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The Phantom Menace - Streamlined (v2 finished and released) — Page 8

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Phase3 said:

just commenting that I have used it for years and never saw an After Effects rendering or processes issue from the Saber plugin… I don’t use the plugin in premier though only AE…maybe premier is the issue? I have seen many plugins that are suppose to work the same in both premier and AE and premier always seems buggy where the same just works perfect in AE…

snds like from your last post you fixed something with it?.. Weird that it was an issue only on tatooine scenes? I do know many of the plugin hate to be stacked so often I will color correct and then add the sabre or other FX…happens more with premier but AE sometimes

Anyway all best as you keep working on it.

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An update:

Earlier in this thread, Dazman mentioned a continuity error which is easily missed:

On Naboo, when Obi-Wan is hanging from the ledge, his position in one shot doesn’t match the shots either before or after the scene of him hanging.

​I’ve adjusted his position, and also slightly changed the scale of his body, as he’s now further away from the camera.

Note: this doesn’t have the final colour grade.

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One more new correction:
There is a compositing error, where the blue screen is visible in-between Obi-Wan’s legs. I have corrected this error:

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I’ll be very happy to watch your edit once it’s ready. 😀😀😀

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Phase3 said:

An update:

Earlier in this thread, Dazman mentioned a continuity error which is easily missed:

On Naboo, when Obi-Wan is hanging from the ledge, his position in one shot doesn’t match the shots either before or after the scene of him hanging.

​I’ve adjusted his position, and also slightly changed the scale of his body, as he’s now further away from the camera.

Looking good, ace!

Phase3 said:

One more new correction:
There is a compositing error, where the blue screen is visible in-between Obi-Wan’s legs. I have corrected this error:

Are you spotting these while doing your colour correction passes? Don’t remember anyone catching these errors before…

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Dazman said:

Looking good, ace!

Cheers mate, much appreciated!

Are you spotting these while doing your colour correction passes? Don’t remember anyone catching these errors before…

That’s right; some of the errors I find whilst doing the colour correction, and others I find when I’m applying VFX changes.

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It has been a while since the last update! I’m in the final stages of adjusting some VFX shots, and will hopefully soon render a final version.
I’ve found another compositing error in the original film, where some VFX appears to slice through the actor’s neck. This happens in the VFX software when the layer with the VFX is placed above the footage of the actors, instead of the other way around.
I checked the scenes after this shot, and the actor’s neck & clothing are present.

I’ve adjust the shot (note: no colour correction or other VFX added to this sample shot; the brightness levels were boosted in the first image, to make the error more visible).

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Good eye. There are two more composition errors I found while editing another TPM edit for myself. Right before Qui-Gon enters Watto’s shop after the dinner, a landspeeder flies over a man’s shoulder.

And I found a clipping error at the beginning of the movie with a Battle Droid’s fingers (you’ll notice it better in motion).

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Well done spotting those two errors! A lot of these mistakes go by so quickly, that they can be hard to spot.

The Battle Droid fingers error seems to be another opacity issue; this happens a few times throughout the film, where the opacity levels on one VFX layer weren’t set to 100%, so the layer either above or below shows through.
Other ways this happens is when VFX elements aren’t keyed-out correctly, or when the animation hasn’t been finished / finished correctly.

With the Landspeeder shot, in the VFX software, the layer with the vehicle should have been placed below the actor crouching in the midground, not the other way around!

There are also shots in the film which are played in reverse, as well as several duplicate shots. Unfortunately there are a huge amount of compositing errors, missing or incomplete VFX, as well as continuity errors.

Roobyoo said:

Good eye. There are two more composition errors I found while editing another TPM edit for myself. Right before Qui-Gon enters Watto’s shop after the dinner, a landspeeder flies over a man’s shoulder.

And I found a clipping error at the beginning of the movie with a Battle Droid’s fingers (you’ll notice it better in motion).

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Yes, the reversed shots are always weird, in a lot of movies. They seem so unnatural that they take me out everytime I spot them. The most annoying one to me in TPM is the Anakin one in the last shot at the dinner when he turns to Qui-Gon after Shmi says “He is meant to help you”.

My even bigger flaws are spotting reshots. In TPM they are most noticable with Ewan McGregor’s fluffy hair, lol. (for example on the Trade Federation ship when he says “They’ve shield generators”, or during the dialogue with Qui-Gon on Naboo after they returned from Coruscant).

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Roobyoo said:

Yes, the reversed shots are always weird, in a lot of movies. They seem so unnatural that they take me out everytime I spot them. The most annoying one to me in TPM is the Anakin one in the last shot at the dinner when he turns to Qui-Gon after Shmi says “He is meant to help you”.

