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What annoys me most is that Han seems to have put on a few pounds during his time in Carbonite. Probably the reason he burst his shackles off too.
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What scene in the (O-)OT do you hate/dislike the most? — Page 3
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"What scene in the (O-)OT do you hate/dislike the most?"
None except for the 1997 or 2004 bastardized and botched versions which should be flushed down the toilet or thrown in the trash with the prequels.
“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.
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There is no lingerie in space…
C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don’t exist… then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks… and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming… Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.
What annoys me most is that Han seems to have put on a few pounds during his time in Carbonite. Probably the reason he burst his shackles off too.
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The bit I have always detested is the band in ROTJ. That blue elephant makes me want to vomit, and then they make it worse in the SE and still leave the stupid rubber blue elephant in there
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There is no lingerie in space…
C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don’t exist… then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks… and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming… Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.
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- The creature outside Jabba's palace belching (and shuddering whilst doing so) was very Muppety. The Sarlacc belching was almost as bad.
- Didn't like the SE Wampa stuff too much. Would've preferred it stay behind-the-scenes more, to make it more mysterious, kinda like Boba Fett.
- Speaking of Boba Fett, his getting hit on the back by a blind man, then screaming like a banshee was no fun.
- I think this was only an SE thing (could be wrong), but in ANH when Luke and Leia are at the corridor with no bridge, Leia fires her blaster a couple of times and it sounds just like any ordinary shotgun or Magnum or something. Always struck me as odd and very out of place.
- Various line changes and additions made to the SEs. You know the ones.
One thing I do like very much, however, is that crazy face Bib Fortuna makes with his mouth wide open. First time I noticed it, I laughed my head off!
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also, when R2 falls into the swamp: why oh why did they feel the need to change Luke's line from "you're lucky you don't taste good" to "you're lucky to get out of there"? the latter is so bland, dull, boring and OBVIOUS. of course he's lucky to get out of there, or would you prefer to rust away into mud for the rest of your existence?? the original line was a bit cheesy, granted, but it is funny. and it shows that Luke has a sense of humour.
and of course, the han shoots second, the extended musical scene at the cantina, the new song at the end of ROTJ,the silly sound effects (which are also too much ised in the prequels, i know star wars is supposed to not be entirely serious but those sounds are just too stupid...)
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Originally posted by: Han's Girlfriend the silly sound effects (which are also too much ised in the prequels, i know star wars is supposed to not be entirely serious but those sounds are just too stupid...)
I feel the same way. Some is good, most is just unneeded. The farty/bubbly sounds in the trash compactor are pretty bad (and used more than once, too, with no variation!).
What do people feel about the "Wilhelm" scream? It's so iconic that it's used in a lot of different TV shows and movies now. It's not even an in-joke anymore. I kinda just roll my eyes now when I hear it.
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Well, Greedo don't shoot first so much in ANH as he used to. I guess it bothers me but not that much. I guess I hate them aliens in ROTJ. Yeah it's not a problem exclusive to the SE but I think they put in too many of them. They were really cheesey and the folds on that elephants arms were unatural looking. I would of loved it they CG'd the monsters for the new version. I really think that all new remasters should have the original version attatched. That way the new versions can be more appreciated or avoided altogether. That's why they wound up having to attatch the original ET with the enhanced version. Cause people didn't want the new version. Or they want to have the original version to accompany it.
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What do people feel about the "Wilhelm" scream? It's so iconic that it's used in a lot of different TV shows and movies now. It's not even an in-joke anymore. I kinda just roll my eyes now when I hear it.
I love the Wilhelm! For some reason, it always makes me laugh
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I dislike all of the SE changes EXCEPT the "opening up" of Cloud City. I always wondered in the original version what the heck Lando and Leia were looking at when there was a wall there, now they're on a terrace overlooking the city, but the lighting and everything looks wrong. It really looks faked in. Still, it's the one change I agree with.
I don't like seeing through "bat girl's" eyeballs in the cantina scene, otherwise, I love the original cantina scene. I don't like Obi-Wan's line when they discover the destroyed sandcrawler, saying that "only imperials are so accurate," yet none of them can hit a broadside of a barn when they chase after the heroes on the DS. Then in the PT's, the sandpeople are better shots than the Imps! LOL!! If Obi-Wan had just indicated they were Imperial weapons as opposed to the Sandpeople's slug-throwers, that'd make more sense to me.
