The Clone Wars: Refocused [COMPLETE] + Subtitles for season one! — Page 70

Thoughts on Malevolence:

I think we should see the Malevolence fire its super weapon. I know previously in the thread you said you weren’t a fan, but without seeing why it’s so dangerous it comes off as a bit of “what’s the big deal?” It’d be like if we never saw the Death Star fire its laser in ANH. Cutting it like you did makes the opening sequence have a number of awkward cuts. Honestly the opening of the original episode is one of the strongest parts, and I’d say leave it in.

When Grievous comments on the Jedi’s weakness for caring for their troops, it’s unclear what he’s referring to without context.

The start of Anakin and Ahsoka’s conversation feels very odd, and you can tell it begins mid-sentence

The cut to when Plo-Koon starts talking in the escape pod at 5:11 feels very abrupt. Going from him speaking to a brief shot of the clone, and then immediately back to him but from a different angle is very jarring.

The cut at 6:30 is very abrupt

The cut at 10:09 is very abrupt

Without any dialog about dwindling oxygen, it is unclear why they are just hanging out outside of their pod

The cut to Anakin at 21:56 feels sudden

Similarly to the first note, I think we should see the ion cannon actually fire. Especially since a bit later we establish that it is an ion cannon and not just lasers, the absence is noticeable.

The sudden cut at 24:45 from “I think we have a problem” to Grievous immediately jumping into an escape ship ends up being a lot more comedic than I think was intentional. I know this is the result of cutting out a huge section of the third episode, but I think it feels awkward. I’d almost say just cut the entire sequence of them chasing Grievous and leave it at him retreating to Separatist space, then transition to Anakin and Ahsoka in the hangar.

Thoughts on The New Padawan:

I’m surprised at how well the new intro works. It drops you right into it with little setup, but it actually reminds me a bit of how episodes V and VI begin

The cut at 3:19 coupled with the newly dubbed audio feels awkward

It’s odd that Ventress explicitly addresses Anakin, but Obi-Wan responds

There’s a very weird sound effect that plays at 4:32 for just a split second

It’s unclear how we got from where the ventress fight left off to where we pick it back up again at 4:36.

It feels noticeable that there are chunks of Ventress’ dialog missing. I know you were trying to cut out references to the betrayal plotline, but I don’t know if this half measure works.

The tonal shift at 5:55 is jarring. We go from ominous threat after a narrow escape to a cheerful walk down the walkway. An establishing shot to ease us into the new scene might help

Without the first part of the sentence, Obi-Wan’s delivery of his line at 18:41 is weird. I would actually end the episode at 18:40 as Ahsoka and Anakin’s ship takes off

It almost feels like Ahsoka is interrupting Yoda at 18:08

Thoughts on The Duchess of Mandalore:

Obi-Wan’s panic in the line “Satine look out!” at 15:03 feels misplaced given that we never really see her in much danger, not to mention the fact that the line doesn’t sound like it’s coming from someone actively engaged in a fist fight. I would cut it entirely.

The elevator ride is odd now for two reasons: First, Satine appears to be disheveled/exhausted despite the fact that in this cut she didn’t do anything. Second, Obi-Wan’s line about almost being killed feels like an overreaction to a quick fist fight.

I know the James Bond-esque conveyer belt scene is cheesy, but I think a lot is lost by removing it.

Without the tiny spider-bots, it’s unclear why Merrik blows his cover. The abduction feels sudden given that the audience up until that point has no idea that he’s evil. If you already know the plot of the episode it’s maybe not as bad because you’re waiting for the other shoe to drop, but as a standalone story, you need a proper reveal. Also personally I quite enjoyed the scene of Obi-Wan “testing” all the suspects.

Dude of course he is going to think of something about your thoughts

Thoughts about the politics of war

In Senator Amidala’s important line , you must ask the Jedi council to speak with chancellor palpatine about this matter. By the fact that the war can escalate by what comes in their way. Therefore, Master Skywalker says Don’t get me involved in this/that’s not my role Padme as its doesn’t the great deal to escalate the war as both of those line could be cut as it doesn’t have to do with this.

and other thing that has to do with the corruption of the separatists is that Master Anakin Skywalker normally said that let me get this straight, they seperatist belive they were corrupt but they’re wrong that is the reason why we have to restore order. Another reason the line Maybe talking to the Jedi council isn’t the role for you after all is that it doesn’t get anywhere near this plot as it would be a cut line.

As we all know that Senator Amidala knows that they need to end this bill as Teckla Minau is one of her aids who were doing what was rights.

I would rather by a Master e.g( Anakin Skywalker) than a Senator who has an aid as a preposition to what it has to do with politics. As Politics isn’t everything as they’re number of resources around the world (For Business and Profit).

