Before we go on, let me once again remind anyone I am not personally atacking ANYONE here. We're still friends no matter what is said, and if I offend anyone, I apologise, as it is not my intention. Sometimes the debate gets heated and it is easy to mix up things. So, please... let's not let this get personal right?
Originally posted by: Warbler
Your right, lets just kill ourselves now and get it over with. We're doomed anyway right?
Originally posted by: ricarleite
If there was 1 Hitler and 4 billion Ghandis, he wouldn't be able to do much.
Yes he would. The Ghandis would peacefully protest Hitler and Hitler would kill them one by one.
This is a ridiculous and silly example. Why would Hitler kill 4 billion Gandhis? How would he kill the 4 billion Gandhis, kung fu?? And why?? Why would Hitler go postal and kill everyone, if he had no one to support him?! He would have no army! Nothing to conquer! Just peaceful people to kill, and he would have their corpse and nothing more! See?
Was that a question? I don't know which one is worth. Depends on how you see things being worse. You could count the weekly average body count of innocent civillians and see which one is higher. I have no idea right now, but I could look for the numbers and see.
Originally posted by: Warbler
Originally posted by: ricarleite
If the world is beyond any redemption and peace is an uthopic lie, why bring more pain and hatred into this doomned world anyway?
If there was 1 Hitler and 4 billion Ghandis, he wouldn't be able to do much.
Yes he would. The Ghandis would peacefully protest Hitler and Hitler would kill them one by one.
This is a ridiculous and silly example. Why would Hitler kill 4 billion Gandhis? How would he kill the 4 billion Gandhis, kung fu?? And why?? Why would Hitler go postal and kill everyone, if he had no one to support him?! He would have no army! Nothing to conquer! Just peaceful people to kill, and he would have their corpse and nothing more! See?
Originally posted by: Warbler
I was hoping it wasn't going to end in civil war. I was hoping the people of Iraq end up and at peace, and that they would have a democratic government.
Is Civil war really worse than the torture Sadam was putting his country through.
Originally posted by: ricarleite
To avoid violence? Yes, I am willing to give up a lot of things. If giving up my life, rights, way of life, religious beliefs and freedom IS going to help in achieving a non-violent future for our world, I would give up those things right now.
Well, we are never going to agree on this because I have been brough up to believe it just to fight for our rights, life, and liberty. Sure, you could give up your freedom, way of life, your rights and live at peace. But what kind of life will you have? You'll be a slave. Will you have any joy in your life? Any happiness? Is peace really worth that?
Yes it is. Besides, it would not be for myself, but for the future generations. As I've said, if it was to secure a safe and peaceful future for the rest of mankind and the following generations, yes I would give up my life. Wouldn't you? No? Hmn so why are soldiers dying anyway? Isn't that the porpouse of why THEY die? Only problem with their deaths is, violence will continue. No peace. Oh well.
Originally posted by: Warbler
Originally posted by: ricarleite
A crude, ridiculous example: if invading Iraq brings the country into a civil war that kills many civillians and soldiers, and not invading it will mantain Saddam as to perform tortures, and violence will remain on the world, why bother in the first place? Why invade Iraq? .
To avoid violence? Yes, I am willing to give up a lot of things. If giving up my life, rights, way of life, religious beliefs and freedom IS going to help in achieving a non-violent future for our world, I would give up those things right now.
Well, we are never going to agree on this because I have been brough up to believe it just to fight for our rights, life, and liberty. Sure, you could give up your freedom, way of life, your rights and live at peace. But what kind of life will you have? You'll be a slave. Will you have any joy in your life? Any happiness? Is peace really worth that?
Yes it is. Besides, it would not be for myself, but for the future generations. As I've said, if it was to secure a safe and peaceful future for the rest of mankind and the following generations, yes I would give up my life. Wouldn't you? No? Hmn so why are soldiers dying anyway? Isn't that the porpouse of why THEY die? Only problem with their deaths is, violence will continue. No peace. Oh well.
Originally posted by: Warbler
Originally posted by: ricarleite
A crude, ridiculous example: if invading Iraq brings the country into a civil war that kills many civillians and soldiers, and not invading it will mantain Saddam as to perform tortures, and violence will remain on the world, why bother in the first place? Why invade Iraq? .
I was hoping it wasn't going to end in civil war. I was hoping the people of Iraq end up and at peace, and that they would have a democratic government.
Is Civil war really worse than the torture Sadam was putting his country through.
Was that a question? I don't know which one is worth. Depends on how you see things being worse. You could count the weekly average body count of innocent civillians and see which one is higher. I have no idea right now, but I could look for the numbers and see.
Originally posted by: Warbler
Originally posted by: ricarleite
If the world is beyond any redemption and peace is an uthopic lie, why bring more pain and hatred into this doomned world anyway?
Your right, lets just kill ourselves now and get it over with. We're doomed anyway right?
Well, I've been saying that peace is achieavable and all we gotta do is stop resorting to violence, and those who oppose my point of view said it is not. So, if that point of view is correct, than yes, there is no point of having the human kind on this planet and we should all die. That might sound a bit drastic, but, makes sense to me.