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The legendary "Starkiller Ranch" Thread — Page 9

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If I may, I'd like to chime in on the whole Maul=Grievous thing.

At first I was very resistant to the idea, as it seemed like a real stretch. I have two problems that haven't been addressed here: First, it goes against the whole concept of two Sith - a master and an apprentice, unless the plan is to cut out the reference to the rule of two at the end of Episode I. I mean, even if we assume that it takes a while for Sidious to restore Maul/Grievous, there's still a time at the beginning of Episode III where there are two apprentices. Second, Maul/Grievous is a sith yet never uses a red lightsaber in Episode III. This could be fixed by rotoscoping though. I know he's collecting Jedi sabers, but at least one of his sabers should be a red sith saber. Ideally, it would be the repaired half of his original saber from Episode I.

Aside from these issues, I'm starting to warm up to the idea of Maul=Grievous. And this goes hand in hand with a comment I made a few pages ago about having Anakin/Vader actually die in the lava in Episode III:

Originally posted by: Erikstormtrooper

2) In ROTJ, Vader says to Luke, "You don't understand the power of the dark side. I MUST obey." Why is this? Why does he have to obey? My impression of Vader is that it was always his hate (and tie to the dark side) that kept him alive inside the suit. So if he really did die in the lava, and Palpatine actually does use his Sith powers to bring him back from death, then vader has to obey in order to continue living. The second he ceases to serve the dark side, he begins to die.


What I'm getting at is, Sidious uses his Sith magic/technology to bring back Maul/Grievous from death and put him in a mechanical suit. If we have Vader die in Episode III, the Emperor ends up doing the exact same thing with him. We always hear about the power of the dark side, but we have yet to really see what that is (I think). I believe this process where we see a dead person come back alive in a mechanical suit IS the power of the dark side. It's their attempt at immortality.

Originally posted by: Commander Courage

We are indeed removing the entire aspect of Qui-Gon discovering the path to immortality. However, one of the more interesting aspects of this (which was unfortunately deleted from the final film) was the fact that the Sith were after immortality, but would never achieve it through their selfish means. In contrast, the Jedi obtain it through their selflessness. This is a powerful plot point that I wish we could bring back to the forefront, but the way things are looking in our saga it’s looking like it will be just as ignored as in the official version. It doesn’t necessarily have to be through Qui-Gon, but things are obviously set up that way.


According to my idea, followers of the dark side are able to achieve immortality by turining people into mechanical zombies. Followers of the light side, on the other hand, are able to do so by becoming one with the Force, as Qui-Gon discovers. This is a slightly daiiferent way to address the immortality issue from what Commander Courage mentioned, but it will address it somewhat.

And on a different note:

Originally posted by: Commander Courage
I had hoped at the end of RotS that Yoda would tell Obi-Wan, "Tell the children of their true parantage we must not, Obi-Wan. Better they believe a different truth than the terrible one that is. Confuse them it will, and lead them on a path to darkness. Until the time is right, unaware they must be." Or something along those lines to get the point across that Yoda and Obi-Wan had their reasons for keeping Anakin=Vader a secret, and planned to reveal it to them at the proper time.


Can we not find someone here who can do a passable Yoda impression? I'm serious. This could open up a whole world of possibilities.

You know of the rebellion against the Empire?

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Just about everyone I know can do a passable Yoda impression -- I have a different idea what the lines should be since "Lead them down the darkside it will" is just nonsense and dishonesty masquerading as wisdom (and I'm agreeing that's the reason provided in the Saga -- I just call nonsense on that reason).

I'd be all for this addition if a better reason for lying can be employed.

Second, if having Maul/Grievous is counter to the whole concept of the Sith and it's "Rule of 2" then what are Vader and the Emperor talking about when they repeated say Luke will "join them?" They don't say "replace one of us."

Clearly there is no rule of 2 from the Sith point of view. Maybe the Jedi believe there is, but that's just more confusion, apparently.

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Just to let you guys know, I'm working on an alternate version of the Greivous/Maul hologram scene I posted last night. This one is more along the lines of what Commander Courage suggested, and may turn out much better than the first. I'll be posting it soon.