I don't like Han's line of, "I've made the Kessel Run in less than twelve parsecs." Obviously, Lucas had no grasp on space jargon. If Han had said, "seconds" or "minutes" I'd be less iritated by the line.
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I dislike little in the OT, and I can handle Ewoks despite contreversy, but I felt that the brother-sister pairing of Luke and Leia was made up for Jedi, don't get me into any other details (especially that scene in Empire where Luke asks to be saved and Leia senses him)
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Originally posted by: Dug
I don't like seeing through "bat girl's" eyeballs in the cantina scene, otherwise, I love the original cantina scene. I don't like Obi-Wan's line when they discover the destroyed sandcrawler, saying that "only imperials are so accurate," yet none of them can hit a broadside of a barn when they chase after the heroes on the DS.
I don't like seeing through "bat girl's" eyeballs in the cantina scene, otherwise, I love the original cantina scene. I don't like Obi-Wan's line when they discover the destroyed sandcrawler, saying that "only imperials are so accurate," yet none of them can hit a broadside of a barn when they chase after the heroes on the DS.
They're not trying to hit them (with the possible exception of the prison block guards). They're trying to delay them, then herd them onto the Millennium Falcon so they can lead the DS to the rebel base. I'm surprised how many people don't pick up on that, even after Tarkin and Vader discuss the homing beacon, and Leia explicitly says, "They let us go."
Scruffy's gonna die the way he lived.
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Scruffy's gonna die the way he lived.
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BUT
ROTJ I can't. They should've been as deadly as they were in ESB. Them battling Ewoks and the Ewoks having one casualty (oh sure, I'm sure there were more offscreen), and the troops being taken down so easily. Just doesn't work as well for me as it did in ESB, or even ANH, where they were "holding back." Were the troopers "holding back" in ROTJ, too, to allow the characters to escape or win?
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Originally posted by: Dug
Were the troopers "holding back" in ROTJ, too, to allow the characters to escape or win?
Were the troopers "holding back" in ROTJ, too, to allow the characters to escape or win?
Of course! They're the heroes of the movie, after all.
Seriously, though, I never really thought about the "holding back" thing before. It's interesting, but ultimately, the main characters are usually gonna get away, sometimes completely unscathed. The bad guys very rarely get the good guys in cowboy movies and neither do they in Star Wars.
One example is in docking bay 94. It was 7 or 8 stormtroopers in an, albeit short, shootout versus Han Solo and he didn't even get a flesh wound? "Precise" shooting indeed.
The best scenario would have been for them to kill Solo, then rush in and grab R2, but they didn't manage to hit him once. - Time
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Not "possibly," "maybe." Definitely.
"They let us go. There's no other explanation for the ease of our escape."
Leia had just run a blockade and seen her ship boarded and her crew of trained soldiers massacred. She knew how stormtroopers operated, and knew when they were holding back. Luke was a farmboy who knew stormtroopers only from recruiting commercials. Han was a smuggler who dropped his spice consignments at the first sign of an Imperial cruiser. Neither of them had half the experience with Imperial squad-level tactics that Leia had.
Never mind the fact that putting out a kill order on the Falcon's crew after emplacing a homing beacon would be kind of thoughtless.
ROTJ
The scouts and stormtroopers seen in ROTJ were not crack troops. The Emperor's legion was stationed at the shield generator, where he planned to ambush the Rebels. He had not planned to ambush them at the back door to the power generator; the Rebels didn't even know about the back door until the Ewoks told them about it. The units stationed at the back door were obviously undermanned (perhaps they reinforced the legion at the shield generator). They were surprised when the Rebels showed up at the back door, and scraped together whatever units were nearby while the main force waited at the shield generator for the expected decisive attack.
a) The back door units have no AT-ATs; we saw at least one AT-AT at the shield generator earlier. The back door wasn't important enough to rate any heavy armor.
b) They have no guns. While the assault force in ESB carried at least one E-WEB with them, and the clones of their eponymous war had varying types of artillery, this group seems to have only carbines, pistols, and their vehicle-mounted weapons, none of which are very heavy. (Okay, the AT-ST has some firepower, but ISTR those were driven by soldiers, and we're talking stormtroopers.)
c) Their reinforcement force is reported to be only three squads. Typically, 1/4 to 1/3 of a defensive unit is held in reserve. If they could only muster three squads in reserve, they probably only had about a company on hand, maybe a CO(-) -- having detached their weapons platoon (or the Imperial equivalent) to the main force. And their three squads look more like three fire teams -- more evidence of undermanned units.
d) That reserve force was an admixture of stormtrooper and Naval personnel. (Saxton might've spotted an soldier in there, too, but I don't recall.) Even more evidence of a very hasty defense.
