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Eyes Wide Shut (Original Cut Preservation / Edit) (* unfinished project *) — Page 2
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Originally posted by: Nan Tucket
Just 'bumping' this ancient thread to mention that I have the Hong Kong release, Region 3, unedited DVD-9 version of 'Eyes Wide Shut.' Product code: "Standard NA18085"
I understood from reading some web site (can't find it just now) that my version has the excised Hindu chanting or whatever. But I haven't checked that yet. I can check for that, or help in some other way.
Also: the movie was shot in 4:3 by Kubrick, and that was his expressed preference for home video viewing. He allowed it to be presented in 1.85:1 in theatres, yes (with some of the bottom/top of the full frame matted out). There will be no "widescreen" video release of this film. Likewise for a few other Kubrick movies, as mentioned above. I would expect that Kubrick's expressed preference on this question will be honoured by Warner video.
Just 'bumping' this ancient thread to mention that I have the Hong Kong release, Region 3, unedited DVD-9 version of 'Eyes Wide Shut.' Product code: "Standard NA18085"
I understood from reading some web site (can't find it just now) that my version has the excised Hindu chanting or whatever. But I haven't checked that yet. I can check for that, or help in some other way.
Also: the movie was shot in 4:3 by Kubrick, and that was his expressed preference for home video viewing. He allowed it to be presented in 1.85:1 in theatres, yes (with some of the bottom/top of the full frame matted out). There will be no "widescreen" video release of this film. Likewise for a few other Kubrick movies, as mentioned above. I would expect that Kubrick's expressed preference on this question will be honoured by Warner video.
Nan (and anyone else interested),
I have been looking for a definitive answer to the question of whether or not the region 3 version is complete (has the chant) since I learned of the DVD. I've scanned the Kubrick newsgroup for years too and never got a real answer to the question. Early on it was reported the region 3 (and possibly region 4 also) had the chant intact but now & then someone would dispute that. It seems like someone would have sat down and played the thing with earphones or something by now but if someone had done anything that "scientific" I haven't seen any sign of it online.
I've thought about posting on the Kubrick NG about this several times since I still don't have a copy of one of the finest films ever made (inexcusable) but I figured I'd just get directed to some crusty thread I've read before, or someone would give their inconclusive opinion again.
SO, I would love to finally have an answer on this if anyone with access to the R3 disc is willing to do a comparison with one from another region and report back, I would love to finally have an answer!
-TF
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Originally posted by: OgOggilby
Stanley Kubrick shot all of his films after Killer's Kiss for widescreen. He only asked for them to be shown unmatted when possible on the old laserdisc masters he approved back in 1991-1992. He died before having a chance to approve new transfers made for the 16x9 format. The decision to go open matte had more to do with wanting to use available image instead of letterbox bars since it wasted a lot of resolution. He protected his films for either ratio, so it was a smart move. Now that we have anamorphic widescreen, it's a moot point.
Here's how his films should be shown:
Killer's Kiss - 1.33:1
The Killing - 1.75:1
Paths of Glory - 1.75:1
Spartacus - 2.20:1 (70mm prints, preferable) or 2.35:1 (35mm scope prints, which is fine too)
Lolita - 1.66:1
Dr. Strangelove - 1.66:1
2001: A Space Odyssey - 2.20:1 (obviously)
A Clockwork Orange - 1.66:1
Barry Lyndon - 1.66:1
The Shining - 1.85:1
Full Metal Jacket - 1.85:1
Eyes Wide Shut - 1.85:1
Also, the new DVDs for The Shining and Eyes Wide Shut will be 1.85:1 anamorphic widescreen. Eyes Wide Shut will be uncut. A Clockwork Orange will be 1.66:1 anamorphic widescreen.
Stanley Kubrick shot all of his films after Killer's Kiss for widescreen. He only asked for them to be shown unmatted when possible on the old laserdisc masters he approved back in 1991-1992. He died before having a chance to approve new transfers made for the 16x9 format. The decision to go open matte had more to do with wanting to use available image instead of letterbox bars since it wasted a lot of resolution. He protected his films for either ratio, so it was a smart move. Now that we have anamorphic widescreen, it's a moot point.
Here's how his films should be shown:
Killer's Kiss - 1.33:1
The Killing - 1.75:1
Paths of Glory - 1.75:1
Spartacus - 2.20:1 (70mm prints, preferable) or 2.35:1 (35mm scope prints, which is fine too)
Lolita - 1.66:1
Dr. Strangelove - 1.66:1
2001: A Space Odyssey - 2.20:1 (obviously)
A Clockwork Orange - 1.66:1
Barry Lyndon - 1.66:1
The Shining - 1.85:1
Full Metal Jacket - 1.85:1
Eyes Wide Shut - 1.85:1
Also, the new DVDs for The Shining and Eyes Wide Shut will be 1.85:1 anamorphic widescreen. Eyes Wide Shut will be uncut. A Clockwork Orange will be 1.66:1 anamorphic widescreen.