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First, it goes against the whole concept of two Sith - a master and an apprentice, unless the plan is to cut out the reference to the rule of two at the end of Episode I. I mean, even if we assume that it takes a while for Sidious to restore Maul/Grievous, there's still a time at the beginning of Episode III where there are two apprentices.
Here at the Ranch, we don't see this as a problem. Maul/Grievous was trained by Sidious from birth (or close enough). It makes sense for him to at least try to retrieve him, as he later retrieves Anakin. Dooku is a temporary fix, and a political figure who serves Sidious' purposes well in the Clone War. Sidious really needs them both to accomplish his goals; there's no reason to limit himself to one just because of an old tradition (that will not be present in out saga, btw). Also he's quite an arrogant one, and assume he can control both apprentices, which of course it does. Different times call for different measures. As Chancellor of the Republic, it would not be in Dooku or Grievous' best interests to assassinate him if the SIth were to retake control of the galaxy. I'm sure each of them had their own aspirations for takeover, but that would have to wait until the Sith were secure in their power.

Second, Maul/Grievous is a sith yet never uses a red lightsaber in Episode III. This could be fixed by rotoscoping though. I know he's collecting Jedi sabers, but at least one of his sabers should be a red sith saber. Ideally, it would be the repaired half of his original saber from Episode I.

Yes, the plan is to recolor his lightsabers. I would suggest all four and vut Grievous' saber-collecting, because as I've noted before, he doesn't seem to concerned with keeping Qui-Gon's or Obi-Wan's in Episode I. Rotoscoping all four would be quite an undertaking, but well worth the effort. This is where the teamwork aspect of the Ranch really comes into play.

What I'm getting at is, Sidious uses his Sith magic/technology to bring back Maul/Grievous from death and put him in a mechanical suit. If we have Vader die in Episode III, the Emperor ends up doing the exact same thing with him.

Exactly. I read your earlier post on this and couldn't agree more. I always interpreted, "You don't know the power of the Dark Side. I MUST obey my master," as Palpatine and the Dark Side keeping him alive. His selfishness to keep on living would not allow him to "let go of his hate." It's only when he puts his son's life above his own that he gives up the Dark Side, no longer concerned with self preservation.

Glad you liked my suggested Yoda dialogue. Great idea about a fan impersonater. It doesn't have to be perfect, pitch and the like can always be altered via computer, and it's certainly worth a try.
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Okay. Here's the alternate version of the previous clip I posted. Let me know which version you like better.

Greivous communicates with the Trade Federation

The Greivous dialogue I included at the very end is meant to be temporary until we decide what he should sound like.

I don't really like the Neimoidians' body language in this scene, but that of course will be helped by the dialogue. And I do like the location better than the conference room.

Thoughts?

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I was actually going to suggest using another Sidious hologram scene in just substituting Maul in the close up. Good call. The Nute/Rune (actually that's not Rune, that's the "slime" guy) exchange doesn't quite work in front of Grievous though. Maybe MTH or someone else can come up with some new dialogue (you're right about the body language, btw). Grievous dialogue in the long shot works great too, working out much better than coming from offscreen, which would really expose the cut-and-paste nature of the scene. Overall good job. I would suggest slowing down the footage of Grievous' close-up though, as he shifts too much in the limited clips we have. Drawing them out more would correct this problem.

Here's a crazy thought: Since the Maul/Sidious swap worked so well and everyone's big on Dooku being in Episode I, what do you think of some Saruman dialogue in the Sidious shots, with the close-ups of the hood darkened like in MagnoliaFan's version? Just a fun experiment to mess around with. It's too bad we don't have any shots of a Grievous hologram though; that would be a good way to incorporate him in Episode II.
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Its an interesting idea, but here are my comments, warning I may be hypocritical but only pointing out these faults for the better of the project:

One, very confused whats going on in the scene, need to see the dialogue or subtitles to really make a opinion on its dramatic/story telling significance.


Two, Maul looks like a standing dummy just crossing his hands. Is there any way you can use footage from the Maul sequence on Coroscant like his face or the angle of the shot, or the scene on Theeds when he is walking/talking to Sidious.

