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The Thief and the Cobbler: Recobbled Director's Cut (Released) — Page 39

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Originally posted by: Cassius76
what the hell happend to OCP? What was this "odd" behaviour?

Garrett writes:

snipped


And he certainly won't use it to advertise his own forum. - Jay

I used to be very active on this forum. I’m not really anymore. Sometimes, people still want to get in touch with me about something, and that is great! If that describes you, please email me at [my username]ATgmailDOTcom.

Hi everybody. You’re all awesome. Keep up the good work.

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loooks like you'll have to PM me with the gossip, as it's being "snipped " here.... :-(


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Please email/PM me the new forum or something!
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ocpmovie is welcome to return once he's cooled off. Based on the e-mails received by Zion, Moth3r, and myself, he'll be chilling out for a while.
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MTFBWY…A

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http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1826221

It's public, but you'd have to join (obviously) to post.
"I was a perfect idiot to listen to you!"
"Listen here, there ain't nothing in this world that's perfect!"

- from The Bank Dick
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We're well aware of the thread, and his issues. Sorry that he had to spam your boards with it as well.

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
<span class=“Bold”>JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
<span class=“Bold”>Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.</span>

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Jay, I can understand why you'd forbid the posting of updates given OCP's stance towards the mods here. But this is the main thread for a project in it's home stretch. It's best for the people following it like myself to be able to continue doing so here. Especially given the inability for those without SA accounts to provide any imput. Not only that, but removing the updates definately does not move the healing process forward.

I too am shocked at OCP's behavior over the past few days, and approve of the decision for a temp ban. Though it saddens me whenever something has to come to that, given how lenient this board is. Especially given how much he had provided to the board in the form of his Classic Editions and specifically this project. He's developed a bit of a big head. Though it's a tad unsurprising given the sucess he's had so far with this. It'd stroke anyone's ego. Hopefully he will stop letting it get the better of him.

Somebody has to be the better man though. At least let the updates back. Just remove any snide remarks. Just my two cents.


Made for IE Forum's Episode III theme month - May 2005.

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The word on the street is that the Re-Cobbled edit is done. I had never had heard of this film, but the parts of this thread that discuss it have me curious. I can't wait to see it. Does he have disc and cover art available?
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When I receive a polite request from ocpmovie asking to return, he'll be allowed back with full posting privileges. I don't even expect an apology because I don't believe it would be sincere.

As long as I receive e-mail containing demands like...

"Leave me the fuck alone, restore my posting privileges, and fuck off."

...he'll remain banned.

It's a shame all this nonsense had to interrupt what is a very impressive project, but there's no way I'm going to spend the time and money it takes to keep this site running and then put up with his insane rants. Reading his comments at SA mentioning his situation in the same sentence as Miramax ruining good films and (get this) Nazis killing Jews, how can I take him seriously?

And no, I won't allow him to post updates via other members. That defeats the purpose of banning him, which is to cut off communication and remind him that he owes as much to this forum as this forum does to him. Respect goes both ways.

If he chooses to dig in his heels and finish up the project elsewhere, more power to him.
Forum Administrator

MTFBWY…A

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I agree that he has gone too far in that respect. I was merely more concerned with the likes of people like Sluggo above. I see your point however. I'm on several forums, Jay. You're easily one of the most fair and just admins out there. Looks like I'll have to put up with SA for a little while. Not like I was of much help with the project anyway. He missed (or ignored) the little poster I modded. I don't entirely agree with him on other animated films either. Bygones be bygones though.


Made for IE Forum's Episode III theme month - May 2005.

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seeing as I have no idea what has gone on here regarding OCP, thanks for the above post. It enlightens me a little....


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Well, I'm working out details for another GBStv broadcast. I really would like to find a way to simulcast it so that Mac users can watch. If anyone can offer advice, please do so!

Also, while I'm still waiting for logistics on how to do it, both Garrett and I are going to record a commentary for the film. I'm mainly going to contribute film history stuff (like how the film relates to silent comedy, stuff on the animators, references). He'll likely contribute stuff on the restoration, the film itself, etc. thanks to all the interviews and research on the fiilm.
"I was a perfect idiot to listen to you!"
"Listen here, there ain't nothing in this world that's perfect!"