My even bigger flaws are spotting reshots. In TPM they are most noticable with Ewan McGregor’s fluffy hair, lol. (for example on the Trade Federation ship when he says “They’ve shield generators”, or during the dialogue with Qui-Gon on Naboo after they returned from Coruscant).

I agree - seeing those types of shots breaks the suspension of belief when watching a film!

I took a closer look at the Battle Droid shot; it seems to be yet another example of the VFX layers not being applied properly. The VFX layer with the hand was likely beneath the layer with the blaster, instead of the other way around, resulting in the hand passing through the blaster instead of actually holding it.

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This what I hope will be the last update prior to the final version being exported; I am currently rendering a workprint to check the overall quality. If all goes well (nothing to fix), I will then export a final version.

During the duel on Naboo between Maul and Qui-Gon, there is a shot where both of them stop duelling and just look at each other. At first I thought it was yet another time wasting shot to slow the film’s pace, however after removing that shot, I found that the background footage is possibly from a different take, as the geometry, lighting and camera angles don’t quite match. This insert shot was likely put in to smooth over the difference between the different takes.

Thanks to Roobyoo for pointing out these two compositing errors; I have fixed the following two sections:

The Landspeeder no longer goes through the guy’s shoulder and head:

The Battle Droid’s hand no longer goes through the blaster, plus I’ve added in the missing finger and bottom part of the hand:

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Those Tatooine comp errors reminded me of one shot that I noticed some time back. It’s when Anakin hands Qui-Gon some fruit at the Mos Espa market. There is a weird halo and a sharp edge on the border of Qui-Gon’s arm. It’s more noticeable in the movement. At least some softening of the edge might be in order.

qui-gon-s-weird-arm.jpg

Pointing it out just in case.👍🏼

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Dazman said:

Those Tatooine comp errors reminded me of one shot that I noticed some time back. It’s when Anakin hands Qui-Gon some fruit at the Mos Espa market. There is a weird halo and a sharp edge on the border of Qui-Gon’s arm. It’s more noticeable in the movement. At least some softening of the edge might be in order.

Pointing it out just in case.👍🏼

Thanks for pointing it out!

I took a look at the 2011 and 2019 Blu-ray versions, both in-motion and frame-by-frame, and could see the sharp edges, but didn’t see any haloing effect.
The sharp edges are likely due to the rotoscoping not being overly well-defined; I’ll take a look at fixing parts of the missing fingers that were lost during rotoscoping, so that they actually look like fingers and not sharp sticks! The sharp edges of his clothing can be easily softened too.

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A quick update:

Dazman said:

There is a weird halo and a sharp edge on the border of Qui-Gon’s arm. It’s more noticeable in the movement. At least some softening of the edge might be in order.

After zooming-in, I now see the haloing you’re referring to. I’ll remove the worst of it, plus add in Qui-Gon’s missing fingers (presumably chopped off by poorly done rotoscoping).

This will be the last change that I’ll make to the edit. I had exported a workprint recently, and found a few small things to correct, plus some shots I wanted to remove.

Removed shots:
After Qui-Gon is killed, and falls to the floor, there is a shot of Obi-Wan, then another shot of Qui-Gon on the floor, in a different position to where he fell, then another shot of Obi-Wan. I’ve cut out the extra shot of Obi-Wan, and different shot of Qui-Gon on the floor.

I initially added in the deleted scene of the N-1 Naboo Starfighter being blasted and spinning out of control, however upon watching the finished edit, I can see why it was removed from the original film. It’s a bit of a slow scene, plus it doesn’t really fit in with the rest of the space battle. I moved it around to different sections on the timeline, and it simply didn’t work very well, so it has now been removed.

The last shot I’ve removed is the deleted scene showing the wide shot of the Jedi & Sith duel on Naboo, on the walkways; unfortunately, even after upscaling, the shot still looked a bit too low quality to use, with the three characters looking like tiny blobs!

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The first post of this thread has been updated with a revised list of changes.

For anyone interested in watching this edit, here is how to get access to it:
Click on my user name, which brings up my profile. In there, you will see a link to a Pastebin document, which contains details on how to get links to the edit.

Please don’t send me a private message, as I won’t be sending out links that way. Also, there is no need to write in this thread that you would like a link (“link begging” will be ignored).

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This is actually quite fascinating to watch, you can almost see why they went in the direction they did, with the goofy moments, the silly noises, the ill fitting music. This movie suffers from the pit falls most sci-fi movies fall into, great ideas, bland execution; a great story told in an uninteresting way.

The original Star Wars movie almost certainly would have suffered the same fate, were it not for the ideas of other talented people working on it, the script doctoring, the concept art, the special effects, the edits, the score. Without any of that, the Star Wars we know would not have existed, it would have been lost in the landfill of time where so many other lower quality movies (sci-fi especially) have been relegated; it would get a brief notice on shows like Mystery Science Theatre and Best of the Worst on Red Letter Media and almost immediately be forgotten about again.

