- Time
- Post link
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sequel_trilogy
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sequel_trilogy
What did the Prequel Trilogy need? — Page 10
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Sequel_trilogy
- Time
- Post link
- Time
- Post link
It could be like a Gandolf thing where you get the sense he's a different person, but he's really the same.
- Time
- Post link
Personally I tend to view Star Wars as a straightforeward fantasy/action series and in my own stories, probably won't go too psychological/profound. That being said (and this probably isn't what you meant, but), that does make me think that if it were a clone that was thawed, I'd have him act different from the original just to comment on the fact that people are individuals and that their genetics mean jack-be-diddly (IMO).
- Time
- Post link
Originally posted by: JamesEightBitStar
Not sure what you mean about the Gandalf example... he never changed throughout the books, he just got promoted.
Not sure what you mean about the Gandalf example... he never changed throughout the books, he just got promoted.
He's talking about when Gandalf died from his fight with the Balrog and then was sent back. He wasn't quite the same person anymore according to the story (he wasn't just promoted). This was more evident in the books.
"Now all Lucas has to do is make a cgi version of himself. It will be better than the original and fit his original vision." - skyjedi2005
- Time
- Post link
- Time
- Post link
Maybe she was made part of the leaderhip of Echo Base because they wanted to see how she coped with leadership?
Maybe there could have been a few of the Alliance who thought she was too young and feisty to fill her father's shoes. Theoretically, she's only mid-twenties at most in ESB. It would be a nice thread to bring in to the middle trilogy of Leia proving herself worthy of taking on her father's part in the Rebellion.
Maybe that's why she was so reluctant to leave Echo Base. She felt that her leadership had failed with the Empire finding and destroying the base and was desperately trying to keep things together, even while the base is falling around her ears.
Maybe that's why, as Obi Jeewhyen says, she's such a moody cow in ESB - she's angry that the base fell on her watch, she's angry that Solo dragged her away, she's angry that they're stuck in a malfunctioning "bucket of bolts" being chased further and further away from the rest of the Rebellion by the whole Imperial fleet,...
she's angry because she feels she's not living up to her father's legacy.
Thoughts?
- Time
- Post link
- Time
- Post link
Most of my posts on this thread are little ideas that come to me that I want to get some opinions on. Basically, as long as it fits with ANH and ESB, makes sense and is interesting, then it's okay. All opinions are welcome.
If you're interested, there's a lot of great posts in the rest of this thread.
- Time
- Post link
Pink Floyd -- First in Space
- Time
- Post link
Originally posted by: auximenies
It might be a good idea to gather some of your more concrete ideas on a blog or something ... and put the link in your signature.
Good idea, auximenies! I'll look into it.It might be a good idea to gather some of your more concrete ideas on a blog or something ... and put the link in your signature.
Further to do with Leia - I think Han pisses her off because he's so carefree and mercenary. She's so fired up with the Rebellion that she finds it absolutely incredible that someone could be so blase about the fate of the galaxy. I think what really bugs her, though, is that she also finds him irresistably attractive. She's angry that she has so little control over herself and it confuses her that he excites her so much.
It's part of what makes ESB the best scripted and directed film of the whole saga - the way Leia falls in love with Han, despite herself, over the course of the film is absolutely brilliant!
- Time
- Post link
- Time
- Post link
Originally posted by: TheCassidy
Tits. It needed tits.
Y'know, a generous sprinkling of tits would encourage me to watch Luca$h's PT again! Fan edit, anyone?... Tits. It needed tits.
- Time
- Post link
- Time
- Post link
- It needed less Anakin and more Obi-Wan.
- Showing the Death Star plans near the end with Dooku ..was cheesey to say the very least.
But all that said and done, I do like Jar-Jar Binks. He is an important character when it comes to the senate, because he's the one that actually appoints the Supreme Chancellor. Rather than annoying in TPM I find him utterly hilarious.
- Time
- Post link
Endless problems, but one of the worst is the portrayal of Jedi. I agree with others that they should be more detached and remote, like samurai. A meeting with Yoda should be a special and mysterious trip, like meeting with Nicodemus of the rats of NIMH. But most of all, the Jedi Temple was a horrendous mistake.
