possibly know everything or anywhere close to it.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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FanFiltration said:


"Who is influencing the opinions of American youth today? It is a core of cyber peers, massively popular untrained and uneducated writers on the internet


You mean like an amatuer-looking site, complete with an anonymous "Dr." with a "PhD", warning the little people of the coming of a second civil war ?
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C3PX said:

Hmm, after reading FF's previous post, I suddenly feel the need to quote myself.

C3PX said:

Funny thing about your graph FF, is that I am pretty sure you feel you are represented by that red line... which kind of proves your point.



Arnie, of course the statistics in show in that graph are not real. It is actually pretty impossible to get accurate statistics on anything, and for most things it is downright impossible. How could you possibly get statistics on how many people "think they know" and how many really "do know". It is funny that someone who thinks they are the wise man watching fools trip over themselves in a maze would post such a thing. Just the fact that he thinks he is represented by the red line defaults him over to the blue line.

A true mark of wisdom is coming to the realization that you can't possibly know everything or anywhere close to it.


I think you are conveniently overlooking the fact that I posted in my follow up comment about the chart's origin, that I think the entire thing was purely entertaining. But, that was expected.


“First feel fear, then get angry. Then go with your life into the fight.” - Bill Mollison

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It's amusing how many of you take things far too serious and obviously very personal. I had not even directed my comments to anyone of you personally, or to either side of the issue in question. But yet, a number of people here took the comments to be about them and became defensive. Why is that? Could it be that the old saying "If the shoe fits..." applies here? The reactions to even the most general and obtuse comments brings almost the same typical programed reactions from a number of posters here in nearly every subject thread. I'm reminded of the experiments of Pavlov and his dogs. Sorry if such tactics annoy some, but I find this all very amusing. Thats what some of us are here for, entertainment. Do some of you truly feel you are changing anyones mind about any issues here? By the amount of strong emotions placed in some of the postings, I think they do. Do some lose sleep about any of this, have their ego bruised, or even carry a feeling of pride of a battle well fought over this banter? Does the ability to have personal interactions and debate with others outside the virtual confines of this forum mirror your etiquette here? If so, that's sad for some of you.

I would like to direct you to a great web tool that will help label and classify the "logical fallacies" employed by many of our forum members. This tool is for people such as myself that enjoy baiting, and also observing the types of debate tactics, reactions, and over reactions employed by the posters here. With this reference tool and also a bit of searching and reading over other subjects posted in the Off Topic area, you can identify and tag many members with ease. It's fun and educational. It may even help in your personal debate skills if you sometime feel the need to take one on.

http://www.csun.edu/~dgw61315/fallacies.html

“First feel fear, then get angry. Then go with your life into the fight.” - Bill Mollison

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So what if some people take it "too seriously", if they want to take it "too seriously", it is their right, just like it is your right to come in here and act like an arrogant prick (see "rats in a maze, monkeys in a zoo" comment). Keep in mind that most of us don't really come here for serious debating (I mean, you do realize this is a Star Wars forum right?), we are just a bunch of guys with fairly common interests discussing how we feel about certian political situations. Sometimes the discussion gets a bit heated, as has been the nature of political conversations since the beginning of recorded history, so what? In real debate you are trying to convince people of your point of view, even though we discuss why we feel a certian way about something, it is not that we feel we are going to convince the other person to change their minds one way or another.

In short, we enjoy discussing these things, which is what we were doing in this particular thread. You are the one that pops your head in and says,

FanFiltration said:

The abundant lack of intelligence of people who post on this forum just floors me.

http://www.pointlesswasteoftime.com/knowgraph.gif

"The ignorant can be trusting and thus can be governed. The misinformed are impossible to govern because they cannot be talked out of the skewed rubbish they think they know. - Dr. Albert Oxford, PhD


So who takes this too seriously? I didn't pipe up because "the shoe fit" I piped up because your arrogance annoys me, whether I was one of the ones you were refering to as one of the people who floor you, one of your rats/monkey/or the people who take things too seriously doesn't really matter to me. You are still insulting other people here, and that bugs me. It is not that we are expecting to solve the global warming debate in a Star Wars forum, it simply got brought up and we started talking about it. If it makes you feel better about yourself to come in here and start jeering at everyone for not being as enlightened as you, then so be it. If we only spent as much time looking at websites like the onion and a website called completewasteoftime.com like you do, we might be able to comprehend your vast intellectual strength, but I am pretty sure none of us come even close to being able to fathom it, so spare us the guilt trip on the sake of ignorance.