- from The Bank Dick
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I come back to you now, at the turning of the tide.

A lot of unkind and untrue things have been said about me while I was away, and I have no comment on any of them as that will only provoke people further.

This is not the place for a discussion of such things. If you have something to say to me, you can say it to my face, or take it into the Star Wars forum. This thread is about The Thief and the Cobbler.



I've been providing regular updates at SomethingAwful in the thread there. For those who missed them, let me fill you in.


The DVD is now complete. You can write me at [address removed] for more information.



Let us go back in time now one week. Here are the updates from the Somethingawful thread, in chronological order.



MAY 8, 2006:
The edit is complete now as far as I know. I don't rule out that I might find some small things in it to fix yet, but I'm currently calling it done. I'm rendering out the last few shots of part 2 now ... for some reason it says it's going to take 6 hours even though it's just a few shots. Not sure why.


... Make that 7 hours. And it's been rendering for an hour now. Oh well.


I have to create the animated menus now, which will all be very Thief in style. You'll see. Creating menus is always annoying because you're creating them before the structure of the DVD is really set, and they often have to be changed later once you decide, oh, we don't really need that feature or that, and the chapter listing is different etc.


The Kenneth Williams website has sent me the full audio of Richard Williams' abandoned 1963 animated film "Diary of a Madman" starring Kenneth Williams. A very ambitious almost feature-length project which Williams never animated, it was aired more recently as a BBC radio play.

I haven't actually listened to it apart from a few seconds ... I can't take THAT much of Kenneth Williams being fey.

WHAT I DID YESTERDAY


At the last minute, I had to make some music changes as well as redo entirely any sequence I had taken from the Princess and the Cobbler credits (Thief up a tree, Thief still has his hands, Thief in airplane). I must say they look good now, but it was a lot of work and a lot of rendering. I had to redraw a lot of mattes and generally spend more time on this than I should have.

At the last minute, I also went and replaced every shot in the first part of the film with a version reedited to remove color artifacts ... as I had done with the second half of the film a long time ago. Basically I had two files of every chapter of the film from the Japanese DVD ... one had nice clean color but problems with interlacing which showed up every four frames, and the other had no interlacing problems but had some blocky color artifacts with very saturated colors (especially red).

In both parts, I went in and cut out every fourth frame of the first version, and replaced them with frames from the second version. The result is a version which looks good, has no color artifacts and if there's any blockiness it only shows up every four frames, and is thus almost invisible.

I did this for the entire movie, which was a lot of copying and pasting. It's hard to explain but it does look good.


I've redone all the end credits for the film. I have a much longer list of people to thank now, and sorry to anyone I've forgotten. Anyone from the original crew (or who knew Richard) is listed as just their initials, which I thought was best to avoid naming anyone who didn't want to be named! The film is now dedicated to Richard at the end.

Credits now roll over music by Ralph Vaughan Williams and Nikolai Rimsky-Korsakov rather than Robert Folk. You'll be hearing a lot more from those composers in this edit. Folk's music is still used where I was using material from Princess, or just liked a Folk track better than any other ideas I had.

The last edits I did were adding Korsakov music to the Thief in the war machine, and using a CD quality version of Scheherezade for most of the Thief going after the balls on the minaret.


Now it's on to rendering the whole thing out as a DVD. That'll take some time ....





ADDENDUM: Added back more of the Tack/Zigzag fight. It was too confusing the way I'd cut it down. I think what people are objecting to most is Tack punching and kicking Zigzag, so I just cut it so that Zigzag is attacking Tack, and Tack ties him up. Violence done to an innocent, which is punished ... always works psychologically. Anyway, it's very short now but makes sense.

I played with where One Eye's death should fall in the film, and I'd originally put it very early, but I know that that deflates what tension there's supposed to be. I wanted it to break up a very long Thief sequence, so what I did was actually break up the long Thief sequence further - I stop the long Thief sequence in the middle, kill One Eye, then return to it. So it's literally breaking up the Thief sequence!