While the prowess of the defenders is often overestimate, the combat power of the attackers is usually underestimated.
a) There is a virtually unlimited number of Ewoks.
b) The Ewoks are familiar with the terrain, organized, motivated, and coordinate in their native tongue which the Imperials probably can't understand.
c) The Ewoks are either very stealthy or overlooked by the Imperials, which gave them the opportunity to seize the initiative and a time of their choosing.
d) The Ewoks had been able to emplace a number of anti-armor traps, probably under the guise of harmless forestry activity. (What we call "dual use" systems today.)
e) The Rebels brought a lot of skilled operators with them. In addition to General Solo and Chewbacca, a highly-ranked Clone Wars veteran, they brought General Madine and some number of commandos -- perhaps dozens, given the size of their shuttle. And of course their VIP, the inestimable Princess Leia. Man-for-man, the Rebels may have approached numerical parity with the Imperials in that battle. It would've been like sending Delta Force, Pershing, Puller, Ross Perot, and several hundred Sentinelese against a bunch of combat support reservists cowering in a bunker in enemy territory.
The footage we see in RotJ is carefully edited to avoid any "horrors of war" and focus on the efforts of our heroes, all while portraying the bloody chaos of battle as a carefully-scripted series of events. But looking at the bigger picture, including what was left unsaid in order to appeal to children and their overprotective parents, shows that the battle wasn't the farce its detractors usually claim it was. It was a completely different farce.
Scruffy's gonna die the way he lived.
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Originally posted by: Ripplin
One example is in docking bay 94. It was 7 or 8 stormtroopers in an, albeit short, shootout versus Han Solo and he didn't even get a flesh wound? "Precise" shooting indeed. The best scenario would have been for them to kill Solo, then rush in and grab R2, but they didn't manage to hit him once.
One example is in docking bay 94. It was 7 or 8 stormtroopers in an, albeit short, shootout versus Han Solo and he didn't even get a flesh wound? "Precise" shooting indeed.
The best scenario would have been for them to kill Solo, then rush in and grab R2, but they didn't manage to hit him once. They were performing a cordon and search. They were never supposed to take down the target, only to find them. Elite units are always preferred for the actual takedown (see Black Hawk Down, etc.). And that target was just a dirt-farming kid on a joyride with two droids until that guy with the snout told the Imps he'd hired a ship. Docking Bay 94 was a case of an officer or NCO getting time-sensitive intelligence and rushing a unit into a mission it wasn't trained for. Someone fired a weapon before getting a good sight picture, Han fired back, then you see the rest of the squad try to find cover and fire as they run -- scoring several near misses. Had the passengers, cargo, and copilot not already been aboard, the skirmish might've turned out differently.
Besides, Davin Felth intentionally screwed the whole thing up because they kicked him out of the Armor Corps.
Scruffy's gonna die the way he lived.
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There is no lingerie in space…
C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don’t exist… then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks… and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming… Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.
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Here's what I see... bumbling Ewoks falling down. Stormtroopers falling down from arrows that don't even scratch their armor. AAAH!!! We're attacked by teddy bears. Ugh. The topic of the thread is what scenes you don't like in the OT, and these are it. I don't need nor want explanations why they make sense.
The execution of ROTJ as a whole is weak. I can not believe these are the same troopers that stormed the Hoth base. They were scary and powerful there. They were scary and powerful in the raid on the Tantive. Now all of a sudden, they're a bunch of bumbling keystone cops in ROTJ. That is what I see. It could have been good with a better director, better script.
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"There's no cluster of midiclorians that controls my destiny!" -Han Solo, from a future revision of ANH