I thought I’d expand upon my thoughts for the feedback you replied to

• Should we see the Malevolence fire? I’ve always been against it because I don’t like the effect (and it’s a strong enough ship if we just assume it has EMPs plus heavy laser cannons) but perhaps I’d include it once at some point.

The cut as it stands still has direct reference to the “ion cannon” and at the climax we see the weapon about to fire, so it’s clear to the audience that there is something that we weren’t seeing before. Constantly discussing a “super weapon” and then just seeing it use tiny blasters creates a dissonance.

• What do we think about the Ventress line in New Padawan referencing her past with Anakin? It’s not perfect lipsync but I borrowed this idea directly from Smudger because I thought it referenced their past nicely.

I really like the idea of adding the Anakin line, it just creates the issues I listed before. Having a camera angle change mid-sentence is very odd, and Obi-Wan’s response makes less sense. If you’re going to keep the Anakin line, I might recommend cutting Obi-Wan’s line and, if possible, finding a new place to put it (maybe when she’s creeping up on them?)

• Is the cost of having a slightly janky arrival of Satine worth the benefit of cutting the Mandalorian Bond Villain device?

This is a general note, and applies to the ion cannon discussion as well: I think it’s better to include a less-than-stellar sequence or bit of dialog than to be forced to cut it in such a way that makes the seams noticeable. The latter makes the final result feel too much like a fan-edit as opposed to a genuine alternative version of the episode (which I’m sure is the goal.) You don’t want to throw the baby out with the bath water.

I can try to give more constructive ideas when I watch more of the original episodes so that I can present alternatives to the noticeable cuts, but these were just my thoughts as I watched the episodes.

I like the Malevolence as it is in the current edit. I think the biggest problem was the constant buildup of it as a mystery ship. You’ve already reduced that angle in 2.0.

I agree that the less Ventress talks in New Padawan the better. It bugs me to no end how often these characters know one another by name when we’ve never seen them interact or have only fought each other in fighters etc.

EddieDean said:

• What do we think about the Ventress line in New Padawan referencing her past with Anakin? It’s not perfect lipsync but I borrowed this idea directly from Smudger because I thought it referenced their past nicely.

I thought it sounded quite odd as well tbh. I know that it’s in reference to the 2D episode, but it just took me out of it when I watched the episode.

The 2D episode is getting retconned soon anyway, with the novel Star Wars: Brotherhood promising the first canon meet-up between Kenobi and Ventress, possibly Anakin and Ventress too.

Not that I don’t appreciate the effort you put into it, the way you have it now is probably as good as you could make that change work.

Here are my previous comments with more constructive feedback on how to improve the issues:

Malevolence:

I think we should see the Malevolence fire its super weapon. I know previously in the thread you said you weren’t a fan, but without seeing why it’s so dangerous it comes off as a bit of “what’s the big deal?” It’d be like if we never saw the Death Star fire its laser in ANH. Cutting it like you did makes the opening sequence have a number of awkward cuts. Honestly the opening of the original episode is one of the strongest parts, and I’d say leave it in.

When Grievous comments on the Jedi’s weakness for caring for their troops, it’s unclear what he’s referring to without context.

The start of Anakin and Ahsoka’s conversation feels very odd, and you can tell it begins mid-sentence

Similarly to the first note, I think we should see the ion cannon actually fire. Especially since a bit later we establish that it is an ion cannon and not just lasers, the absence is noticeable.

All of these issues can be resolved by restoring the original opening to the episode as well as the subsequent firing at the med bay

The cut to when Plo-Koon starts talking in the escape pod at 5:11 feels very abrupt. Going from him speaking to a brief shot of the clone, and then immediately back to him but from a different angle is very jarring.

I would restore the clone’s dialog. Not only does it solve the awkward cut, but the line about how the clones see themselves as expendable is a good pathos building moment. In fact, after going back and reviewing the original episode, I would restore the dialog between the clones and Plo-Koon wherever possible. The aspect of the show is a major theme that will be returned to multiple times, and this early episode is a good spot to establish it. I don’t see why it was cut.

The cut at 6:30 is very abrupt

I can see why you wanted to drop the “they told me this ship was fast” line. It’s… not good. However, correct me if I’m wrong, but I think the original scene holds for just a second longer than what you have here. I think just extending that this little bit would do a lot to not make it seem like the wipe transition is interrupting him.

The cut at 10:09 is very abrupt

This isn’t even your cut. My bad, ignore this point.

Without any dialog about dwindling oxygen, it is unclear why they are just hanging out outside of their pod

As before, I would restore Plo-Koon/clone dialog wherever possible because not only does it help with removing unnecessary cuts, but it serves as the thematic core of the episode.