The Jedi are a religion of life. Yoda has his whole famous speech about how the Force grows from the life in the universe. Why else would he live in Dagobah? That planet is absolutely dripping with living things. So where does George place the Jedi to worship? In a steel and marble monstrosity that doesn't have so much as a potted plant. AND the council meets in a chamber at the tippy-top of the highest tower, as far as possible from the life-sustaining earth below. A true Jedi would HATE IT in that place. It's a chilly, lifeless hell.
That's really not the worst mistake in the PT, but it exemplifies the thoughtlessness that infects everything else. Literally - he just did things without thinking about what they meant.
- Time
- Post link
Originally posted by: Nobody
Too many responses to get caught up, so here's hoping I'm saying something new...
Endless problems, but one of the worst is the portrayal of Jedi. I agree with others that they should be more detached and remote, like samurai. A meeting with Yoda should be a special and mysterious trip, like meeting with Nicodemus of the rats of NIMH. But most of all, the Jedi Temple was a horrendous mistake.
In ESB, Yoda did mention to Luke that he kept a council of Jedi. If this council has a place to meet, as in the Temple on Coruscant, then that just means the Jedi found it more convenient for them to gather in a place instead of trying to have meetings while scattered around the far corners of the galaxy.
In ROTS I did think the meeting between Anakin and Yoda was very mysterious. Yoda was sitting next to the window, cast in shadow,and you could only see clearly parts of his face. Every word he said was very elusive, mystical, if not a bit dark. His advice was that Anakin must let go of everything he holds dear to him (Padme.)
I understand what you mean. However, have you ever thought that life still comes from the living beings on Coruscant? It is a huge city; and while I'll admit it is lacking in plants where there needs to be, humans/aliens/and everything in between are in the hundreds of millions! That is probably enough life Force to sustain the Jedi's love for living things.
That's really not the worst mistake in the PT, but it exemplifies the thoughtlessness that infects everything else. Literally - he just did things without thinking about what they meant.
Too many responses to get caught up, so here's hoping I'm saying something new...
Endless problems, but one of the worst is the portrayal of Jedi. I agree with others that they should be more detached and remote, like samurai. A meeting with Yoda should be a special and mysterious trip, like meeting with Nicodemus of the rats of NIMH. But most of all, the Jedi Temple was a horrendous mistake.
In ESB, Yoda did mention to Luke that he kept a council of Jedi. If this council has a place to meet, as in the Temple on Coruscant, then that just means the Jedi found it more convenient for them to gather in a place instead of trying to have meetings while scattered around the far corners of the galaxy.
In ROTS I did think the meeting between Anakin and Yoda was very mysterious. Yoda was sitting next to the window, cast in shadow,and you could only see clearly parts of his face. Every word he said was very elusive, mystical, if not a bit dark. His advice was that Anakin must let go of everything he holds dear to him (Padme.)
The Jedi are a religion of life. Yoda has his whole famous speech about how the Force grows from the life in the universe. Why else would he live in Dagobah? That planet is absolutely dripping with living things. So where does George place the Jedi to worship? In a steel and marble monstrosity that doesn't have so much as a potted plant. AND the council meets in a chamber at the tippy-top of the highest tower, as far as possible from the life-sustaining earth below. A true Jedi would HATE IT in that place. It's a chilly, lifeless hell.
I understand what you mean. However, have you ever thought that life still comes from the living beings on Coruscant? It is a huge city; and while I'll admit it is lacking in plants where there needs to be, humans/aliens/and everything in between are in the hundreds of millions! That is probably enough life Force to sustain the Jedi's love for living things.
That's really not the worst mistake in the PT, but it exemplifies the thoughtlessness that infects everything else. Literally - he just did things without thinking about what they meant.
It's my opinion that George Lucas did think everything out. Maybe he missed some things and created inconsistancies, but nothing huge. Anyone who creates a prequel trilogy is undoubtedly going to come out with some inconsistancies. Lucas, by seeing how everything turned out, did a great job!!
