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Post #1479877

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What do you think of the Sequel Trilogy? - a general discussion thread
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Date created
13-Apr-2022, 10:00 PM
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13-Apr-2022, 10:14 PM
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AspiringCreator said:

Stardust1138 said:

JadedSkywalker said:

I liked the aspect of the force being more democratic and mysterious and its choosing a neophyte no one to restore the balance. I liked that Last Jedi basically made the whole mutant inherited bloodline thing, irrelevant. Only for Rise to make Rey a Palpatine and undo the idea of Star Wars going back to the style of a the original where Luke was a no one, who had the courage to leave Tatooine and confront the Empire. Originally Luke was a brave kid who went on an adventure he wasn’t the son of a super-villain/mutant with the most mitochondrial DNA or midichlorians whatsits in existence to some prophecy. Its undermines the force and free will. Its junk.

The thing is George never said the Force was exclusive to bloodlines. I think what he says about is just the opposite from how both J.J. and Rian took it to mean.

He said:

"A lot of people get confused about the Force. They see it as some special thing that you can find and pick up and put it on your head and suddenly you have the Force. Whereas it’s always been designed so that every [living] being has the Force.

The amount of Force, which is like talent or intelligence, is different in every person. Some of it is inherited, but it’s no more than a talent. It’s not something you can acquire – it’s something you can learn to use. I have the power to lift that cup off the table using the Force, but I can’t do it unless I have been trained to do it."

And with the Whills. They tie into the idea of free will and destiny:

“The Whills are a microscopic, single-celled lifeform like amoeba, fungi, and bacteria. There’s something like 100.000 times more Whills than there are Midi-Chlorians, and there are about 10.000 times more Midi-Chlorians than there are human cells. The only microscopic entities that can go into the human cells are the Midi-Chlorians. They are born in the cells. The Midi-Chlorians provide the energy for human cells to split and create life. The Whills are single-celled animals that feed on the Force. The more of the Force there is, the better off they are. So they have a very intense symbiotic relationship with the Midi-Chlorians and the Midi-Chlorians effectively work for the Whills. It is estimated that we have 100 trillion microbes in our body and we are made up of about 90% bacteria and 10% human cells. So who is in service to whom?”

The reason we follow the Skywalker family isn’t because they’re more important than others who can also use the Force but because the saga was about Anakin and his family. Anakin and his family just had a greater destiny akin to God in a general sense. Some have greater destinies than others and it’s also your choice on if we want to act on it or ignore the call to something greater. Fate has a way a stopping in where it’s needed.

The argument I’d have here is that while George’s sentiment is nice as it’s a way of showing the inclusion of Midichlorians doesn’t mess with the Force and that it’s still ultimately about how everyone has the Force and the potential to use it? That doesn’t really matter here. While your reading is still absolutely valid, the prequels as they change the context of the OT and arguably what one sees maybe from the old EU makes this into a matter where it really feels like being strong in the Force requires you to be a part of a bloodline. Looking back at the OT, part of the appeal to me of the Force is that while in this moment we see Luke is the hero and that he’s learning the ways of the Force? He’s also an everyman and we hear it flows through every living being so you get the idea that you don’t have to be a Skywalker or a Kenobi or whoever to be a hero, the Force flows through everyone therefore everyone has the potential, some might have a bigger headstart on it than others but anyone can learn to use it.

The PT then made Anakin the Chosen One, a child born from a virgin birth that apparently was caused by manipulating Midichlorians and because of the framing of the movies, it’s more based on being born into that bloodline and the Skywalkers suddenly become the only family that really matters to this massive galaxy for almost every single issue revolves around them. Sure one can say it doesn’t matter and that it’s just this is the family the movies follow but the movies still have that kind of framing and later stories keep up with this. For being a galaxy from a long time ago, this universe feels tiny and the Force becomes more like inherited superpowers. Now of course that’s just how I personally read it from spending time with the universe and if you like that aspect then more power to you. But I’ve just got to say that I don’t really care what George says in this instance. Word of God can only go so far and considering how the movies portray it? It’s why I’m more grateful for movies like TLJ bucking that trend and bringing things to being more like the OT while still attempting to show respect to the PT because with how the movies and other portions of the saga framed things? It really felt like it was more about the bloodlines and not about someone in a sea of nobodies rising up and choosing to become someone.

I appreciate your read on things but I see the opposite. I actually like The Last Jedi in an alternate universe sort of way for the most part. However I think one thing it gets wrong is making Rey a “Nobody”. We’ve seen Nobodies use the Force and be Jedi before. The entire Jedi Order and arguably younglings are a bunch of nobodies. The stories just tended to keep the narrative focus on Anakin and his family. This isn’t shrinking the universe but instead I find making it so we are following one generation at a time of the same family and how the consequences of what is just as external to each era make up the reality of the era afterwards until the cycle closes. Much like how real life works. Luke still begins his journey through humble origins and goes through the motions of learning of his greater destiny as he did before the Prequels reframed it in certain ways. The only difference is we know Darth Vader already is his father when we get to his journey but arguably the story of the Originals was recontextualised to make it just as much his story as it is Luke’s and later Leia and her children. I still believe in the notion of anyone can be a Jedi but it’s a hard life and not a simple magic trick as The Force Awakens likes to present it as being. Being able to use the Force is one thing but picking up on Jedi Mind Tricks or Force Pull without any training feels like it’s compromising the principles of how being a Jedi is different from being a regular hero like Luke was in the Rebel Alliance or when Anakin won the podrace. Both scenarios are heroism but a Jedi is a different kind of hero.