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May 9, 2006:

If this is going to be a contender for the best fan DVD out there, I might as well pack it with special features.

Features:
- A Conversation with Roy Naisbitt
- A Conversation with Alex Williams
- Image Gallery
- Recobbled Cut Trailer
- Arabian Knight Trailer
- Restoration commentary by Garrett Gilchrist and probably Patrick McCart
"Deleted Characters" section featuring:
- Enchanted Prince Bubba: Witch sequence
- Princess Meemee - Bath sequence
- Mullah Nasruddin: Bread sequence
- Animated menus featuring pencil tests from the original film


Yes, the main menu is done entirely as pencil tests. I had considered doing what I did with the rough cut, which was to make the menu a trailer for the film, but I thought that it was more interesting to give people a different view of the film.

Chapters menu features the Thief flying over it.
Special Features menu features the Thief and some bubbles.
Deleted Characters menu features The Thief and a sleeping Tack.


The "Deleted Characters" short segments will feature new narration and footage that you haven't heard/seen - promise. I was hoping that I'd have the entire Nasruddin bread sequence (which is supposed to be in One Pair of Eyes) by now, but ***** isn't returning my messages at the moment. So I have to improvise with the segment of it that's in The Creative Person. Oh well.


Definitive tracklisting for the curious. Based it on the Youtube chapters.

1: An Outward and Visible Dream
2: Zigzag, Yumyum and King Nod
3: Getting to Know You
4. Bath and Staircase Chase
5. Polo Game
6: One Eye, Phido and a White Fur Rug
7: A Nightmare! A Vision of Invasion!
8: Thief Gets The Balls
9: The Balls are Gone!
10: Speech and Hand Chop
11: Proposal/A Quest/The Brigands
12: Brigands Attack/Zigzag and One Eye
13: Climbing the Desert Mountain
14: Mad and Holy Old Witch
15: March of the One Eyes
16: The Thief in the War Machine
17: Happy Ending 18: Credits



Possibilities to show for the second Williams evening.

- Recobbled Cut
- A Christmas Carol
- Charge of the Light Brigade
- Raggedy Ann: No Girl's Toy
- The Creative Person
- Liquidator Titles
- Pink Panther titles
- Raggedy Ann: Blue
- Commercial reel plus Globetrotter and Pink Panther ads
- Animating Art
- RW and the Thief Who Never Gave Up
- "Deleted Characters" from Recobbled disc
- Clapperboard 1+2 maybe
- I Drew Roger Rabbit
- Arabian Knight trailer
- Recobbled trailer
- Princess & the Cobbler songs: "She is More," "Am I Feeling Love?", "Beem Bom," "It's So Amazing"
- Roger Rabbit trailer
- Behind the Ears?
- Raggedy Ann: "Sweet Heart"
- Raggedy Ann: Windsor McCay staircase
- "Funny Thing Happened on the Way to the Forum" titles?

What I WANT to include but can't right now, but maybe by the time this airs some of it will have come in:
- Roger Rabbit and the Secrets of Toon Town
- One Pair of Eyes clip
- Warner Bros. Trailer
- The REAL Dick Williams commercials reel

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May 9, 2006

How great is this DVD looking, eh?

http://orangecow.org/thief/dvdmainmenu1.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/dvdmainmenu2.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/dvdmainmenu3.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/dvdchapters.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/dvdspecial.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/dvddeleted.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/bubbadvd1.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/bubbadvd2.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/meemeedvd1.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/meemeedvd2.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/nasrudvd1.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/nasrudvd2.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/nasrudvd3.jpg
http://orangecow.org/thief/nasrudvd4.jpg

I'm working on comprehensive image galleries - huge ones. HUGE ones. I'm essentially done. [address removed] for info on getting a copy. Tell yer friends.
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May 11, 2006:

Out of respect for Alex Williams and his father, I've now withdrawn the Alex Williams interview from this disc. You never know with these things what's right to include.


It will be replaced by a special fan's commentary about the restoration by Patrick McCart and myself ... which is less interesting but more appropriate for a fan disc!