The cut to Anakin at 21:56 feels sudden

In the original episode, there is an establishing shot of Anakin’s Y-Wing before cutting to his dialog. I think this should be restored.

The sudden cut at 24:45 from “I think we have a problem” to Grievous immediately jumping into an escape ship ends up being a lot more comedic than I think was intentional. I know this is the result of cutting out a huge section of the third episode, but I think it feels awkward. I’d almost say just cut the entire sequence of them chasing Grievous and leave it at him retreating to Separatist space, then transition to Anakin and Ahsoka in the hangar.

I realize on second thought that you can’t just leave it at the retreat, because the plot of the episode is about destroying the Death Star Malevolence. This one is probably the toughest to deal with because the original shot was not him comedically running away, but running to his fighter to engage. However you can’t really have him fight with Anakin without reintroducing the whole plot of Destroy Malevolence (I agree the stuff inside the ship is not very good.) I think what I would suggest here would be to just leave the brief shot of Grievous entering his ship, instead of having him physically run away. It’s a small change but I think it would make a difference.

New Padawan:

The cut at 3:19 coupled with the newly dubbed audio feels awkward

It’s odd that Ventress explicitly addresses Anakin, but Obi-Wan responds

There are two bits of dubbed dialog here: “Master Skywalker” and “I’ve been so lookin forward to another encounter with you.” I would move the former to when she is stalking the two of them off-screen and the camera is on Anakin (3:06), and the latter to when she is running up the stair, as opposed to trying to sort of make it line up with her lip movements for the original dialog (3:18). Then I would cut Obi-Wan’s response entirely.

There’s a very weird sound effect that plays at 4:32 for just a split second

This is a straight forward change. I’m pretty certain it’s just an overlooked artifact from the previous scene transition.

It’s unclear how we got from where the ventress fight left off to where we pick it back up again at 4:36.

The original episode has an establishing shot of them entering the library and her falling to the ground, which you’ve cut. I assume this is because it’s a bit silly that she starts throwing books at them, but I think it’s worth it to keep that sequence to establish a clear continuity (which I believe is very important in making it not feel like a fan-edit.)

It feels noticeable that there are chunks of Ventress’ dialog missing. I know you were trying to cut out references to the betrayal plotline, but I don’t know if this half measure works.

I realized I didn’t include a timestamp, so to be clear I’m talking about the encounter that starts at 4:50. I would replace the new “You’ve served your purpose” with the original “Really?” It fits better with the flow of the conversation.

The tonal shift at 5:55 is jarring. We go from ominous threat after a narrow escape to a cheerful walk down the walkway. An establishing shot to ease us into the new scene might help

Unfortunately I couldn’t find an appropriate establishing shot from the movie that would fix the tonal shift problem.

It almost feels like Ahsoka is interrupting Yoda at 18:08

I think this is caused by the fact that the camera lingers on Yoda, and Ahsoka starts talking while his mouth is opening (making it appear that he’s about to say something else.) I noticed that this is another line that was redubbed over other visuals (which is easier with Yoda because his mouth moves like a muppet, appropriately), so I would maybe try playing around with cutting from Yoda to Ahsoka on a different frame. Perhaps a second earlier so that the camera is on her when she starts talking and we don’t have that lingering on Yoda. However if you do want to linger, try to find a different shot.

Without the first part of the sentence, Obi-Wan’s delivery of his line at 18:41 is weird. I would actually end the episode at 18:40 as Ahsoka and Anakin’s ship takes off

I stand by 18:40 being the better stopping point for the episode

Thoughts on The Duchess of Mandalore

Obi-Wan’s panic in the line “Satine look out!” at 15:03 feels misplaced given that we never really see her in much danger, not to mention the fact that the line doesn’t sound like it’s coming from someone actively engaged in a fist fight. I would cut it entirely.

The elevator ride is odd now for two reasons: First, Satine appears to be disheveled/exhausted despite the fact that in this cut she didn’t do anything. Second, Obi-Wan’s line about almost being killed feels like an overreaction to a quick fist fight.

I know the James Bond-esque conveyer belt scene is cheesy, but I think a lot is lost by removing it.

All of the above is fixed by re-adding the admittedly silly conveyer belt scene

Without the tiny spider-bots, it’s unclear why Merrik blows his cover. The abduction feels sudden given that the audience up until that point has no idea that he’s evil. If you already know the plot of the episode it’s maybe not as bad because you’re waiting for the other shoe to drop, but as a standalone story, you need a proper reveal. Also personally I quite enjoyed the scene of Obi-Wan “testing” all the suspects.

Again, I would re-introduce at least some of the small spider-bots, especially since they end up serving a plot functionality. The reveal works a lot better with Merrick being exposed than him just dropping his cover for no real reason.

