Originally posted by: Cable-X1
So when he says all this about a film no longer belonging to its creator and that ownership is illusory, I APPLAUD him too. The man is 100% right. Period. Lucas doesn't "own" SW anymore. He lost a certain amount of control over it when he released it into the public consciousness back in 1977. Yes, he does own the sole right to make money off of it and do whatever he wants with the intellectual property, but that doesn't negate that it now belongs to everyone. I believe Lucas MUST acknowledge and respect that. By not doing it, he has effectively turned his back on his fans.
I agree with all of you except one thing: Lucas DOES NOT have to acknowledge and respect our wishes. He can do pretty much everything he wants with his works. No matter how much the fans will cry and whine here.
Gomer posts here that Lucas respects his fans. No sir, he DOES NOT. Refusing to release the versions that an entire generation has grown up with and that made Lucas rich is not repecting his fans. It is disrespectful because he is denying fans something that is a part of their lives. He's taking away something that means something to someone else because he doesn't feel it's appropriate anymore. That is WRONG ON EVERY LEVEL.
Calm down, dude. You sound like Star Wars is being a drug, and you are the junky on turkey. In the end, Lucas does what he can, whether you prefer to accept it, or not. Call him a bastard, idiot, whatever you feel, it won´t change anything.
Now he has somewhat caved by releasing the OOT last September, but I don't think that release was spurred on by out petition or by some high artistic realization that the originals should be respected. Lucas released them to make a quick buck. And he released a shitty product at that. That's just more disrepect.
It´s neither respect nor disrespect. It´s marketing. Slap the OOT on disc and bundle it with the unsold SE discs from stock. Nothing more.
Go-Mer is at least in one thing right: there are really vicious people here demonizing Lucas. He neither is a demon, nor an angel. He does, what every corporation in the world does: maximize profits. Nothing more. If you cry at him, cry at the whole capitalistic system, because he is just doing what he is allowed to do. Legally, Star Wars does NOT belong to us, that´s the cruel truth.
You both are two extremes: Go-Mer is the Lucas lover, you decided to utterly hate this man for his actions. At least, it´s something to fill out boring evenings, right?
To me what Lucas says makes more sense, because all Kurtz says is he doesn't understand why they wouldn't have tried more takes if that was really what Lucas wanted. It's also important to note that the reason Lucas and him had a falling out was because in Lucas' words "he wouldn't say no to anything." They went their separate ways becuase the budget blew out of control on Kurtz's watch.
One doesn't have anything to do with the other. The Greedo thing took place before SW became popular, so Kurtz "not saying no to anything" doesn't apply here. If Lucas wanted the scene a certain way, then he could have taken more than 3 takes to get it. Hell, some scenes in movies get 10, 15, 20 takes. Why was this one not worth anymore? And incidentally, I agree with the earlier quote that hundreds of westerns have been made before SW. Lucas couldn't cop a scene from one of them to get pointers. Bullshit, man. Han shot first from the start. Lucas pussed out with the SEs.
The problem is the following:
- Kurtz may be lying
- Lucas may be lying
Lucas defendants choose to denounce everything Kurtz says and prefer Lucas opinion, Lucas haters prefer to choose the other way around. The only thing which all sources claim, is that Lucas really suffered making the first Star Wars. A lot of pressure was put on him during the whole production. He could indeed have done things differently than he really would like to have. On the other hand though, this IS what created the film in the first place. This whole atmosphere influenced the creative process, apparently positively. Otherwise, the original movies wouldn´t have had this succes. Lucas and lot of his supporters fail to realize this important point.
So it doesn't suprise me when I hear Lucas saying he cut his losses after 3 takes, and for Kurtz to wonder why he didn't just keep trying until he got the shot he wanted.
To me Kurtz's account only bolsters Lucas' claim.
That is so weak, Gomer. I expect better arguments from you...
So when he says all this about a film no longer belonging to its creator and that ownership is illusory, I APPLAUD him too. The man is 100% right. Period. Lucas doesn't "own" SW anymore. He lost a certain amount of control over it when he released it into the public consciousness back in 1977. Yes, he does own the sole right to make money off of it and do whatever he wants with the intellectual property, but that doesn't negate that it now belongs to everyone. I believe Lucas MUST acknowledge and respect that. By not doing it, he has effectively turned his back on his fans.