First few discs have been sent out. I haven't sent them to the team who helped out on this project yet, as I'd like them to get the version with the new commentary when we record that ... and I might even make a few tiny changes yet, that no one but me would notice. =D


I am making a dual layer version of this disc available also, since it came out at about 6 gigs. The single layer version as usual looks great and makes a dual layer version unnecessary.


Two new discs have been added to the set, with more coming ...


1) "Fake widescreen" Raggedy Ann & Andy by Chris Boniface. Someone pointed out that the pan & scan VHS of Raggedy Ann & Andy was actually vertically stretched a bit, and could be stretched out into a widescreen image to look less cramped. It's still a pan & scan transfer of a cinemascope film, but is now 24p and in a widescreen frame, which works pretty well.

2) Roger Rabbit and the Secrets of Toontown, by Dave West ... has a 1988 documentary and 5 TV spots. Let me watch this one now!




Watched "Roger Rabbit and the Secrets of Toontown" ... a great disc by Dave West. The TV spots are all interesting - one of them has a shot from the "pig head" sequence, and is probably identical to the theatrical trailer, which I still haven't seen.

There is a Diet Coke ad and a McDonald's Ad which both have original animation in them. The Diet Coke ad is as great as it is embarrassing. There's reused AND new footage in it ... Bob Hoskins walks into the Ink and Paint Club to see Jessica performing (old footage of Jessica and Bob) - old Jessica footage now has her singing about Diet Coke! I'm not sure if it's Amy Irving. Bob sits down and sees Roger hiding in a live-action coat, drinking a live-action Diet Coke. New footage of both Bob Hoskins and Roger, with Charles Fleischer's voice. Roger appears to be animated by Dick Williams' studio, maybe even with roughs by Dick himself, it looks exactly like the film version and is entirely up to standard. He looks directly into the camera while saying he's enjoying his Diet Coke. Dear God.

The McDonalds ad advertises Roger Rabbit cups. Roger and Jessica (new animation) are seen pulling up to the drive-in. Hard to tell if it's up to film standards, but it's certainly close.

The main special: "Roger Rabbit and the Secrets of Toontown" ... an hour long (45 minutes sans commercials), originally aired on CBS in 1988, with the classic CBS "Special" logo on it. Obviously produced by Disney, it even has Dick Van Dyke in it. Joanna Cassidy hosts, which is nice. They clearly thought, who's got the biggest part in this film that we can get because they don't have anything better to do? There is a scene in a theater where she "interacts" with old footage of Roger from Eddie's theater scene. No new animation was created, but Charles Fleischer recorded new voicework. The animation appears here without tones or shading, as just flat animation. Robert Zemeckis is interviewed most, but Dick appears several times. Footage is similar to "I Drew Roger Rabbit" at times - they were pulling from the same material, or from this special. Interviews with Bob Hoskins, Charles Fleischer, Lou Hirsch, Mel Blanc (advertising his son's voicework for some reason), Chuck Jones (!), Ward Kimball, Mae Questel, Robert Watts (giving me Return of the Ewok flashbacks), a still-pretty Kathleen Turner, and Gene Kelly and Dick Van Dyke for some reason or another ... Friz Freleng was in the credits but I honestly don't remember seeing him.

Hoskins is funny throughout. At one point talking about all the stuntwork and physical punishment, Bob Hoskins says he wanted to kill Zemeckis but couldn't find any arsenic.


It ends with a "Read More About It."


Quality is good, from an old VHS.



EDIT: Oh, some guy named Spielberg is in it too. I didn't mention him because I figured you wouldn't know who he is.



Things that occurred to me about Roger Rabbit while watching this ...


The look of Toon Town, the opening "Smile, darn ya, smile," is slightly reminiscent of Raggedy Ann & Andy, with patchwork quilting everywhere. In both films this is used to slightly induce vomiting.

The design of Daffy Duck, Tweety and Bugs (in the air) is very "1940s" in this film, they're not the more familiar 1950s versions of the characters. Daffy is more of a Bob Clampett type with very strange hair (Williams' love of animating the more nonsensical details).

