The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant Special Edition (WIP) — Page 6

It was actually “You underestimate my odds” which is a combination of Anakin/Vader and Han Solo. The reason it’s gone is because its corresponding shot doesn’t work anymore. Kylo doesn’t have his hood on, so I tried only using the part where the camera is panned down far enough to ignore that, but then I noticed that he’s got both of his hands on his lightsaber. His new first attack against Vader isn’t an overhead strike, it’s a single-handed swipe from his left.

So, TL;DR, it’s another continuity issue. I can check the fan film to see if there’s another shot of Kylo I can use, but I don’t believe there was one. The substitute here is Vader saying “You are no Sith” to Kylo performing 2 banned ligthsaber moves, and then Kylo says “I know” like Han. Kylo already emulates his father’s finger point thing later on, so it’s clear his dad is top of mind. As he says in TLJ, he never hated him, he only killed him because he thought he HAD to choose power because of fate. This movie clarifies that through the vision of the throne. Plus, Luke says “He would bring… the end of all I loved because of what he would become”.

I really don’t want this vision to be so rapid fire that you can’t even make out what is going on properly. Yeah, that might line up better with the original TROS, but there is definitely merit in making this more akin to Rey confronting her evil clone on the Death Star and also Luke’s own thing with Vader on Dagobah. There should be a mini story present there imo, with a beginning, middle, and end. And that includes allowing some build-up rather than jumping straight into things. I think the epileptic nature of TROS is something we should be actively avoiding in this case, not contributing further to.

Thanks for sharing that though. Apparently there is a shot with both Kylo and the mask in frame, which I had no idea existed because I haven’t watched original TROS in ages.

I think a good middle ground here would be to intersperse those shots of Kylo and the mask throughout the vision better. Currently, it’s only at the part where he’s hoisted up in the air. This might add to the “snappy” nature that you seem interested in.

One other alternative might be to blend the Kylo and Rey fight from TFA in so that we don’t need to have Vader state that’s what’s on his mind, and make it immediately clear why they are located in the place that they are.

So the vision could start with flashes of the TFA fight, and then Kylo would find himself alone in the forest. The stuff with Vader happens, interspersed with the occasional clash from TFA. When Kylo lands the hit on Vader, we also see Rey slashing Kylo’s face. This would explain why he’s unbalanced enough to be thrown back by Vader into the air.

There are a couple problems with this, admittedly. If he’s reliving those moments in the forest, just with Vader in the place of Rey, he wouldn’t have the mask on. Yet, at the same time, we do want his mask on since that is what he reforges after this scene. It might also be confusing to audience to be constantly switching between 3 different realities - the past, present, and visionary.

Ah, that explains it. It does look way more artsy than the shots they ended up using in the film for some reason. I think it would slot in perfectly in place of the Kylo shot readying himself as Vader approaches him that I had to remove for continuity.

One thing worth considering about the rapid-fire visions in TROS is that they include footage from random parts of the previous movies, thus necessitating such a film style. What we have here is entirely new footage that is already arranged in a narrative format, so I really don’t think the same technique is necessary.

It’s funny to me how even Ian McDiarmid thinks the only logical way to justify Rey Palpatine is either that Palpatine has sex, OR that he manipulated the midichlorians:

https://www.digitalspy.com/movies/a46783801/star-wars-palpatine-sex/

He’s probably unfamiliar with the canon explanation of her father being a clone, but honestly as I consider that more it’s just so convoluted compared to the two options listed above. Genetically speaking, that would make Rey his daughter, not his granddaughter. When a novelization is retconning its own movie, and you can argue semantics with all of it, it’s definitely not a good look.

I’m definitely going to see this project through to the end as it seems like the most logical alternative to preserving the reveal while also (somewhat) denying it by the end to enhance taking on the Skywalker name and her genetic nobody-ness. But I want to make sure Ascendant v5 is complete first as that is what I intend on using as a base for this. I’ll still be uploading various tests like the Vader duel and stuff but I expect things to slow down here for a bit.

Hmmm, that is unfortunate. How about I give you all of the time necessary to see Ascendant v5 to fruition, first? Then we can move on to more experimental work like in this thread?

Thus why I made my offer. I don’t think that not wanting to hurry through that means that you can’t work on trying to see ideas contributed there to fruition. Ideally, we’d have a timeline of all the changes we want to see and then leave it there to simmer for a while before it’s actually rendered out.

Since it’s been roughly a month since I last posted here, I thought I’d just clarify that I’m still fully intent on finishing this edit. However, I think I may end up taking things further “in a few places”, if you get what I’m saying 😉

With The Bad Batch show directly referring to things such as “M-Counts” it’s only a matter of time before they finally say the darn word out loud again. It’s really interesting how they want to use the concept of them in that show but refuse to name them out loud because of the stigma behind it. I think I’m gonna say “screw it” and make the connection to ROTS as clear as possible through Kylo’s revelation speech to limit people being confused:

“Rey… I know the rest of our story”

“Tell me.”