Three, why didnt you have any scenes of Maul speaking like "Tatooine is sparsely populated. If the trace was correct, I will find them quickly, master."

I really like the first one better mostly for the second scene, now thats perfect, no dialouge and the music works great with what Maul is doing, all menace and planning. A true music opera as GL envisioned as you dont need any words to convey whats going on.

Can you use any dialogue from the video games or novel audio recording?

Maybe since you dont want to show Sidious you can insert the line to end the conversation, "At last we will reveal ourselves to the Jedi. At last we will have revenge." or even cut it too, "At last we will reveal ourselves. At last we will have revenge."

Is this all rough cut or are people actually going to make new CGI scenes?


"Fear. Fear attracts the fearful. The strong. The weak. The innocent. The corrupt. Fear. Fear is my ally." you have to use that.

You can also create just dialogue with black background like in the beginning of Fellowship of the rings.
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I don't object in principle to Maul=Grievous. I just wonder what he did for the ten years after TPM and during AotC? This would have to be explained as well as his rescue/reconstruction and I can't see there being enough (if any) appropriate material to do it without it being really scrappy. It's always worth a try, but I think you should be prepared to lose the idea if the execution doesn't live up to it.

Infodroid - watched the new clip. Better, as the WS and OTS shots give it a more natural feel than the other one. The lack of Maul material shows, though. Depending on where you end up putting it in the storyline, you could try playing most of the scene without seeing Maul until the end, thus using that one shot as a reveal. This would work if it's the first time we see him, but not if you follow my earlier suggestion about Tatooine being his first appearance. Overall, I prefer the latter. The prequels have a lot of telegraphing (we're going to do this, now here we are doing it) which is not like the OT. We don't need to know what Maul is up to or who he works for until he fails to get Anakin and then reports back.
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Originally posted by: THX
The prequels have a lot of telegraphing (we're going to do this, now here we are doing it) which is not like the OT. We don't need to know what Maul is up to or who he works for until he fails to get Anakin and then reports back.

I agree whole-heartedly, THX. The audience is most interested when they're trying to figure out what's going on. As long as there's finally a payoff, and at some point it all clicks and comes together, it's not a problem to just throw them right into the middle of things. This is a Kurosawa technique that Lucas admired and borrowed for Episode IV. It worked well for films like the Godfather too. That and its sequel is an example of a film so rich in texture and a story with such depth, that it takes several viewings before you truly understand all the things that are happening in that film.

Originally posted by Mask: One, very confused whats going on in the scene, need to see the dialogue or subtitles to really make a opinion on its dramatic/story telling significance. Two, Maul looks like a standing dummy just crossing his hands. Is there any way you can use footage from the Maul sequence on Coroscant like his face or the angle of the shot, or the scene on Theeds when he is walking/talking to Sidious.

Thanks, this criticism is helpful. Unfortunately, what I used is about all we have to work with. At this point, I don't have the capability to do things like digitally composite images, etc.

Three, why didnt you have any scenes of Maul speaking like "Tatooine is sparsely populated. If the trace was correct, I will find them quickly, master."

I tried it, but the music and sound-effects of the Coruscant cityscape overwhelmed the dialogue.

Can you use any dialogue from the video games or novel audio recording?


Sure I can, if I could find the appropriate clips.

Maybe since you dont want to show Sidious you can insert the line to end the conversation, "At last we will reveal ourselves to the Jedi. At last we will have revenge." or even cut it too, "At last we will reveal ourselves. At last we will have revenge."


I thought about it, but the more I thought about it the less sense it made for him to be saying it to the Neimoidians.

Is this all rough cut or are people actually going to make new CGI scenes?


Definitely no CGI. Not by me anyway.

Originally posted by Commander Courage: Here's a crazy thought: Since the Maul/Sidious swap worked so well and everyone's big on Dooku being in Episode I, what do you think of some Saruman dialogue in the Sidious shots, with the close-ups of the hood darkened like in MagnoliaFan's version? Just a fun experiment to mess around with.


Another mind-blowing suggestion by Commander Courage that I never would have thought of. Excellent idea, My Friend. I'd love to try this, just to see if it could work.