However, at the end of the film, when the characters gather together, there is much more of a 1950s feel and you can clearly see a Chuck Jones version of Bugs Bunny with the Roadrunner and Wile E. Coyote ... (I always thought the inclusion from the back of the Paramount/Harvey comics Jack in the Box was a nice one too) ...



In unrelated news, David also sent me the Criterion Fisher King LD material. Baron Munchausen coming next.





EDIT EDIT:


I've also removed the Roy Naisbitt interview from the disc. Still going to be a lot on there!




Oh, for you Roger Rabbit fans, our rabbitmaster Dave West has been working on a second disc of Roger material ...

1. Siskel & Ebert Review
2. At The Movies Review
3. Entertainment Tonight Clips
4. MTV clips
5. Crook & Chase Clips & Review
6. Evening Magazine Clips ( Local Program from Philladelphia)
7. Who Framed Roger Rabbit CBS TV Version (Originally aired as part of The Wonderful World of Disney. With intro by Michael Eisner & Live Action Roger Rabbit. Contains some of the Deleted Pig Mask Footage)


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Aren't the DVD's for Princess and Arabian Knight single-layer anyways? If so, your edit doesn't really matter if it's dual or not. Especially since both sources are borderline out of focus.
"I was a perfect idiot to listen to you!"
"Listen here, there ain't nothing in this world that's perfect!"

- from The Bank Dick
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>> Aren't the DVD's for Princess and Arabian Knight single-layer anyways? If so, your edit doesn't really matter if it's dual or not.

I'm not using the video directly from Arabian Knight - it was converted to PhotoJPEG 24p and remastered slightly, so whatever bitrate it had on that DVD doesn't matter as it's being recompressed. My cut is also a lot longer than Arabian Knight. I also added a few special features, so it came out at 6 gigs.



Anyway. Yeah, the single layer version still looks fine. This was also true of my Return of the Jedi edit, where it was designed to work on a single layer disc, and looked great, but despite my saying over and over that the single layer version was equal in quality, people wanted a dual layer version anway. So that's what I've done here too.


The versions I'm actually giving to the animators are single layer, so yes, I consider the single layer version the true version, it's fine that way.
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Ogg sent me a whoooooole bunch of stuff! Yay! Thanks Ogg!


He also spotted an error on my disc, which stinks because I've already mailed out a bunch of copies and burned a big stack of 'em. Blah. When Yumyum says "Is that your name?" there's some weird flashframes really quick. Oh well. Fixing now.


Ogg sent me the pan & scan disc of Roger Rabbit Special Edition, which has even more special features ... like a pretty bad quality pan & scan copy of the trailer as an easter egg, an annoying making of documentary with Charles Fleischer (which reuses Roger footage in the exact same way as the Joanna Cassidy documentary decades ago) ...


I'm now watching Tummy Trouble for the first time in decades, and jesus it's weird watching a Roger Rabbit drawn by anyone other than Richard Williams. Well, in the old days of cartoons you'd have different directors and different styles and different animators ...

It's just weird that for these, there's no hint of Dick's style, but in a DIET COKE COMMERCIAL you get the real thing.

Well, it's always the real thing, Coca-Cola.


Dick's voice is in it though, which is equally weird. =)
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First of all, thanks for this awesome restoration. I've been lurking here for a long time, I've decided to register because I'm working on a fan edit too, but anyway... Any chance to see the Recobbled Cut on Myspleen? I live in Europe so the shipping rates would be too high to order it from you or to trade it with somebody else, and I'm sure other people have this problem too.
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I'm shipping a lot of discs to Europe, hasn't stopped a lot of people!

> Any chance to see the Recobbled Cut on Myspleen?


I'm almost certain you'll see it there eventually. And in the newsgroups also.
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Recorded commentary with Patrick (Ogg) today ... well, it counts as yesterday now.

Made some final tweaks to the edit. Seems to be DONE done now. I will likely be deleting the files off my hard drive soon, though not before saving the edit in PhotoJPEG format to some data DVDs.
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Originally posted by: ocpmovie...though not before saving the edit in PhotoJPEG format to some data DVDs.


You learned that the hard way, didn't you? You would delete it, and next thing you know, a few reels of 16mm film would show up in your mailbox...