This is true. This was only because of the horrors of home viewing. We're basically looking behind the scenes when we see these films in full frame 4:3, like the helicopter shadow in the credit sequence of the Shining, or the fake bike you see in Burton's Pee Wee's Big Adventure.
This is interesting, I hope it gets done. I figured since the unedited version is coming out soon there'd be no need for it, but the music change is real interesting, they probably wouldn't let the original music back in (it's easier to tell moralistic interest groups to screw off than it is...uhh...cultural interest groups). The "zoom in" during the mirror scene is real interesting too. [subscribes]
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My R3 disc is ripped (exact copy, with all copy protection and region coding removed), and sitting on my hard drive, so it would be very easy for me to check this out.
Let me know. Cheers.
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"Eyes Wide Shut (1999)
5.1 Dolby Digital stereo, colour, 1.85:1, 35mm.
Directed, produced, and co-written by Stanley Kubrick. A sexual and psychological thriller starring Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman, released in 1999. The narrative concerns marital jealousy and temptation, and it seemed to prefigure the collapse of Cruise and Kidman's own off-screen marriage. Eyes Wide Shut was the subject of intense speculation and rumour, climaxing in a frenzy of anticipation. The increasingly lengthy periods between Kubrick's completed film projects caused much online debate. The secrecy in which Kubrick shrouded each of his productions, and his seemingly endless filming schedules, added to the internet gossip. Kubrick did, however, allow stills photographer Manuel Harlan onto the otherwise closed set.
Before the film's premiere, the scene in which Cruise and Kidman kiss in front of a mirror was released in isolation as a teaser-trailer at the ShoWest trade fair. Intriguingly, the two versions of this kissing scene (the one in the film itself and the one in the teaser) differ slightly. The film version is shorter, is cropped on all four sides, and utilises an alternate take for the moment when Kidman removes her glasses. Kubrick died of a heart-attack a few days after completing Eyes Wide Shut and it is perhaps no coincidence that this posthumously-released film is not available in the version he originally intended.
In America, black-cloaked figures were digitally inserted to mask the simulated sex in the film's orgy sequence, in order to secure an 'R'-rating from the MPAA. (Like A Clockwork Orange, the film's extensive nudity is exclusively female and largely gratuitous.) The digital figures were, thankfully, not present when the film was screened in the UK. However, for the UK release the orgy scene was censored in a different way: a recital from the Bhagavad Gita during the Meditations music in the orgy scene was removed from the soundtrack, replaced by meaningless chanting.
The Bhagavad Gita recital is not present in any video edition of the film, though it is included on the film's soundtrack CD. All Warners VHS and DVDs are 1.33:1 unmatted (Kubrick's preferred video format for the film), though they have numerous alterations: they are clearly cropped when compared with the ShoWest teaser, a reflected crew-member in the bathroom overdose scene was digitally erased, the jarring reel-changes were smoother, and the intentional graininess of the image was reduced. All NTSC editions have the orgy sex digitally censored whereas all PAL and SeCAM editions do not. Italian inserts were filmed to replace the English-language text in the warning letter handed to Bill and the newspaper article he reads, and are available on the Italian PAL VHS version."
There is also a web page that has photos that compare scenes between the US and the International versions. I have the link but I am not sure if I can post it.
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Originally posted by: suntech
Let me jump in. Maybe this will help. I lifted this from Matthew Hunt's website
<snip>
The Bhagavad Gita recital is not present in any video edition of the film, though it is included on the film's soundtrack CD. All Warners VHS and DVDs are 1.33:1 unmatted (Kubrick's preferred video format for the film), though they have numerous alterations: they are clearly cropped when compared with the ShoWest teaser, a reflected crew-member in the bathroom overdose scene was digitally erased, the jarring reel-changes were smoother, and the intentional graininess of the image was reduced. All NTSC editions have the orgy sex digitally censored whereas all PAL and SeCAM editions do not. Italian inserts were filmed to replace the English-language text in the warning letter handed to Bill and the newspaper article he reads, and are available on the Italian PAL VHS version."
Let me jump in. Maybe this will help. I lifted this from Matthew Hunt's website
<snip>
The Bhagavad Gita recital is not present in any video edition of the film, though it is included on the film's soundtrack CD. All Warners VHS and DVDs are 1.33:1 unmatted (Kubrick's preferred video format for the film), though they have numerous alterations: they are clearly cropped when compared with the ShoWest teaser, a reflected crew-member in the bathroom overdose scene was digitally erased, the jarring reel-changes were smoother, and the intentional graininess of the image was reduced. All NTSC editions have the orgy sex digitally censored whereas all PAL and SeCAM editions do not. Italian inserts were filmed to replace the English-language text in the warning letter handed to Bill and the newspaper article he reads, and are available on the Italian PAL VHS version."
Thanks suntech, but unless there's a good reason to take that guy's word as law the same problem continues, as you can still find conflicting claims on the net as to whether or not the Bhagavad Gita is intact in certain releases.