Thanks to everyone for your comments.

--InfoDroid

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Hey gang, been busy with work, car troubles, and then snow for a few days, but I figure I can chime in on this quickly as I try to get caught up.

When the Maul=Grievous idea came up on the SOTDS thread, I PM'd TM and mentioned that I'd be willing to do the voice if needed. I don't think I remembered to get back to him with a recorded sample of the Maul-esque voice I'd be using for the project though, now that I think about it. Damned scatterbrained thoughts during my cut-short vacation....
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"Luminous beings are we -- not this crude matter." ~~Master Yoda
"I find your lack of faith disturbing." ~~Lord Vader
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Barring a possible post-credit sequence, I don't think there is any real way to show the process Maul went through to become the cyborg Grievous of Episode III. The way I envisioned it was Grievous monologing to Obi-Wan at the start of their duel in III, explaining what all he had to go through because of him. Maybe a, "I had to stay in suspended animation for a decade before the technology was available to make me what I am now. This is not an existance worthy of a Sith, Kenobi. And it's all because of you." Something similar to Maul's monologue to Obi-Wan in the Star Wars Infinities story where he confronts him on Tatooine.

And we need to establish (or establish how we're going to establish) Grievous' objectives in Episode I. He is on Tatooine in search of Amidala for the Trade Federation. Perhaps he does notice Anakin as he flees to the ship an mentions this to Qui-Gon (I suggested some rough dialogue in an earlier post). After failing to capture the Queen, he goes to Naboo with the Trade Federation, waiting for the Queen and the Jedi to return? This is what makes it so hard without Sidious. It would indeed be cool to have Grievous after the vergence in the force, Anakin, but I just don't see how to convey that or even go anywhere with it with the material we have available to us.

PS. I saw "Chronicles of Narnia" tonight; great film I highly recommend it. That said, it was an unexpected pleasure when Aslan, the Lion character, was introduced in the film and began to speak: it was Liam Neeson! He's one of my favorite actors so this really enhanced the movie for me, but more importantly he had some great dialogue that would be very useful for Qui-Gon! I look forward to discussing this more in depth as more of you see the film (which I hope you will!).

Another mind-blowing suggestion by Commander Courage that I never would have thought of. Excellent idea, My Friend. I'd love to try this, just to see if it could work.

Wow, thanks Infodroid. Like I said I just thought it would be a neat experiment, but if there's a way to incorporate it into the film somewhere that would certainly shake things up.
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Originally posted by: Erikstormtrooper
If I may, I'd like to chime in on the whole Maul=Grievous thing.

At first I was very resistant to the idea, as it seemed like a real stretch. I have two problems that haven't been addressed here: First, it goes against the whole concept of two Sith - a master and an apprentice, unless the plan is to cut out the reference to the rule of two at the end of Episode I. I mean, even if we assume that it takes a while for Sidious to restore Maul/Grievous, there's still a time at the beginning of Episode III where there are two apprentices. Second, Maul/Grievous is a sith yet never uses a red lightsaber in Episode III. This could be fixed by rotoscoping though. I know he's collecting Jedi sabers, but at least one of his sabers should be a red sith saber. Ideally, it would be the repaired half of his original saber from Episode I.


I think it would be cool if that, after being brought back, Maul is trying to prove himself superior over Tyrannus... kind of like vying(sic) for attention of a father.
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Regarding the whole Maul/Greivous thing: What if Sidious viewed Maul as a failure after his supposed destruction on Naboo and dropped him as a Sith apprentice? Maul would undergo years of salvage work, and after a bit of bond-o, we are left with Greivous, a shell of what he used to be. Maybe the overall lack of a body would also account for him not being able to tap into the Force. That alone would result in being re-assigned by Sidious. This would be just a step beyond what Vandal just suggested.
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Originally posted by: Commander Courage
I don't think there is any real way to show the process Maul went through to become the cyborg Grievous of Episode III.
Agreed.
The way I envisioned it was Grievous monologing to Obi-Wan at the start of their duel in III, explaining what all he had to go through because of him. Maybe a, "I had to stay in suspended animation for a decade before the technology was available to make me what I am now. This is not an existance worthy of a Sith, Kenobi. And it's all because of you."