- Time
- Post link
The direction is awful of course but the dialogue is worse.
why else were the best scenes ones with no dialogue?
"Miss you, I will, Original Trilogy..."
"Your midichlorians are weak, Old man." -Darth Vader 2007 super deluxe extra special dipped in chocolate sauce edition.
http://prequelsstink.ytmnd.com/
- Time
- Post link
Originally posted by: BeeJay
In ESB, Yoda did mention to Luke that he kept a council of Jedi. If this council has a place to meet, as in the Temple on Coruscant, then that just means the Jedi found it more convenient for them to gather in a place instead of trying to have meetings while scattered around the far corners of the galaxy.
In ESB, Yoda did mention to Luke that he kept a council of Jedi. If this council has a place to meet, as in the Temple on Coruscant, then that just means the Jedi found it more convenient for them to gather in a place instead of trying to have meetings while scattered around the far corners of the galaxy.
Could you elaborate on which scene you mean? Because I believe you're referring to this:
"Ready, are you? What know you of ready? For eight hundred years have I trained Jedi. My own counsel will I keep on who is to be trained!"
That is not council as in "city council", but counsel as in "judgment". Below is the link:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=counsel
Want to book yourself or a guest on THE VFP Show? PM me!
- Time
- Post link
I understand what you mean. However, have you ever thought that life still comes from the living beings on Coruscant? It is a huge city; and while I'll admit it is lacking in plants where there needs to be, humans/aliens/and everything in between are in the hundreds of millions! That is probably enough life Force to sustain the Jedi's love for living things.
Enough, for sure. But just "enough" isn't good enough for the central hub of a religion. It should be "the most" - a concentration of everything they hold dear. What about the design of the Jedi Temple has anything to do with what they believe in? It looks cool and impressive, but it's got nothing to do with the Jedi religion. And why all the steel? From the outside, the building looks like a Fabergé factory. It blends right into the industrial/commercial opulance that makes Coruscant such a spectacular - and dehumanizing - place. Sure, the city's filled with lots and lots and LOTS of people. So is Grand Central Station. Can you imagine a Jedi relishing in his love of life by standing in a train station?
I understand the desire for a central meeting place - someplace close to the halls of political power. But why not make that place a respite from the chaos around it? If I ran the zoo, my inspiration for the Temple would be the Hanging Gardens of Babylon. It doesn't need to be a messy, uncultivated swamp like Dagobah. A place low to the ground, but spread over many miles, full of gardens and orchards and strange animals and children chasing each other around while doing spectacular stunts in the trees. A place where the buildings are crafted by loving and talented hands, not by machines - pinnacles of art and of patience. Perhaps, a place where the concentrated energy of the Force is so great that rocks float in the lake, and flowers grow out of thin air. And my mind is really wandering there - I'm sure there are totally different directions you could take this idea, but the point is that it's not hard to envision a temple that is both spectacular and centrally located, and that still exemplifies the Jedi ideals. Yet Lucas didn't bother. He didn't think.
And, for the record, my opinion is that he thought very little through, and that it had a very huge effect. People slam his directing all the time, and it sure wasn't great, but the real problem is the story itself. The writing. Stupid little things that contradict and didn't occur to him, and add up to hurt the films at all the critical points. Stuff like Queen Amidala is "young and naive," but it turns out she was elected, so the whole young-monarch-inherits-huge-responsibility concept has the rug pulled right out from under it. Stuff like building a protocol droid to help his poverty-stricken mother. With what? Dinner parties? How is it that he fits perfectly into a mass-produced shell? Did Anakin buy the do-it-yourself kit? He should have built R2-D2. For one thing, Artoo is unique. For another, Artoo is plucky and resourceful and heroic - and could therefore be considered the embodiment of his good traits, even during the rebellion. The only thing Threepio seems to have inherited is his whininess.
