I’m suprised that there appears to be such momentum behind editing Kenobi, because I’ve found it near flawless so far. Perhaps that’s just a lack of imagination!

I definitely agree with a couple of tweaks mentioned here though - both regarding editing. The Leia capture definitely felt like she got away far too easily and for far too long, so I’m all for a quick sneaky sack on the head. And like others here, seeing Obi-Wan escape from Vader screen right, but then re-emerge in the next shot screen right, did make it look like he realised he forgot his keys and needed to dash back to grab them off the kitchen table.

And with all respect to Hal as ever, I feel like it’s worth revisiting the discussion about the Padmé’s survival canon conflict. The Obi-Wan show might do some work to reconcile Padmé dying in childbirth with Leia’s memories of her - perhaps Leia mentions that she dreams of her “as if she’s still with me” or something. But if that doesn’t happen, and the conflict remains, then I think it’s worth establishing which side of the conflicting information carries the most ‘canonical’ weight, and which must yield. And if that’s the case, then I think we can safely argue that Padmé’s death in childbirth is the more canonical, having been explicitly shown in a movie, and referenced here. Back when the conflict only existed between two films, it made sense to yield to the cultural weight of the original trilogy, but now, no new media is going to imply she survived, and more yet may continue to reference her death. I don’t think it’d be wise for us to be beholden to the idea of her survival, and to be encouraged to remove all new and future references to her death. Rather, I’d propose that the logical option here would be to simply remove the conflicting line from ROTJ, in spite of the cultural weight of the original trilogy. Pluck that rock out of the stream and allow the water to continue to flow in the direction it appears to be naturally going.

I don’t think most of us dislike the show or anything near that. I enjoy it way more than it bothers me - but I am perfectionist (and a victim lol) for my own subjective views on good filmmaking, tone, structure, continuity and musical fluidity, and fan editing is a tool to take that subjective opinion and craft something I believe is an improvement on the original product.

I can only speak for myself, and my problems are clearly stated on the first page of this thread so I can only repeat myself; there’s good, bad and ugly in this show, and I am one of those people who only see potential when faced with what are subjective problems. I just want to improve upon what I think they do bad, and keep all the stuff I think they do good - and then make something completely epic out of that.

That is the main focus of this edit, and I also think the main goal of everyone chiming in on their dislikes, love and ideas for the show.

EddieDean said:

I’m suprised that there appears to be such momentum behind editing Kenobi, because I’ve found it near flawless so far. Perhaps that’s just a lack of imagination!

I definitely agree with a couple of tweaks mentioned here though - both regarding editing. The Leia capture definitely felt like she got away far too easily and for far too long, so I’m all for a quick sneaky sack on the head. And like others here, seeing Obi-Wan escape from Vader screen right, but then re-emerge in the next shot screen right, did make it look like he realised he forgot his keys and needed to dash back to grab them off the kitchen table.

And with all respect to Hal as ever, I feel like it’s worth revisiting the discussion about the Padmé’s survival canon conflict. The Obi-Wan show might do some work to reconcile Padmé dying in childbirth with Leia’s memories of her - perhaps Leia mentions that she dreams of her “as if she’s still with me” or something. But if that doesn’t happen, and the conflict remains, then I think it’s worth establishing which side of the conflicting information carries the most ‘canonical’ weight, and which must yield. And if that’s the case, then I think we can safely argue that Padmé’s death in childbirth is the more canonical, having been explicitly shown in a movie, and referenced here. Back when the conflict only existed between two films, it made sense to yield to the cultural weight of the original trilogy, but now, no new media is going to imply she survived, and more yet may continue to reference her death. I don’t think it’d be wise for us to be beholden to the idea of her survival, and to be encouraged to remove all new and future references to her death. Rather, I’d propose that the logical option here would be to simply remove the conflicting line from ROTJ, in spite of the cultural weight of the original trilogy. Pluck that rock out of the stream and allow the water to continue to flow in the direction it appears to be naturally going.

I feel like they’re may be able to be a middle ground, maybe using the funeral footage and deepfake Blair over the actress playing Padme’s niece, and imply the funeral comes a few years before the start of Kenobi. Leia knows she’s adopted, that she has a “real” mother, and I don’t think it’s too far fetched to imply that Padme took a role as Breha’s lady’s maid and Leia’s nurse. Even if Leia’s parents never said your nurse is your mom, it seems like she’d figure it out based on how high her perception is in the show.