CC, I really like some of your ideas, but not this one. This is like comic-book exposition and as such weakens both Maul and Grievous. The most important factor in suspending the audience's disbelief is to have believable characters. This would pull me right out of the movie right away.
And we need to establish Grievous' objectives in Episode I. He is on Tatooine in search of Amidala for the Trade Federation. Perhaps he does notice Anakin as he flees to the ship an mentions this to Qui-Gon (I suggested some rough dialogue in an earlier post). After failing to capture the Queen, he goes to Naboo with the Trade Federation, waiting for the Queen and the Jedi to return? This is what makes it so hard without Sidious. It would indeed be cool to have Grievous after the vergence in the force, Anakin, but I just don't see how to convey that or even go anywhere with it with the material we have available to us.

I'm thinking along these lines: the Neimoidians think Maul's working for them to get Amidala, but he has a secret mission from Sidious to get Anakin. Again, this doesn't need to be explicit, just suggested like MTH said earlier. Although it would be interesting if Maul somehow let slip about "the chosen one" in Qui-Gon's presence.
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Can you post the dialogue thats supposed to be in subtitles for that Nembodians/Maul scene?

I like that flicker at the end of the first version when Maul leaves.

You could ask a member called PixelMagic on the TFN boards about making CGI scenes, he is very good.
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My feeling about Grievous/Maul going to Tatooine without being instructed to is that it won't make sense. We'd see Amidala escape from Naboo, see no response from the Trade Federation, but suddenly see a guy in black arrive on Tatooine and send out droids. The droids find Qui Gonn -- they fight, Qui Gonn escapes -- and... what just happened? Then Grievous shows up on Naboo and fights the Jedi there -- and I'm supposed to gather that he wants to capture Anakin? What about when he just lets Anakin fly away in the Naboo fighter?

It's so much stronger as a story to have Nute in charge -- he sends Grievous, he starts the invasion, he fights the war, and his destruction ends the battle. Grievous is a "lieutenant" in the mix who represents a hidden party (Sidious). Like ANH, Episode I should feel like a complete story that has just enough of a loose thread to see a possible sequel. But on the surface, the Republic is saved, the Naboo are saved, Anakin becomes an apprentice, and the Gungans get back their Kaiber crystal (or whatever). Opening up too much ambiguity is the biggest flaw this Episode I has, imo. The first time I saw the parade at the end, I remember thinking about how much had been left undone. Way too much. I think the best version of this movie will really come home at the end and feel surprisingly complete.

As to the potential scene of Maul's reconstruction. I don't see why it can't be done as an early scene in Episode II -- maybe I'm seeing something no one else is. I think the questions about why it takes so long and why more people aren't ressurected will be answered by this little scene which uses footage from the Vader construction and other places. I see Sidious coming in to check on Grievous, who's stretched out on the table (we key in on his eyes). Robot surgeons report to Sidious, "He will live a long life. That's a success. There's too little left to make him a warrior again, I'm afraid. The heart and mind will not function at a competant level without more tissue." "We will make them." replies Sidious. "Yes, master." Says the droid. Key in on those Grievous eyes again. -- In other words, this is one hell of a long and agonizing process and it's a pet project of Sidious'. Putting this scene into the beginning of Episode II will actually make the Dukoo/Sidious relationship harder to spot and more surprising in the end. Having it there will help protect the Palaptine/Sidious reveal. It will also set up things pretty much as they are in Episode III -- no monologuing necessary.

Episode II is oddly short of Sidious material as it is.

My god do we have a lot of ideas to catalogue in this thread. Plus competing versions of the same ideas sometimes. We should do a re-cap soon.

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Originally posted by: MTHaslett
We'd see Amidala escape from Naboo, see no response from the Trade Federation, but suddenly see a guy in black arrive on Tatooine and send out droids. The droids find Qui Gonn -- they fight, Qui Gonn escapes -- and... what just happened?

Precisely! So the movie is one step ahead of the audience, rather than the other way around. Then we see Maul report back to the Neimoidians, before going to Naboo, and it all starts to make sense.