Let me be clear, this is not your fault, you can’t frame the shots in a more interesting way, you can’t change the pacing of the story (anymore than you already have), you can’t allow a scene to breathe, you can’t better establish the stakes (anymore than you already have), you can’t make the actors say more interesting dialogue that better establishes who they are to each other or what their place is in the story.

What you have done is provide a far more, much needed, serious tone to the movie, that has disorientated me and left me wishing, “My god! Won’t someone please lighten the mood around here?” “Where.Are.The.Scat.Jokes???”

This became most apparrent to me whenever Qui-Gon and Obi Wan were just hanging around inside the naboo ship just talking about space things and tinkering with the ships mechanisms, I realised, damn I’ve seen this movie before, like a thousand times in every other sci-fi film attempt. I honestly think this movie needed that for me, a moment of realisation that this is just another messy sci-fi story, like any other, it wasn’t constantly trying to key-jingle at me with ‘flashy’ CGI or references. In this instance me being bored but engaged, as opposed to rolling my eyes and losing focus like I so often do with the prequels is honestly a great improvement for this film.

This probably sounds like a bad review but it’s really not, bland and serious is a definite improvement for this film that I didn’t think was possible.

This is still easily the best version of this movie. The star wars fan edit obsession with making the runtime still be at least 2 hours long is a baffling one to me and I deeply respect that you didn’t do that here. Streamlined is a very appropriate name for your edit and the story definitely benefits from it.

I do however have some nitpicks:

  • The beginning of the title crawl reads: “Fora” when it should read: “For a”
  • I actually do think you missed a trick by not including the underwater city scenes, this establishes some great world building that you could greatly improve upon, it adds some flavour and intrigue to the geo-politics of the story. It better establishes what Jar Jar is and what he could contribute to the story, it better expands upon the journey the Jedi had to take to reach the palace and it also better establishes them as problem solvers, negotiators, and peace keepers, and seeing them leave in the submersible could nicely tie into the shot of them showing up at the palace. The gungans coming out of nowhere at the end is a bit weak and feels more like a deus ex machina, Jar Jar speaks to Padme about Gungan warriors being strong and fighting to the death, but we have no frame of reference here.
  • The line of dialogue “There will be no more commands from Her Highness today” really should be there, not only does it lend a much needed sense of personality to Qui-Gon, (he’s not just a loyal knight following orders, he’s got attitude and ideas about how things should be done) it’s the leading line of dialogue that follows the rest of that sequence, that he knows who the real identity of the Queen is. The line, “The Queen trusts my judgement handmaiden, you should too” is not present here either and would make for a nice trifecta in which Qui Gon is being quite cheeky about it now, it also helps us to understand what kind of person Padme is.
  • I feel the same can be said of Obi Wan’s “pathetic life forms” comment, it creates friction between him and Qui Gon, who then goes on to say to the council that “He is head strong and he has much to learn of the living force, but he is capable”. I noticed you left in the scene where Obi Wan clearly doesn’t like that Anakin shook his hand and Qui Gon laughs at him, or the scene where Obi Wan says “What’s this?” when he sees Jar Jar. I’ve always seen Kenobi as a privileged rich kid who thinks he is better than everyone else, contributing to his failure as a mentor to Anakin, I think this line is far more important than you think it is. I really don’t think you should be so absolute on moments of light and levity, especially when it contributes to a characters personality traits or how they grow and change over the course of the trilogy (limited though it may be, there is no need to limit it further).
  • The Gungans (including Jar Jar) either need to be better mixed into the audio or need to be re-recorded or both, their voices distractingly stand out whenever they talk, and do not feel like they are a part of the environment. The Naemoidians however, sounded fantastic and I really enjoyed their new dialogue, I loved the moment where they become noticeably nervous whenever Palpatine shows up or when Maul is mentioned but not in a way that they make it too obvious.
  • The scene where Sebulba is attacking Jar Jar has some shots in it that look a little too tinted green, I don’t know if this was the best result possible but it was a little distracting.
  • Would it be possible to delay Anakin’s “What is it?” by a second or two after Qui Gon destroys the probe droid? As it is, it’s way too immediate. I feel as though he would need to take in the scene before saying anything, there is plenty of time in between Qui Gon destroying it and saying “a probe droid”. This one is SUPER nit-picky I know, but the scene would benefit from it, as it is, it’s far too immediate.
  • Inconsistent audio levels all throughout the movie, some scenes are louder than others, some better audio balancing would be much appreciated. Not really an issue with headphones, but with speakers it’s really noticeable.
  • I respect your choice in ending and even agree with it, though perhaps some sinister music playing over Yoda and Mace’s conversation is needed that swells upon a slightly longer hold on Qui Gon’s funeral pyre (if possible) before closing with a wipe and music change would work better. As is, it feels a bit lack luster and abrupt, almost comical, almost.