Barring that, can the line be removed from RotJ without removing Luke’s question about Leia’s mom? If not that’s fine, as I think the part of that scene that has the most cultural memory around it is sister reveal, not the question about parents.

Anyway, I also agree re: Kenobi. I’m really enjoying it as is, and am really only curious about minor nips and tucks. And maybe a movie version, to pair with Solo and Rogue One as a Dark Times Trilogy.

To Eddie’s point, I do already make a version of LOE available in which Padme dies. However, my main concern has always been for the saga itself to feel cohesive regardless of any other (in the old way of thinking about it, “EU”) material. So whether Kenobi addresses it or not, the saga viewer is still presented with the apparent contradiction.

Assuming the subject isn’t broached in the remainder of the Kenobi series, I would prefer to leave LOE as it is but to trim a couple things about Kenobi to let the viewer go on believing Padme had lived for some amount of time on Alderaan. I really like Leia’s conversation with Ben in episode 3 because when she wonders about her father, it implies she has less reason to wonder about her mother.

Now, if they go balls to the wall with a hard comment on the discrepancy by having Ben inject memories into her or something like that in a way essential to the story, then we might have an issue. But even so, two versions of LOE dodge the issue. If Kenobi does make a deliberate solution to it, there’ll still be the “saga only” version that coheres better directly with ROTJ.

leftshoe18 said:

I think the piano works not because it implies Anakin’s sadness over doing this but rather Obi-Wan’s sadness over not being able/willing to stop it.

^

Darth Raditz said:

I prefer Anakin’s Dark Deeds over the piano. The former sounds more personal (it’s names after a character after all), while the piano, though good, sounds more like something you’d play over a montage at the end of a story. The piano also sounds too sad for what Vader is doing, like it pains him to do it, which it doesn’t.

The lightsaber editing is also good, though I’m wonering if you can add bac Vader saying “the year’s have made you weak,” as a way of clarifying when Ben was weak but ready in episode 4 & weaker/unprepared now.

I respect that. I intend and interpret the music as a reflection of Obi-Wan’s feelings in this scene rather than Darth Vader’s, him being the main protagonist and all.

There are many mixed opinions on this matter - as it should be, and although we have not settled on anything as of yet, the most likely outcome will be Dark Deeds or Piano Theme over that scene rather than silence.

Hal 9000 said:
Now, if they go balls to the wall with a hard comment on the discrepancy by having Ben inject memories into her or something like that in a way essential to the story…

Hmm, I could actually see Kenobi doing that.

Dark Deeds & Piano Theme, with Sith Whispers:

https://streamable.com/5uz2sr

Might this be more preferable?

CMMAP said:
Although the piano theme does have a nice ring, i think the horror is missing with it. But ultimately it´s your edit.
Anakins dark deeds could work, though.

But isn’t Anakin’s actions horrifying enough, and the sadness in the music just a representation of Obi-Wan’s feelings in that moment? I always feel like Obi-Wan is heartbroken watching this, more heartbroken than scared.

I also think the Piano Theme would be a nice theme for the film, coming back at the end.

I like this best of the three, although I feel Anakin’s Dark Deeds is more fitting than the Vader/Qui-Gon funeral because it harkens back to Obi-Wan reflecting on what Anakin has become. To me the funeral music sounds more like a statement than a reflection.

WOW! There is A LOT to talk about lol. So glad to see HAL and Poppasketti here!!! I literally yelled with joy when I saw the two best editors around make an appearance 😉.

From my limited experience I think most of our perceived problems with the show stem from how characters are speaking/acting and subsequently affecting each scene. Although some small plot shifting will likely be necessary, I find that a “less is more” approach is always the best way to go when starting off. I am always very wary when a project starts changing/cutting large elements of the original story (even if we don’t necessarily like them). On the flip side take for instance Poppasketti’s edit of TLJ (Rekindled). Regardless of whether or not we would have liked a better product we don’t really have the resources (most of the time, looking at u Shamook) to make a completely different product feel as convincing as a billion dollar company’s. All of that to say, I humbly think we should focus on making the product as good as it can be, rather than changing it. Sorry if that was obvious to some, I just felt it should be said.