The first attempt I came accross of region comparisons of the film (with screen shots) was from a site called "dvddebate"...I finally found the link but the site is apparently defunct. Here are two more sites on the subject:
dvdcompare
dvdtalk
Like every other discussion on the subject (or most stuff on the net for that matter) people will make claims ad nauseum but without anything to back it up.
I have yet to hear of anyone sitting down and comparing a R3 (or R4?) version to R2/R1 to see if the chanting is different, much less anyone who could recognize the Bhagavad Gita if they heard it, assuming they know where in the film to listen for it.
Nan Tucket: Thanks for your offer, but I don't know where exactly to listen for it.
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To the best of my recollection, the chanting is the same, but I can't say for sure.
Unlike the "cloaked figures," I'm not really bothered by this alteration. It seems that Kubrick would definitely have approved of this change (didn't he in fact authorize it? ... I forget). In any case, I'm still curious about resolving this "mystery" about the different video versions.
I'll be a little busy for the rest of this week, but I have this thread bookmarked, and when I get a chance I'll do a little side-by-side comparison and let you know what I have found.
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Originally posted by: Nan Tucket
Well Tomland, I see your points, but I think I am still in a position to help. In addition to my R3 DVD, I also have the Canadian VHS release. So when I find the time I can at least confirm whether these two versions have different "chanting" during the scene in question.
To the best of my recollection, the chanting is the same, but I can't say for sure.
Unlike the "cloaked figures," I'm not really bothered by this alteration. It seems that Kubrick would definitely have approved of this change (didn't he in fact authorize it? ... I forget).
The chanting wasn't noticed until release, so he didn't authorize it. It's anyone's guess whether or not he would have removed it when people complained, but he did of course want it in the film or it wouldn't have been there in first place.
Originally posted by: Nan TucketIn any case, I'm still curious about resolving this "mystery" about the different video versions.
I'll be a little busy for the rest of this week, but I have this thread bookmarked, and when I get a chance I'll do a little side-by-side comparison and let you know what I have found.
Well Tomland, I see your points, but I think I am still in a position to help. In addition to my R3 DVD, I also have the Canadian VHS release. So when I find the time I can at least confirm whether these two versions have different "chanting" during the scene in question.
To the best of my recollection, the chanting is the same, but I can't say for sure.
Unlike the "cloaked figures," I'm not really bothered by this alteration. It seems that Kubrick would definitely have approved of this change (didn't he in fact authorize it? ... I forget).
The chanting wasn't noticed until release, so he didn't authorize it. It's anyone's guess whether or not he would have removed it when people complained, but he did of course want it in the film or it wouldn't have been there in first place.
Originally posted by: Nan TucketIn any case, I'm still curious about resolving this "mystery" about the different video versions.
I'll be a little busy for the rest of this week, but I have this thread bookmarked, and when I get a chance I'll do a little side-by-side comparison and let you know what I have found.
thanks, I'll be interested in what you discover.
-TF
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Cruise and Kidman wrecked Eyes Wide Shut, Kubrick claimed
Staff and agencies
Thursday October 5, 2006
Guardian Unlimited
Stanley Kubrick regarded Eyes Wide Shut as a "piece of shit" that had been ruined by the interference of its A-list stars, a friend of the director claimed this week. The character actor R Lee Ermey starred in Kubrick's 1987 film Full Metal Jacket and remained in close contact with the director until his death in March 1999. He described the film-maker as a "shy, timid" man who was effectively bullied by his stars, Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman.
"Stanley called me about two weeks before he died," Ermey told Radar Online. "We had a long conversation about Eyes Wide Shut. He told me it was a piece of shit and that he was disgusted with it and that the critics were going to have him for lunch. He said Cruise and Kidman had their way with him - exactly the words he used."
...
I do like the film overall, but I can totally believe this. There are some real 'clunker' scenes, especially the "pot-fueled argument" scene, which unfortunately is crucial to the whole movie. The two main stars are definitely the worst thing about EWS. Staff and agencies
Thursday October 5, 2006
Guardian Unlimited
Stanley Kubrick regarded Eyes Wide Shut as a "piece of shit" that had been ruined by the interference of its A-list stars, a friend of the director claimed this week. The character actor R Lee Ermey starred in Kubrick's 1987 film Full Metal Jacket and remained in close contact with the director until his death in March 1999. He described the film-maker as a "shy, timid" man who was effectively bullied by his stars, Tom Cruise and Nicole Kidman.
"Stanley called me about two weeks before he died," Ermey told Radar Online. "We had a long conversation about Eyes Wide Shut. He told me it was a piece of shit and that he was disgusted with it and that the critics were going to have him for lunch. He said Cruise and Kidman had their way with him - exactly the words he used."
...
UPDATE: The original source is here. Interesting comments about Seven as well.
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suntech said:
Italian inserts were filmed to replace the English-language text in the warning letter handed to Bill and the newspaper article he reads, and are available on the Italian PAL VHS version."
Same is valid for the German version (though in German).
Basically the same approach as on The Shining.