SUPER, SUPER nitpicks that probably don’t need changing:

  • At around 1:05:46, someone’s foot step sounds like an audio pop for the beginning of the much louder transitional music, it may be best to remove that one footstep sound.
  • At around 54:57, when the screen wipe for the establishing shot of the Jedi temple completes, the colours seem to change ever so slightly, I don’t know if this is the case for the original version as well, may want to adjust that, may not, it is a super minor thing after all.

Great work Phase3, can’t wait to see what you do with 2 and 3.

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Scratctong said:

This is still easily the best version of this movie. The star wars fan edit obsession with making the runtime still be at least 2 hours long is a baffling one to me and I deeply respect that you didn’t do that here. Streamlined is a very appropriate name for your edit and the story definitely benefits from it.

I’m glad that you enjoyed it, and thanks for your detailed analysis!

I will save what you wrote in a document, and if I ever get around to making a version 3 of the edit, I will look at the things you mentioned.

I do however have some nitpicks:

  • The beginning of the title crawl reads: “Fora” when it should read: “For a”

Actually, it does say “For a”, it’s simply that the software squashed the words slightly on that first sentence.

  • The line of dialogue “There will be no more commands from Her Highness today” really should be there,

What commands had the Queen given up to that point? I don’t recall her actually giving any commands at all, aside from the decoy Queen asking for Artoo to be cleaned!

  • The Gungans (including Jar Jar) either need to be better mixed into the audio or need to be re-recorded or both, their voices distractingly stand out whenever they talk, and do not feel like they are a part of the environment.

That audio was done four years ago, on a different, low-end computer, and without the use of an external microphone. I would love to re-record the Gungan dialogue, but would really need a proper microphone setup first.

The Naemoidians however, sounded fantastic and I really enjoyed their new dialogue

Thanks!

  • Inconsistent audio levels all throughout the movie, some scenes are louder than others, some better audio balancing would be much appreciated. Not really an issue with headphones, but with speakers it’s really noticeable.

That’s an issue with the original Blu-ray – the audio levels are inconsistent throughout the film – I’ll leave that for the Disney company to fix.

  • At around 54:57, when the screen wipe for the establishing shot of the Jedi temple completes, the colours seem to change ever so slightly, I don’t know if this is the case for the original version as well, may want to adjust that, may not, it is a super minor thing after all.

That’s the red curtain behind the Queen! The transition wipe simply catches the curtain as it passes by the wipe.

Great work Phase3, can’t wait to see what you do with 2 and 3.

Thanks very much!

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What commands had the Queen given up to that point? I don’t recall her actually giving any commands at all, aside from the decoy Queen asking for Artoo to be cleaned!

The decoy queen’s command would still be the queen’s command, but besides that; Panaka’s line is: “Her highness commands”, giving Qui-Gon the opportunity to give a witty retort in response.

We can assume that Padme has given many commands throughout the day since Qui-Gon and Kenobi rescued her, however, the reason that the Jedi were sent to Naboo in the first place, was to be ambassadors to negotiate with the trade federation on behalf of the supreme chancellor, as per the queen’s command. Why? Because the queen: “Would not condone a course of action that would lead us to war”.

She’s basically the whole reason Qui-Gon is now stuck on Tattooine in the first place and he now has to take charge AND protect the queen at the same time, and now, the queen is demanding she come along. Why? Because she’s bored? or she wants to explore? or she believes that she will be safer? This is something Qui-Gon resents to a certain degree, after all why would he have the stuck up rich kid, Obi-Wan, stay with the royalty and he go to the poor slum towns? Perhaps because that’s the kind of company he prefers or perhaps he’s just had enough of royalty and nobility for one day.

Either way, Qui-Gon is enjoying this opportunity to speak a bit more freely and do things his own way, and he gets to do right in the face of the queen herself, and she can’t do or say anything about it? Even better.

Yoda’s line: “Qui-Gon’s defiance I sense in you” at the end of the movie, reflects this.

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Finished watching. Just one word - awesome! Definitive version for me. Thanks a lot for doing this.

Now I’m waiting for your v2 of Attack of the Clones. For now my definitive version is Spence’s.

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paulbackstrom1 said:

Finished watching. Just one word - awesome! Definitive version for me. Thanks a lot for doing this.

Now I’m waiting for your v2 of Attack of the Clones. For now my definitive version is Spence’s.

Thanks for your kind words! I’m glad that you enjoyed it.

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