I agree with all of you except one thing: Lucas DOES NOT have to acknowledge and respect our wishes. He can do pretty much everything he wants with his works. No matter how much the fans will cry and whine here.
Gomer posts here that Lucas respects his fans. No sir, he DOES NOT. Refusing to release the versions that an entire generation has grown up with and that made Lucas rich is not repecting his fans. It is disrespectful because he is denying fans something that is a part of their lives. He's taking away something that means something to someone else because he doesn't feel it's appropriate anymore. That is WRONG ON EVERY LEVEL.
Calm down, dude. You sound like Star Wars is being a drug, and you are the junky on turkey. In the end, Lucas does what he can, whether you prefer to accept it, or not. Call him a bastard, idiot, whatever you feel, it won´t change anything.
Now he has somewhat caved by releasing the OOT last September, but I don't think that release was spurred on by out petition or by some high artistic realization that the originals should be respected. Lucas released them to make a quick buck. And he released a shitty product at that. That's just more disrepect.
It´s neither respect nor disrespect. It´s marketing. Slap the OOT on disc and bundle it with the unsold SE discs from stock. Nothing more.
Go-Mer is at least in one thing right: there are really vicious people here demonizing Lucas. He neither is a demon, nor an angel. He does, what every corporation in the world does: maximize profits. Nothing more. If you cry at him, cry at the whole capitalistic system, because he is just doing what he is allowed to do. Legally, Star Wars does NOT belong to us, that´s the cruel truth.
Originally posted by: Go-Mer-Tonic
Yeah there are a lot of people who say different things, but when it comes to what Lucas was thinking in his own head, I will take his word for it.
Even when it seems to change so much? His "word" will change with every new edition of the saga and you'll go right along with it?
Yeah there are a lot of people who say different things, but when it comes to what Lucas was thinking in his own head, I will take his word for it.
Even when it seems to change so much? His "word" will change with every new edition of the saga and you'll go right along with it?
You both are two extremes: Go-Mer is the Lucas lover, you decided to utterly hate this man for his actions. At least, it´s something to fill out boring evenings, right?
To me what Lucas says makes more sense, because all Kurtz says is he doesn't understand why they wouldn't have tried more takes if that was really what Lucas wanted. It's also important to note that the reason Lucas and him had a falling out was because in Lucas' words "he wouldn't say no to anything." They went their separate ways becuase the budget blew out of control on Kurtz's watch.
One doesn't have anything to do with the other. The Greedo thing took place before SW became popular, so Kurtz "not saying no to anything" doesn't apply here. If Lucas wanted the scene a certain way, then he could have taken more than 3 takes to get it. Hell, some scenes in movies get 10, 15, 20 takes. Why was this one not worth anymore? And incidentally, I agree with the earlier quote that hundreds of westerns have been made before SW. Lucas couldn't cop a scene from one of them to get pointers. Bullshit, man. Han shot first from the start. Lucas pussed out with the SEs.
The problem is the following:
- Kurtz may be lying
- Lucas may be lying
Lucas defendants choose to denounce everything Kurtz says and prefer Lucas opinion, Lucas haters prefer to choose the other way around. The only thing which all sources claim, is that Lucas really suffered making the first Star Wars. A lot of pressure was put on him during the whole production. He could indeed have done things differently than he really would like to have. On the other hand though, this IS what created the film in the first place. This whole atmosphere influenced the creative process, apparently positively. Otherwise, the original movies wouldn´t have had this succes. Lucas and lot of his supporters fail to realize this important point.
So it doesn't suprise me when I hear Lucas saying he cut his losses after 3 takes, and for Kurtz to wonder why he didn't just keep trying until he got the shot he wanted.
To me Kurtz's account only bolsters Lucas' claim.
That is so weak, Gomer. I expect better arguments from you...
Sorry, but so are you. You both are practically the same, only the other way around.