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Post #1507487

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Anakin/Vader and mortality
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Date created
12-Oct-2022, 3:50 PM
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13-Oct-2022, 12:50 AM
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Darth Malgus said:

You know, the more I read this discussion, the more I realize that this is not a discussion about the Jedi teachings and theology, but simply a confrontation between two philosophies and two different ways of understanding life.

On one hand, there are those who are in favor of Romanticism, expressing their passions and having selfish feelings, but without letting these things take over and balancing them with altruism. On the other hand, there are those who are completely opposed to passion and selfishness and profess absolute altruism, instead of a form of altruism that Is balanced with selfishness. It’s for this reason that Anakin’s story and tragedy have a different meaning depending on the person who talks about them.

Our contrasts have actually nothing to do with Star Wars, they’re simply a reflection of what we think and what our philosophy of life is. So if anything, if we have to discuss these things, I think we should do it in the appropriate sections, where we can discuss about personal things, philosophy and stuff like that. Because again, this discussion about the Jedi is nothing more than a transposition of what we think and what our philosophy of life is. So I think we should bring the discussion back to the objective reality of things, without necessarily having to involve Star Wars.

I’m just talking about Lucas’ intentions in all this. I am a very passionate person (more then most, I think) and I don’t think having selfish desires is inherently a bad thing at all, especially when it comes to romantic relationships. Hell, I have Peter and MJ from the MCU in my pfp lmao.

I don’t think Lucas does either though. He’s married. He has kids. He’s a passionate guy. We’re talking Mr. “I want to make the film I want to make and I refuse to back down the studios”. The Jedi are allowed to leave if they want to pursue their selfish desires. But as Lucas says, “A Jedi can’t be selfish”. Being a Jedi is a commitment, a way of life. It’s something that a Jedi has to do. The Jedi’s is based on his philosophy somewhat (especially when it comes to unchecked fear being the root of evil and letting go of things), but at the same time they’re an Order that needs to have rules. If Lucas doesn’t think anybody should get married then he shouldn’t have gotten married. But he did. Twice. He got married again in 2013 after making the prequels. It’s obvious that’s not him saying, “You can’t get married, ever! Bad!” He’s saying that a Jedi can’t get married because of commitment. If you want to get married, you need to leave the Order.

yotsuya said:

Well, you kind of made my point there. Yoda said that fear leads to anger which leads to hate which leads to suffering. At what point are you doomed to the dark side? It isn’t just fear. The entire teaching is based on stopping at fear. It is established in The Phantom Menace than Anakin has fear. The council does not want to teach him based on that. He has not given in to his anger, which we see when Palpatine is testing his chosen apprentices. The movies establish that the jump from anger to hate is where you get trapped. The Jedi are stopping at fear to avoid anger and hate. They are avoiding the path to the dark side by cutting it off at fear. Conquering your fear is a good teaching. But it was not the point that Anakin needed.

Yeah, the point is that they need to conquer their fear and confront it instead of bottling it up and leaving it unattended. If you don’t confront your fear, it’ll consume you. And anger and hate is what it’ll lead to. Conquering fear is not a bad thing for Anakin. It’s what he needs to do to live a healthy life. And as I’ve said, the reason they reject him is because he is bottling up his fear. He won’t conquer it because he won’t acknowledge that it exists.

Also the Jedi did not change their opinion on fear by ESB. Yoda even lists fear as one of the things that leads to the dark side. “Anger, fear, aggression, the dark side are they”.