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Originally posted by: THX
Originally posted by: MTHaslett
We'd see Amidala escape from Naboo, see no response from the Trade Federation, but suddenly see a guy in black arrive on Tatooine and send out droids. The droids find Qui Gonn -- they fight, Qui Gonn escapes -- and... what just happened?

Precisely! So the movie is one step ahead of the audience, rather than the other way around. Then we see Maul report back to the Neimoidians, before going to Naboo, and it all starts to make sense.

Hmmm, I can see both side here and aren't sure which one to take. Having the Tatooine arrival scene first makes for a very strong enterance for Grievous, akin to Vader's on the Tantive. But plot wise it would make sense for Nute to dispatch him to retrieve the Queen. I just don't know for now.

Another thought I had to spin things in a completely different direction: Is Anakin going to have a dream in Episode I? Putting together various pieces I constructed this scenario in my head:
-Activating the Podracer scene
-Misc. Trade Federation scene/perhaps contacting Grievous
-Grievous arriving on Tatooin scene
-CUT TO BLACK at conclusion (Even though it was just because of the test nature of the clip, I loved it)
-Anakin has a vision/dream
-Fade into Padme waking up Anakin.

This works on several levels. It cuts the now unecessary Qui-Gon/Anakin blood test scene, and has you assume he spent the night outside finishing up his pod. Anakin has a dream in the novelization in that exact spot as well, so taking a cue from that we could put together something similar to Trooperman's in SotDS. Some Padme material in the dream would make it an easy transition to her waking him up. I think the idea we were having in the SotDS thread was that Palpatine was in fact causing Anakin's dreams, so this may or may not work for a variety of reasons, but it's worth some discussion regardless.
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Wait, we have changed Maul's name to Grevious?

While I really like the dramatic scene of Maul's entrance with the music, it is better to understand what he is doing first, then to have an unknown scene first.

Should Star Wars movies really be more about thinking whats going on or enjoying the ride?

I personally think Maul's significance is enough for TPM, you can improve Grevious's image in ROTS.

While I'd love to have a Maul = Grevious connection without new entire scenes (CGI wise) its a pointless quest since it leeds to more problems that it fixes.

There are ALOT more problems with the star wars universe than this, but thats just me.

Like Jar-Jar, little Ani, Watto, Boss Nass, Genoisis creatures (the leader makes clicking noises and the audience speeks in cheering (human chants)), Sifo-Dias, Dooku, Sidious, there are many more problems than this.
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Maul's arrival on Tatooine is unnecessary. He could appear first when he duels Qui-Gon on Tatooine. I don't think not knowing exactly what's going on prevents enjoying the ride. It's a tried and tested narrative device to enter storylines as late as possible while not creating too much confusion. After all, there's no scene in ANH where Tarkin tells Vader to take a star destroyer and capture the blockade runner.

I tend to agree with Mask about Maul = Grievous creating more problems than it solves. But if InfoDroid wants to cut MTH's scene as a test, I'm prepared to be convinced.
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Originally posted by: THX
Maul's arrival on Tatooine is unnecessary. He could appear first when he duels Qui-Gon on Tatooine.


Actually you need a scene or somehow convey what his purpose is, I dont remember any movies that work like heres the action now later well tell you why that happened, you have to explain on whats going on, or you'll just end up what we have now, confusion; but I think if you can somehow include that Grevious theme into his entrance or maybe some alternative it works wonderfully.

Just as GL envisoned star wars to be a music opera where the music tells the story alas his latest movies have gone away with this idea, but thats for another topic entirely.
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This might work as long as we get an indication before Maul goes to Tatooine that Nute has an ace up his sleeve. "Oh no!" says the flunky "Amidala's escaped!"

"No. She is never beyond my grasp."

"But if she should reach the Senate..."

"She will never see the Senate again."

But if Maul just shows up on Tatooine, then the additional sub-plot will only weaken the already weak storyline.