And there. RIGHT THERE. That's the big one. Anakin is a brat. There is no level on which that was a good decision, and it's not just Hayden's performance - he was written that way. And it spoils everything it touches. This is supposed to be a tragedy, but a tragedy only works when you sympathize with the main character. It's tragic because you can see how that person's flaws led to their downfall, and because you realize how likely it is that you would have done the same. You can hate Michael Corleone, but all the moreso because you know how good he could have been, and because you understand why he made every choice he did. I don't understand any of the choices Anakin made. I don't sympathize with him, I don't relate to him, and I find him annoying and idiotic. He was characterized very badly and very inconsistently. That alone, even if everything else was perfect, destroys the entire trilogy. That character arc is the entire reason the movies were made in the first place. If that arc works, then everything else is forgivable, and if it doesn't, then nothing else matters.... and Lucas botched it. Badly.
- Time
- Post link
Originally posted by: vote_for_palpatine
Could you elaborate on which scene you mean? Because I believe you're referring to this:
"Ready, are you? What know you of ready? For eight hundred years have I trained Jedi. My own counsel will I keep on who is to be trained!"
That is not council as in "city council", but counsel as in "judgment". Below is the link:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=counsel
Originally posted by: BeeJay
In ESB, Yoda did mention to Luke that he kept a council of Jedi. If this council has a place to meet, as in the Temple on Coruscant, then that just means the Jedi found it more convenient for them to gather in a place instead of trying to have meetings while scattered around the far corners of the galaxy.
In ESB, Yoda did mention to Luke that he kept a council of Jedi. If this council has a place to meet, as in the Temple on Coruscant, then that just means the Jedi found it more convenient for them to gather in a place instead of trying to have meetings while scattered around the far corners of the galaxy.
Could you elaborate on which scene you mean? Because I believe you're referring to this:
"Ready, are you? What know you of ready? For eight hundred years have I trained Jedi. My own counsel will I keep on who is to be trained!"
That is not council as in "city council", but counsel as in "judgment". Below is the link:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=counsel
Yeah, I didn't get what he was referring to. Good call.
- Time
- Post link
- Time
- Post link
Originally posted by: vote_for_palpatine
Could you elaborate on which scene you mean? Because I believe you're referring to this:
"Ready, are you? What know you of ready? For eight hundred years have I trained Jedi. My own counsel will I keep on who is to be trained!"
That is not council as in "city council", but counsel as in "judgment". Below is the link:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=counsel
Originally posted by: BeeJay
In ESB, Yoda did mention to Luke that he kept a council of Jedi. If this council has a place to meet, as in the Temple on Coruscant, then that just means the Jedi found it more convenient for them to gather in a place instead of trying to have meetings while scattered around the far corners of the galaxy.
In ESB, Yoda did mention to Luke that he kept a council of Jedi. If this council has a place to meet, as in the Temple on Coruscant, then that just means the Jedi found it more convenient for them to gather in a place instead of trying to have meetings while scattered around the far corners of the galaxy.
Could you elaborate on which scene you mean? Because I believe you're referring to this:
"Ready, are you? What know you of ready? For eight hundred years have I trained Jedi. My own counsel will I keep on who is to be trained!"
That is not council as in "city council", but counsel as in "judgment". Below is the link:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=counsel
All that I was saying was that there was a need for a Jedi council. You are right, I misremembered the quote. But I think Yoda and Obi-Wan's interactions, especially when Obi-Wan is trying to convince Yoda to take Luke as an apprentice, really give the impression that the Jedi were an order of individuals.
Here's Yoda coming up with excuses why Luke can't become a Jedi, and Ben says to the impatience argument: "So was I, if you remember." (Obi-wan as a youngling had impatience.)
- Time
- Post link
Originally posted by: Nobody
Enough, for sure. But just "enough" isn't good enough for the central hub of a religion. It should be "the most" - a concentration of everything they hold dear. What about the design of the Jedi Temple has anything to do with what they believe in? It looks cool and impressive, but it's got nothing to do with the Jedi religion. And why all the steel? From the outside, the building looks like a Fabergé factory. It blends right into the industrial/commercial opulance that makes Coruscant such a spectacular - and dehumanizing - place. Sure, the city's filled with lots and lots and LOTS of people. So is Grand Central Station. Can you imagine a Jedi relishing in his love of life by standing in a train station?