“Palpatine influenced the midichlorians to create… life. First my grandfather, and then you. Both were his chosen heir. You… are a rightful Palpatine. Now, the Emperor wants us to fight each other, so the strongest can inherit the throne. But he doesn’t realize we are one in spirit, by the power of the Force. We can end him, and the Sith. And create a new order, together.”

In my opinion, the problem with midichlorians is that they served no narrative purpose in the grand scheme of things. Sure, they tell the characters who has strong potential, but they could have done that with a more abstract concept. I feel as if mentioning the midichlorians would make the concept of somebody being born without relations more understandable, and retroactively justify their entire existence. Luke’s dialogue about nobody being able to claim what the Force made would remain unchanged, but that’s only because the “how” and “why” the Force is able to conceive life has been explained. The biggest problem with the way I had originally worded things here was that more casual fans would be completely confused how a mystical Force could influence such a purely biological process.

Besides, the ultimate message of this edit would be that, ironically, the midichlorians don’t define you. Sure, Palpatine might have used them to create Rey, but Luke would be telling her that she is the only one with the right to define herself.

Yes, and that is still the concept of this edit if you want to see it that way. Palpatine is manipulating Kylo and Rey to believe that they belong to him. Ultimately, it’s my intention that Anakin and Rey were simply made by the Force to bring balance, which justifies Rey exponentially in taking the Skywalker name. That’s why this is called the “Chosen One” edit and not the “All Skywalkers are Palpatine’s” edit. Now, if some people still want to argue that Palpatine may have had a hand in both, that’s completely fine. But that’s not the conclusion Rey comes to in the end of the movie. In fact, Palpatine admits she’s “nothing” and “a scavenger girl” once she turns on him.

Ultimately, what will make or break this edit is my dialogue for Luke. It needs to effectively convey that being afraid that they all belong to Palpatine is a fruitless endeavor. It’s like asking which came first, the chicken or the egg? In this case, the answer to that question doesn’t matter, because the Force still made their bloodlines, and they belong to the Force. It doesn’t matter even if Palpatine jumpstarted them. They are people with their own free will. They just have to choose to uphold the prophecy that was made so long ago about them.

I think movies that have such grey territory like this are the best ones. It’s not interesting anymore for a plot twist / revelation to simply be that you are the descendant of somebody. We need to start asking more philosophical questions, like whether the actions and claims of others define us or if we make that decision ourselves.

Here’s the current status of the Ahch-To dialogue:

R: “I saw myself on the dark throne. I won’t let it happen. I’m doing what you did.”

L: “I was wrong. Pushing Ben toward that throne was my greatest fear. What are you most afraid of?”

R: “Myself.”

L: “Because you’re a Palpatine? Nobody can claim those the Force made. Only you can choose your belonging. Some things are stronger than blood. Confronting fear is the destiny of a Jedi. Your destiny. If you don’t face Palpatine, it will mean the end of the Jedi. And the war will be lost… There’s something my sister would want you to have.”

R: “Leia’s saber.”

L: “She was quick to learn in our training. But Leia feared the darkness in our father, choosing instead to follow our mother’s path. She surrendered her saber to me, and said it would be picked up again, by somebody with the spirit to face that darkness. A thousand generations live in you now, but this is your fight. You will restore balance.”

R: “I can’t get there. I don’t have the Wayfinder. I destroyed Ren’s ship.”

L: “You have everything you need.”

EDIT: An alternative to make things less ambiguous would be:
“Because you’re a Palpatine? The Force chose you, Rey, just as it chose my father. To bring balance to the Force. Some things are stronger than blood…”
But then there’s less character agency and it’s not clear if the Force alone made them (although maybe the second part is a good thing, I’m not sure).

I like how the less ambiguous line sounds, and the Anakin reference is cool. I would remove the stronger than blood line, though, it feels kind of separated from the rest of the dialogue and Rey isn’t exactly blood related to Palpatine so I feel like it doesn’t make as much sense in context. Maybe just leave a pause where that line is.

Yeah I’ve been trying to weave around that line but you’ve finally given me the motivation to just consider it deleted. The thing is that it still works on the context of Palpatine goading her: “It is your birthright to rule. Here. It is in your blood.”

“Our blood” would be removed. Then again, this specific line is said from a great distance, so I could always replace it with something else such as “I designed you to rule. Here. It is your only purpose.”

I’ve decided to overhaul this thread into being only a Special Edition of Ascendant. I know there will inevitably be some questions.