Then we've got a runaway queen headed to god knows where who sends her handmaiden into town to "learn about the culture" as her people die, then they discover a slave boy who likes to "pod-race" (whatever that is), and they decide to pod-race to get the parts they need, then they realize the boy's a "vergence", and then some guy in black starts looking for them and by that time it's like, "where is this going and who the hell were those Trade Federation guys that were in this movie when it started?"

The best thing about Maul on Tatooine is that he can energize this slow, unrelated side-trip by representing the antagonists of the main story. If we don't know why he's there, then that's just one more thing we don't understand. The movie needs MORE structure, not less. Making him the outreaching claw of Gunray, threatening our heroes as they desperately try to get their ship going. That tension is what's sadly missing. We need ways to extend the impact Maul has throughout the Tatooine sequence -- ways to show those probe droids searching and just missing our heroes as they prepare for the race.

Obscuring the nature of Maul's threat does nothing to help that I can see. But maybe having him be the surprising method Gunray has for chasing Amidala down -- the fulfillment of a threat -- is an improvement.


If we just cut Maul from Tatooine altogether, then the Tatooine stuff becomes a complete side-show which we might as well cut altogether -- just have them swing by and pick up Anakin in a couple of brief scenes. Watoo sells them parts, and a slave. No pod-race and they get back on the road.

WIthout Maul, the Tatooine story has NOTHING to do with the main story.

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Long time reader, first time poster. I’m loving what I’m reading, and just had to come on and put in my two cents.

On Grievous/Maul: I like having our first view of Grievous/Maul be with him descending from his ship, while the Grievous theme plays in the background. But I also think it needs some set up. So why don’t you keep the hologram scene, but not show any close-ups of Grievous/Maul. So we see Nute talking with this hooded figure (“Move against the Jedi first. You should then have no problem bringing the queen back here to sign the treaty”) but we don’t reveal who he’s talking to until we see Grievous/Maul land his ship and send out the probes. I also like the idea of giving Anakin a Padme dream, but I think Grievous/Maul needs to reach Tatooine before then. I just re-watched TPM last night, and realized just how long we spend on Tatooine before Maul shows up, and how boring that makes it. Maybe you could just cut enough of the Tatooine stuff, so it doesn’t feel so long, eh?

A couple other ideas…
What if you reversed the scene where Amidala decides to go back to Naboo, and the scene where the Jedi are ordered to? This shouldn’t be too hard. Just cut Mace’s lines so they go like this (brackets indicate cut)…

Mace: Now is not the time for this. The Senate is voting on a new supreme chancellor [and Queen Amidala is returning home], which
could put pressure on the federation…
Ki: And draw out the queen’s attacker.
Mace: Go [with the queen] to Naboo and discover the identity of this dark
warrior. This is the clue we need to unravel the mystery of the Sith.

If you play this scene right, you could even make it look like the Jedi Council is sending Qui-Gon back to Naboo as punishment for disagreeing so publicly over Anakin, making Anakin feeling both guilty about Qui-Gon’s eventual death (gives “I don’t want to be a problem” a deeper meaning), as well as possible making him even more mad at the Jedi Council for their vindictiveness.
Then just change Jar-Jar’s lines so they talk about the Jedi (“Are all you’re people going to die?” “I don’t know.” “The Jedi are going to get killed trying to save them.” “I hope not.”)

One final small suggestion: cut the last part of the Obi-Wan/Yoda scene near the end. End it with “Qui-Gon’s defiance I sense in you. Need that, you do not.” This way, the audience doesn’t know what the council has decided about Anakin until Obi-Wan tells him. Just creates a little more tension, and eliminates a little redundancy.
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Great Post DaystromX

I like those ideas.

I had ideas for restructuring the entire Coruscant sequence. This fits in well. There is too much ping-pong between Senate business and Jedi business in the courant sequence. It makes the action drag even more during an already slow sequence.

Your ideas add more tension and character to these sequences. Good work!

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Originally posted by: MTHaslett
This might work as long as we get an indication before Maul goes to Tatooine that Nute has an ace up his sleeve.

"Oh no!" says the flunky "Amidala's escaped!"

"No. She is never beyond my grasp."

"But if she should reach the Senate..."

"She will never see the Senate again."

Love this idea! Then Maul shows up in the landing scene, then reports back to Nute.