We can't say for sure why the Jedi temple is like it is. In all fairness it does have its uniqueness among other monuments around. It has four thin towers reaching up to the height of the skyline, and in the center is the main tower (which I assume the council chamber is at the very top, overlooking everything all around the cityscape.) These tower designs could very well be symbolic for something to do with the Force, or more probable: precepts of their beliefs. Maybe the number of towers is significant, I am not sure
And while there is a lot of metal, I do believe many of the floors are carpeted and stone. Stone floors are as close to organic as the Temple interior gets, I'll admit. Not to mention all the organic warm/cool colors.
I remember George talking in DVD commentary for ANH (if this is wrong, someone correct me. Could be in another one of the OT movies, but I'm pretty sure it is Episode IV,) how the saga is told from the two droids' point of view. He expanded that to the droids having a part of the entire saga, so you could go as far as to say the entire saga is told from their viewpoint!
Threepio and Artoo are loosely themselves based on the 'Hidden Fortress' duo of unlucky guys who run into a princess, war, heroes, etc. etc.
So we know that one or both of these two droids had to make an appearance from very early on in The Phantom Menace. Whether or not Anakin got a DIY kit and started working on Threepio is sort of immaterial. A nine-year-old who can put together anything that advanced, whether DIY or not, is someone who is good at gadgetery and mechanics to a very high extent.
Should he have created Artoo? Well, we know that Artoo becomes significant because the Naboo cruiser they are using to bust from the blockade is damaged (shield generators) and I couldn't picture any other droid except for an astromech droids going and repairing that damage. If Anakin had created Artoo, then Threepio would have needed an introduction at that point, and I don't know about you: but I can't picture a protocal droid going out to the surface of a ship while in space and fixing the generators.
And there. RIGHT THERE. That's the big one. Anakin is a brat. There is no level on which that was a good decision, and it's not just Hayden's performance - he was written that way. And it spoils everything it touches. This is supposed to be a tragedy, but a tragedy only works when you sympathize with the main character. It's tragic because you can see how that person's flaws led to their downfall, and because you realize how likely it is that you would have done the same. You can hate Michael Corleone, but all the moreso because you know how good he could have been, and because you understand why he made every choice he did. I don't understand any of the choices Anakin made. I don't sympathize with him, I don't relate to him, and I find him annoying and idiotic. He was characterized very badly and very inconsistently. That alone, even if everything else was perfect, destroys the entire trilogy. That character arc is the entire reason the movies were made in the first place. If that arc works, then everything else is forgivable, and if it doesn't, then nothing else matters.... and Lucas botched it. Badly.
Enough, for sure. But just "enough" isn't good enough for the central hub of a religion. It should be "the most" - a concentration of everything they hold dear. What about the design of the Jedi Temple has anything to do with what they believe in? It looks cool and impressive, but it's got nothing to do with the Jedi religion. And why all the steel? From the outside, the building looks like a Fabergé factory. It blends right into the industrial/commercial opulance that makes Coruscant such a spectacular - and dehumanizing - place. Sure, the city's filled with lots and lots and LOTS of people. So is Grand Central Station. Can you imagine a Jedi relishing in his love of life by standing in a train station?
We can't say for sure why the Jedi temple is like it is. In all fairness it does have its uniqueness among other monuments around. It has four thin towers reaching up to the height of the skyline, and in the center is the main tower (which I assume the council chamber is at the very top, overlooking everything all around the cityscape.) These tower designs could very well be symbolic for something to do with the Force, or more probable: precepts of their beliefs. Maybe the number of towers is significant, I am not sure
And while there is a lot of metal, I do believe many of the floors are carpeted and stone. Stone floors are as close to organic as the Temple interior gets, I'll admit. Not to mention all the organic warm/cool colors.