Below are a few points and my humble opinions on them.

• DARTH APPEARENCES

I agree with the idea to cut the scene between Reva and Darth while he’s on his throne. Serves little if any purpose for the story…DUH the inquisitors want to be promoted we get that from any of the previous scenes, Reva’s especially.

I like the idea of Darth sensing Obi wan because his necessity to save Leia! phenomenal idea there. With a bit more polishing and contribution from other editors this among many other edits might flow perfectly. I just wonder if it would flow better than an edited/improved end scene from the original.

• MUSIC CHANGES

With ALL the respect Anjohan, it seems you have your heart set on the introduction of Vader to be a heart wrenchingly sad scene. If you are going to pursue this direction, I would (humbly) recommend cutting off the “Anakin’s Dark Deeds” after Vader stops, and leaving things as is, if not (like others have said) mute the music to be pulled into the moment with obi wan further.

I appreciate the “burning Ani” theme (lol) while Obi is burning very poetic, the sudden burst of music when the shot is fired is a bit too jarring though and it might be best to leave that be.

• CONTINUITEY/EDITING

I am fully on board with keeping the two timelines during the fight more succinct. However in the current clip Obi travels from cutting the smoke pipe to being immediately grabbed by Darth in an unknown location. You’ll need at least an establishing shot so we know where they are after returning from Reva.

To be clear I think we should stay away from investing much time into edits that may be rendered useless later as we are only 3 ep in (i.e. Padme references, completely editing out ep 3 etc).

• LESS IS MORE

I think most of us can agree that Disney’s dialog/writing is treating everyone like children. As for the “LESS IS MORE” like I mentioned before, this is mostly regarding scenes with unnecessary dialog/camera shots. many of the lines by the Inquisitors can be cut as well as like you have already done cutting the useless 4th scene of obi cutting meat. Its a bit ridiculous that we have to rectify the editing in this show so as to not slap the audience with the most obvious dialog, but here we are.

All this to say, I think we should at least focus on making these characters feel like they belong in Star wars and not a fan film, before we start changing the way this story is told. Because its very possible to realize down the road, that after editing the dialog/camera shots, those scenes don’t really need to be cut. And if this is going to be for an audience outside of us fan edit aficionados preventing people from being pulled out of the movie/show with unnecessary cuts/edits is in my opinion our # 1 priority.

Anyway, sorry for the essay, I just want to see this show get what it deserves…in the good way. In the future I’ll focus more on adding specific ideas, lol.

CMMAP said:

Anjohan said:

But isn’t Anakin’s actions horrifying enough, and the sadness in the music just a representation of Obi-Wan’s feelings in that moment? I always feel like Obi-Wan is heartbroken watching this, more heartbroken than scared.

How this scene is shot and Obi-Wans facial expressions as well as his hastiness doesn´t fit sadness. It´s fear, in my opinion. That maybe subject to personal interpretation though.
How do other people think of this?

I would agree personally. I feel like it should be more slow menacing and horrifying. That being said if you do want to pursue the sadness angle it is possible but I think it will have to be far more subtle.

People are split. I think I might actually just leave the scene as is but with some of the Sith Whispers and add a subtle, unsettling ambience to the background, to truly play on the original tone of the scene. I coukd add a subtle dark deeds upon the initial walk towards Obi-Wan as well, almost like a shadowy whisper in the background, if requested, but for now this would be preferable for the overall purpose of this edit.

It is such a crucial moment in the series - the first time we see Vader back - that it is the moment most subject for fan edit flaws probably in the whole film/series because of it, and also definitely the scene most people have the strongest opinions about. Sometimes when people are mixed it might just be better to leave the scene as is, unless I would want to go radical (which I don’t, for this edit).

And for those who like the Piano Theme, it might find a better place later on.

I think to keep the edit feeling as organic as possible, leaving this very scene alone and perhaps playing with subtle nods to Dark Deeds later on when he is fighting Obi-Wan is the way to go.

Horror Version

https://streamable.com/y7ew0r

So as a response to my recent post and a suggestion from Hal9000, this is the recent update.