Now if you'll excuse me, I believe there is a piece of cheese somewhere in here that is in need of finding.

"Every time Warb sighs, an angel falls into a vat of mapel syrup." - Gaffer Tape

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FanFiltration said:


I would like to direct you to a great web tool that will help label and classify the "logical fallacies" employed by many of our forum members. This tool is for people such as myself that enjoy baiting, and also observing the types of debate tactics, reactions, and over reactions employed by the posters here. With this reference tool and also a bit of searching and reading over other subjects posted in the Off Topic area, you can identify and tag many members with ease. It's fun and educational. It may even help in your personal debate skills if you sometime feel the need to take one on.

http://www.csun.edu/~dgw61315/fallacies.html


Why, how ingenious and masterfully manipulative you must be, FF. If you could, would you please point out the most recent time when you fooled a person on this forum into committing a logical fallacy? I'd really like to analyze your handiwork. :)

"Now all Lucas has to do is make a cgi version of himself.  It will be better than the original and fit his original vision." - skyjedi2005

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vbangle said:

Here's a question:

Which is a poisonous gas? Or should I say which is poisonous to the planet? CO or CO2? CO. CO2 is what green plants BREATHE....in fact the more CO2 there is the GREENER the planet......you would think tree huggers would know that.....go figure.

I think pretty much anything can be poisonous if you get too much of it.

I think when plants grow (so water, sunlight, temperature, etc are good enough) CO2 is actually the limiting factor for plants and trees. It's funny you mention it because a few days ago I was thinking if the CO2 in the atmosphere doubles or triples how much faster everything would grow.
Fez: I am so excited about Star Whores.
Hyde: Fezzy, man, it's Star Wars.
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FanFiltration said:


It's amusing how many of you take things far too serious and obviously very personal.

The reactions to even the most general and obtuse comments brings almost the same typical programed reactions...

I'm reminded of the experiments of Pavlov and his dogs. Sorry if such tactics annoy some, but I find this all very amusing.

Do some lose sleep about any of this, have their ego bruised, or even carry a feeling of pride of a battle well fought over this banter?

This tool is for people such as myself that enjoy baiting, and also observing the ...over reactions



For someone who claims to be a victim of gang stalking & police harassment - to the point of having to go to the hospital with chest pains caused by anxiety and stress - I'm surprised you revel in your ability to bother others. Your treatment of other people's distress, as well as your repeated condescension seems more like the behavior of someone seeking to repair their own bruised ego.
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Anchorhead said:

For someone who claims to be a victim of gang stalking & police harassment - to the point of having to go to the hospital with chest pains caused by anxiety and stress - I'm surprised you revel in your ability to bother others. Your treatment of other people's distress, as well as your repeated condescension seems more like the behavior of someone seeking to repair their own bruised ego.


I'm starting to wonder if his "reveling" is what got the gangs and police on his ass in the first place. He seems like the kind of person to open his mouth when he should keep it shut.
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Johnboy3434 said:

Anchorhead said:

For someone who claims to be a victim of gang stalking & police harassment - to the point of having to go to the hospital with chest pains caused by anxiety and stress - I'm surprised you revel in your ability to bother others. Your treatment of other people's distress, as well as your repeated condescension seems more like the behavior of someone seeking to repair their own bruised ego.


I'm starting to wonder if his "reveling" is what got the gangs and police on his ass in the first place. He seems like the kind of person to open his mouth when he should keep it shut.


In fact, my big mouth in that situation has had very nice financial and political benefits, and still more to come. *grin*

“First feel fear, then get angry. Then go with your life into the fight.” - Bill Mollison