I understand the desire for a central meeting place - someplace close to the halls of political power. But why not make that place a respite from the chaos around it? If I ran the zoo, my inspiration for the Temple would be the Hanging Gardens of Babylon. It doesn't need to be a messy, uncultivated swamp like Dagobah. A place low to the ground, but spread over many miles, full of gardens and orchards and strange animals and children chasing each other around while doing spectacular stunts in the trees. A place where the buildings are crafted by loving and talented hands, not by machines - pinnacles of art and of patience. Perhaps, a place where the concentrated energy of the Force is so great that rocks float in the lake, and flowers grow out of thin air. And my mind is really wandering there - I'm sure there are totally different directions you could take this idea, but the point is that it's not hard to envision a temple that is both spectacular and centrally located, and that still exemplifies the Jedi ideals. Yet Lucas didn't bother. He didn't think.
That description is neat. Definitely would have put a new spin on things in ROTS, if instead of Anakin walking into a metal/stone/dreary building, he walked passed statues of Jedi long gone, down beautiful gardens paths. There really would have been a clash of good and evil in that moment, if the Temple were as you imagined it. That's a neat idea.
The centralized location is near other important Coruscantian (?) political locations. This never is confirmed 100%, but if you take a look at the different types of locations around the Temple, which as you said are very near (the Temple isn't secluded at all,) you do get the sense that the architects decided to put the Jedi headquarters there because it is near where a LOT of negotiations will need to take place. Think how much violence breaks out in these seemingly civilized places! The Jedi need to be near. I think George Lucas realized this, so put the Jedi Temple right where everyone else important is.
And, for the record, my opinion is that he thought very little through, and that it had a very huge effect. People slam his directing all the time, and it sure wasn't great, but the real problem is the story itself. The writing. Stupid little things that contradict and didn't occur to him, and add up to hurt the films at all the critical points. Stuff like Queen Amidala is "young and naive," but it turns out she was elected, so the whole young-monarch-inherits-huge-responsibility concept has the rug pulled right out from under it. Stuff like building a protocol droid to help his poverty-stricken mother. With what? Dinner parties? How is it that he fits perfectly into a mass-produced shell? Did Anakin buy the do-it-yourself kit? He should have built R2-D2. For one thing, Artoo is unique. For another, Artoo is plucky and resourceful and heroic - and could therefore be considered the embodiment of his good traits, even during the rebellion. The only thing Threepio seems to have inherited is his whininess.
That description is neat. Definitely would have put a new spin on things in ROTS, if instead of Anakin walking into a metal/stone/dreary building, he walked passed statues of Jedi long gone, down beautiful gardens paths. There really would have been a clash of good and evil in that moment, if the Temple were as you imagined it. That's a neat idea.
The centralized location is near other important Coruscantian (?) political locations. This never is confirmed 100%, but if you take a look at the different types of locations around the Temple, which as you said are very near (the Temple isn't secluded at all,) you do get the sense that the architects decided to put the Jedi headquarters there because it is near where a LOT of negotiations will need to take place. Think how much violence breaks out in these seemingly civilized places! The Jedi need to be near. I think George Lucas realized this, so put the Jedi Temple right where everyone else important is.
And, for the record, my opinion is that he thought very little through, and that it had a very huge effect. People slam his directing all the time, and it sure wasn't great, but the real problem is the story itself. The writing. Stupid little things that contradict and didn't occur to him, and add up to hurt the films at all the critical points. Stuff like Queen Amidala is "young and naive," but it turns out she was elected, so the whole young-monarch-inherits-huge-responsibility concept has the rug pulled right out from under it. Stuff like building a protocol droid to help his poverty-stricken mother. With what? Dinner parties? How is it that he fits perfectly into a mass-produced shell? Did Anakin buy the do-it-yourself kit? He should have built R2-D2. For one thing, Artoo is unique. For another, Artoo is plucky and resourceful and heroic - and could therefore be considered the embodiment of his good traits, even during the rebellion. The only thing Threepio seems to have inherited is his whininess.
I remember George talking in DVD commentary for ANH (if this is wrong, someone correct me. Could be in another one of the OT movies, but I'm pretty sure it is Episode IV,) how the saga is told from the two droids' point of view. He expanded that to the droids having a part of the entire saga, so you could go as far as to say the entire saga is told from their viewpoint!