The reason I’m doing this is because the original premise behind this edit already bordered between breaking canon and not, so I think I’d be more comfortable remaining within more solid territory. Furthermore, no matter which way I tried to execute this idea, there was always this feeling of things bordering on incest and every single character being related to each other in this entire saga. For example, Leia would have like 4 different possible last names - Organa, Solo, Skywalker, Palpatine.

I’m trying to avoid some of this goofiness.

Instead, this edit will simply be taking the approach of making Rey Palpatine a little less stupid, as well as introducing the Kylo versus Vader fight and the Luke reaching out to Kylo scene. The main way this will be accomplished is by removing Palpatine even knowing about Rey as a child. Instead, he will simply be going after Rey’s father, his “son”. This clears up a lot of Ochi’s questionable antics, like being unable to find Rey and killing the only people who might know where she is. Here is the dialogue I’m currently considering:

Kylo: “It was Palpatine who had your parents taken. Your father had escaped him. But he soon learned your father was a powerless failure. So he gave the order.”

Kylo: “You know why you were kept a secret.”

Rey (unaltered): “No.”

Kylo (unaltered): “I’ll come tell you.”

And later…

Kylo: “I know how Palpatine discovered you…”

Rey: “Tell me.”

Kylo (unaltered): “Because he saw what you would become. You don’t just have power. You have his power…”

Here is the sequence of events:
Palpatine’s son escapes Exegol -> Palpatine sends Ochi to find him -> His son finds a partner and has Rey -> Rey’s parents pay for her to be watched by Unkar Plutt because Ochi has just found out where they live -> Ochi captures them and flies off, leaving Rey behind -> Palpatine finds out her father doesn’t have the Force -> Ochi kills Rey’s parents since they’re useless to him -> Palpatine has a vision of Rey at some point, discovering her existence

The only problem with this idea is a later exchange between Finn and Poe. I’ll need some help brainstorming around this. Most of the lines are spoken on-screen, so AI lines are somewhat out as a solution.

Finn: “He was going to Exegol with Ochi of Bestoon.”

Poe: “Why was Ochi going there?”

Finn: “To bring the little girl he was supposed to take from Jakku to the Emperor. He wanted her alive.”

Oh, and I should clarify that the reason I think this Rey background change necessary is because in order to fit in the Vader duel and Luke scene I have to remove 2 instances of Palpatine reminding Kylo and the audience that he wants her dead. At that point, it’s best to just play into the idea that there is some level of truth to him never wanting her dead.

Immediately after Palpatine reveals her true nature to Kylo, the audience can assume that Palps tells Kylo that should he fail in killing Rey, that she will kill him instead and inherit what he could have had. This is reflected in another updated Kylo line: “Palpatine wants us to fight” instead of “Palpatine wants you dead.”

So the premise is that Palpatine wants them to fight each other so the strongest bloodline becomes his heir. Granted, this will never be explicitly stated since I have no intentions of further modifying Kylo’s reveal scene for this edit.

Yes, that is what this is now. Stuff that might take skeptics out of the movie, but casual fans really wouldn’t bat an eye at.

As for the Poe and Finn scene, I think I’ve solved it:

“He was going to Exegol with Ochi of Bestoon.”

“Why was Ochi going there?”

“He learned of a little girl he was supposed to take from Jakku, to the Emperor.”

This definitely doesn’t conflict with anything, as even if Ochi learned about Rey somehow shortly after murdering her parents (perhaps the dagger showed him this?) he then proceeds to die in the sinking fields, so the secret stays buried with him.

The other thing is that this makes WAY more sense than Ascendant. If Ochi knew he was supposed to take Rey from Jakku, then why the heck was he going back to Exegol with D-0, like Finn is saying? That doesn’t make any sense. But if he just learned about her, then it makes sense he’d need to go back to Exegol to report this recent development to Palpatine before proceeding with anything.

EDIT: Heck, I could even fill in some of the empty ADR space that Ascendant leaves us to make this idea more clear - “He learned of a little girl he was supposed to take from Jakku, to the Emperor. He needed new orders.”

I’ll probably end up doing this:

“He learned of a little girl he was supposed to take from Jakku, to the Emperor. The dagger exposed Rey."

This then explains why he’s going back to Exegol even if he already has a direct line of communication with Palpatine to transmit this news through (as evidenced by him getting the order to kill her father).

If it’s just the dagger giving Ochi visions of a girl on Jakku after killing her parents, then the Emperor would need to hold it himself to verify the nature of all of it as fact. But when Ochi never returns, he is left to assume that his granddaughter really does exist, especially after sensing her in TFA/TLJ.

As I stated on the Ascendant thread, this then blends harmoniously with a new Kylo line to Rey along the lines of: “The dagger showed you what happened to your parents, didn’t it?” So the dagger acts as a sort of family tracking agent upon coming in contact with somebody’s biological material. When Rey picks it up, she is shown the final moments of her parents. When Ochi stabs her father, he is shown his daughter.