CMMAP said:

Anjohan said:

Horror Version

https://streamable.com/y7ew0r

So as a response to my recent post and a suggestion from Hal9000, this is the recent update.

Yeah you probably right leaving it mainly as it is for your goal and these divers opinions.
I like the subtle dark deeds. Only thing that stood our for me was, that the sith whispers at the beginning could be more in tone with those later in the scene (quieter).

Yeah, I think so. Good to hear - I’ll tone down some of the whispers for sure.

Axios said:

• DARTH APPEARENCES
  I like the idea of Darth sensing Obi wan because his necessity to save Leia! phenomenal idea there. With a bit more polishing and contribution from other editors this among many other edits might flow perfectly. I just wonder if it would flow better than an edited/improved end scene from the original.

In the edit so far it is far more ambigious if Obi-Wan know of Vader’s existence or not (the original does NOT sit well with me, and I hate the cliffhanger ending-approach to it), but it flows something like “Vader senses Kenobi using the force” -> “Reeva telling Obi-Wan on the platform Vader will be pleased” -> Obi-Wan has a softer reaction, although he looks to fear the name -> Then it proceeds to the other clip from the frontpage of this thread chronologically after. I think it works, but time will tell.

• MUSIC CHANGES

With ALL the respect Anjohan, it seems you have your heart set on the introduction of Vader to be a heart wrenchingly sad scene. If you are going to pursue this direction, I would (humbly) recommend cutting off the “Anakin’s Dark Deeds” after Vader stops, and leaving things as is, if not (like others have said) mute the music to be pulled into the moment with obi wan further.

No , I don’t. I have made several versions and want one that both I and the community feel most comfortable with and respect Vader’s re-introduction the most.

I think this new version (from right up above) might be more preferable.

I appreciate the “burning Ani” theme (lol) while Obi is burning very poetic, the sudden burst of music when the shot is fired is a bit too jarring though and it might be best to leave that be.

Yeah, I think it mirrors the scene from ROTS poetically. The scene is not volume adjusted properly as stated next to the link, so that will be better.

• CONTINUITEY/EDITING

I am fully on board with keeping the two timelines during the fight more succinct. However in the current clip Obi travels from cutting the smoke pipe to being immediately grabbed by Darth in an unknown location. You’ll need at least an establishing shot so we know where they are after returning from Reva.

I see your point. Added Obi-Wan running and Darh Vader keeping chase so as to clarify they have moved further away.

To be clear I think we should stay away from investing much time into edits that may be rendered useless later as we are only 3 ep in (i.e. Padme references, completely editing out ep 3 etc).

Although the full picture is as of yet not obvious, editing the episodes as they come out I find to be a great way to fine-tune the edit and deliver a much better fanedit in the end due to the great back-and-forth between all the community members that have their say on the different matters.

I think most of us can agree that Disney’s dialog/writing is treating everyone like children. As for the “LESS IS MORE” like I mentioned before, this is mostly regarding scenes with unnecessary dialog/camera shots. many of the lines by the Inquisitors can be cut as well as like you have already done cutting the useless 4th scene of obi cutting meat. Its a bit ridiculous that we have to rectify the editing in this show so as to not slap the audience with the most obvious dialog, but here we are.

Yes, unfortunfately.

All this to say, I think we should at least focus on making these characters feel like they belong in Star wars and not a fan film, before we start changing the way this story is told.

This is the reason the edit exist in the first place, to make it better fit within my (and many other’s) subjective opinions on what fits and doesn’t fit within the constraints of a Star Wars universe.

Many of us do for instance not like dumbded-down dialogue interactions, being spoon-fed information or cartoony villains. But some do and that is absolutely fine and then this edit is definitely not for them.

Anyway, sorry for the essay, I just want to see this show get what it deserves…in the good way. In the future I’ll focus more on adding specific ideas, lol.

Nothing to apologize for. Honest and hard opinions is what makes us all understand the intricacies of filmmaking and the Star Wars universe as a whole and have better discussions and therefore better fanedits.

For example, It’s always annoying wasting six hours creating eight different versions of the same scene only to realize it is not fully what people want. But if it makes the final attempt at the scene an improved one or at least one that gives emotional resonance then it is all worth.