Threepio and Artoo are loosely themselves based on the 'Hidden Fortress' duo of unlucky guys who run into a princess, war, heroes, etc. etc.
So we know that one or both of these two droids had to make an appearance from very early on in The Phantom Menace. Whether or not Anakin got a DIY kit and started working on Threepio is sort of immaterial. A nine-year-old who can put together anything that advanced, whether DIY or not, is someone who is good at gadgetery and mechanics to a very high extent.
Should he have created Artoo? Well, we know that Artoo becomes significant because the Naboo cruiser they are using to bust from the blockade is damaged (shield generators) and I couldn't picture any other droid except for an astromech droids going and repairing that damage. If Anakin had created Artoo, then Threepio would have needed an introduction at that point, and I don't know about you: but I can't picture a protocal droid going out to the surface of a ship while in space and fixing the generators.
And there. RIGHT THERE. That's the big one. Anakin is a brat. There is no level on which that was a good decision, and it's not just Hayden's performance - he was written that way. And it spoils everything it touches. This is supposed to be a tragedy, but a tragedy only works when you sympathize with the main character. It's tragic because you can see how that person's flaws led to their downfall, and because you realize how likely it is that you would have done the same. You can hate Michael Corleone, but all the moreso because you know how good he could have been, and because you understand why he made every choice he did. I don't understand any of the choices Anakin made. I don't sympathize with him, I don't relate to him, and I find him annoying and idiotic. He was characterized very badly and very inconsistently. That alone, even if everything else was perfect, destroys the entire trilogy. That character arc is the entire reason the movies were made in the first place. If that arc works, then everything else is forgivable, and if it doesn't, then nothing else matters.... and Lucas botched it. Badly.
Anakin in the PT was always bordering on being a closet sociopath. We need to sympathize with all he had to put up with from the Jedi, along with the death of his mother. While some feel his turn to the darkside wasn't very emotional, and that he had no real reason to turn: make up for that by knowing that Anakin was naturally unstable from the beginning. If it was Obi-Wan's cynical attitude toward his padawan that made Anakin INITIALLY twisted, we'll never know. But the fact is, even by the beginning of AOTC, Anakin was demented to a certain extent already.
Darth Vader in the Original Trilogy was of course an extremely dark villain. To be realistic, George knew he had to incomporate dark elements into Anakin's mind from the start. Yes, Anakin is whiney, and yes he is a brat. But that is emotion pent up inside of his soul from back in the days of being a slave. The reason Jake Lloyd as Anakin showed very little darkness, is that the darkness had yet to actually set in. The young boy couldn't yet filter out what to feel and what not to feel, so he took the path of being a normal, innocent boy. So as that boy got older, he started being able to understand these emotions. But understanding emotions doesn't mean you can deal with them. Anakin, being a Jedi, having to supress all these wild emotions, was required by nature to become a brat.
- Time
- Post link
I remember George talking in DVD commentary for ANH (if this is wrong, someone correct me. Could be in another one of the OT movies, but I'm pretty sure it is Episode IV,) how the saga is told from the two droids' point of view. He expanded that to the droids having a part of the entire saga, so you could go as far as to say the entire saga is told from their viewpoint!
The original Star Wars is a very classically and carefully structured piece of cinema, and it's definitely told from the droid's viewpoint. I think that ideal was much looser in the following two movies, so I'd say it's a stretch that the whole saga is from their point-of-view, but they're obviously a presence throughout.
But, regarding Anakin's involvement, it only makes sense to me that he might have built Artoo. It's not real science that matters here, it's movie logic. Although both robots are technically complex, it is because of Artoo's personality that he speaks much more highly of Anakin's abilities.
And that doesn't require taking the heroic repair job away from him. That scene was obviously contrived to introduce him, so it could simply be contrived at a different spot. A flock of robots driving out onto the hull to fix a severed wire is a little silly anyway. Imagine this instead: the ship is damaged, and either they have no droids, or none can fix it, and that's why they have to land. On Tatooine they meet Artoo, who comes with. NOW something goes wrong. They could be attacked again - could be Trade goons, or maybe Jabba discovered them and sent his own cronies (interesting chance to see another culture's space tech)- or maybe Obi-Wan is simply a lousy mechanic and his upgrades break. My vote is that Maul is after them, and Obi-wan didn't get the hyperdrive working right, and Anakin and Artoo work together to get it running in time - probably requiring Artoo's spacewalk. Makes them both look good.
And what about Threepio? He's easy. As a protocol droid, he fits nicely into any official hospitality capacity, of which there are plenty, since the prequels deal with so many politicians. It was nice meeting a counter-part of his right off the bat, and frankly, I was expecting to see many more. For instance, you know who could probably use such a droid in their employ, but was conspicuously missing one? Amidala. So, that's my answer: Threepio works for Amidala. Which means we meet him in Naboo, and he's been along with the main characters the whole time. Probably we first see him on the escape ship - it would make sense for him to be stationed there, since it's sortof Naboo's Air Force One. Again, the movie logic side of my brain really likes this idea, because it means one droid belongs to Anakin, and the other to Padme. Nice and symmetrical.
The young boy couldn't yet filter out what to feel and what not to feel, so he took the path of being a normal, innocent boy. So as that boy got older, he started being able to understand these emotions. But understanding emotions doesn't mean you can deal with them. Anakin, being a Jedi, having to supress all these wild emotions, was required by nature to become a brat.
The original Star Wars is a very classically and carefully structured piece of cinema, and it's definitely told from the droid's viewpoint. I think that ideal was much looser in the following two movies, so I'd say it's a stretch that the whole saga is from their point-of-view, but they're obviously a presence throughout.
But, regarding Anakin's involvement, it only makes sense to me that he might have built Artoo. It's not real science that matters here, it's movie logic. Although both robots are technically complex, it is because of Artoo's personality that he speaks much more highly of Anakin's abilities.
And that doesn't require taking the heroic repair job away from him. That scene was obviously contrived to introduce him, so it could simply be contrived at a different spot. A flock of robots driving out onto the hull to fix a severed wire is a little silly anyway. Imagine this instead: the ship is damaged, and either they have no droids, or none can fix it, and that's why they have to land. On Tatooine they meet Artoo, who comes with. NOW something goes wrong. They could be attacked again - could be Trade goons, or maybe Jabba discovered them and sent his own cronies (interesting chance to see another culture's space tech)- or maybe Obi-Wan is simply a lousy mechanic and his upgrades break. My vote is that Maul is after them, and Obi-wan didn't get the hyperdrive working right, and Anakin and Artoo work together to get it running in time - probably requiring Artoo's spacewalk. Makes them both look good.
And what about Threepio? He's easy. As a protocol droid, he fits nicely into any official hospitality capacity, of which there are plenty, since the prequels deal with so many politicians. It was nice meeting a counter-part of his right off the bat, and frankly, I was expecting to see many more. For instance, you know who could probably use such a droid in their employ, but was conspicuously missing one? Amidala. So, that's my answer: Threepio works for Amidala. Which means we meet him in Naboo, and he's been along with the main characters the whole time. Probably we first see him on the escape ship - it would make sense for him to be stationed there, since it's sortof Naboo's Air Force One. Again, the movie logic side of my brain really likes this idea, because it means one droid belongs to Anakin, and the other to Padme. Nice and symmetrical.
The young boy couldn't yet filter out what to feel and what not to feel, so he took the path of being a normal, innocent boy. So as that boy got older, he started being able to understand these emotions. But understanding emotions doesn't mean you can deal with them. Anakin, being a Jedi, having to supress all these wild emotions, was required by nature to become a brat.
You know, I'm sure you can find a way to explain any of his actions, but it didn't come across to me on the screen. It's not that he wasn't emotional enough, or the scene wasn't emotional enough - it's just the emotions seemed contrived... they seemed inconsistent. But I don't want to debate this subject much, because it could go on forever, and I think it's off-topic here.