He drops his cover in order to kidnap Satine, aided by the distraction of the spider droid and the coming Separatist boarding droids. It’s not clear what he had planned beyond that, but it doesn’t seem slipshod to me.

A lot of the Plo’koon and clone dialogue was also pretty redundant - same topics and sentiments being repeated, not much dimension being added each time. I personally prefer more cuts if it means more concentrated substance.

I understand the logic of why Merrick drops his cover in the new edit, but I still think it feels too sudden to a first time viewer. The way his line is delivered, it definitely doesn’t feel like the big reveal moment that it now has to act as. It’s almost a blink-and-you-miss-it “wait, he’s a bad guy now?” It also creates a blocking continuity error, because we see Satine between Obi-Wan and the window in one shot, but in the next shot she is by the door with Merrick; there is no explanation as to how she was taken past Obi-Wan.

I agree that some of it was redundant, and maybe you shouldn’t add all of it back, but I would definitely be more conservative with which parts get cut, especially when it creates awkward cut transitions like at 5:11, and also contextual information like the fact that their oxygen is dwindling (which makes the scene of them waiting outside the pod make more sense).

Assassin

I would consider re-adding at least parts of the scene where Ventress is planting the bombs so that it’s clearer what happened when she triggers them. I assume that it was cut because of the silliness with the droid, but I think it can be added with that aspect of it reduced substantially if not entirely avoided.

I see what you’re doing by dubbing the “It’s so hard to know who to trust these days, isn’t it?” from Hidden Enemy at 15:33, but I think it’s a too noticeable. The calm, collected tone also conflicts with her shout of rage just a second later.

As someone else who couldn’t make it through vanilla Clone Wars, I highly recommend these edits as a way to enjoy what the series offers.

Well look at my thought of politics of war, is my thoughts so bad.

Thoughts on the 501st Legion:

I was very interested in this episode, because it was the first one where you said you implemented significant changes to the narrative structure, which can be very tricky

Part 1

I think the intro struggles to properly introduce the viewer to the characters. In the first minute we get two separate conversations with characters whom we have no idea who they are. The opening few minutes of the original episode, in addition to opening with an exciting action sequence, does a lot of expository work in terms of setting the stage for who everyone is and what their goals are. It’s also harder to sympathize with Echo and Fives when they go to speak with Shaak Ti because other than an extremely brief conversation with an unnamed authority figure we don’t know saying they’re doing poorly, we can hardly identify with their difficulties. Contrast this with the original episode, which by this point had led the viewer to see the struggles they face, and understand the stress that they are under. I would strongly recommend restoring the original ordering of scenes so that the initial, failed drill takes place before they are reprimanded (also leave in the MC’s introductory exposition)

Heavy’s conversation with 99 feels out of place, given that its narrative purpose is to tell him not to abandon his teammates and embrace who he is. In this new cut, we don’t see his confrontation with the MC (the low point to his internal struggle that the 99 conversation resolves) and we don’t see him ultimately overcome his struggle by embracing his nickname and triumphing by working with his brothers. The conversation with 99 itself is a very awkward way to end the prologue just before a time skip that seemingly drops all the conflict established in what remains of the episode. Additionally, Heavy’s triumph in this episode gives more tragedy to his sacrifice in the next episode.

I understand that the above changes were because you wanted to make the episode serve as an introduction to the new, longer edit, but I think it just takes too much twisting and stretching of the existing material to make work. I don’t think it is necessary to make it so that they ultimately fail in order to get posted at Rishi, as getting a shit posting as your first deployment is just how the military works. In fact, considering they had been threatened with being labelled a “bad batch” if they didn’t shape up, the implication that they never got better means they shouldn’t have been deployed at all (and certainly not at a mission-critical forward base)

part 2

The audio mixing for the “Sarge!” at 11:53 feels off. The fact that the volume drops so suddenly and noticeably feels less like it’s a result of the clone turning away, and more like he’s just lowering his voice. At first I thought that you had dubbed this in, but I checked and saw that it existed in the original episode and sounds fine there. I don’t know what was changed here that caused this issue.

I’m not sure how I feel about the change to the conversation at 13:17. I assume you wanted to drop the cheesy reference to the famous Han Solo scene from ANH, but what’s left makes it look like the “clone” answered the call and then immediately hung up, which doesn’t make much sense.

I don’t think you need to reintroduce the whole eel fight sequence, but I would keep the shot of the clone escapees walking along the cliffside pointing out Rex and Cody’s ship (starts at around 8:17 of the original episode). It makes the later flare scene work a lot better imo if we at least know that they are outside, since up until then we only see them entering the vents.

part 3

Without a time skip between the events of Rookies and this episode, it’s unclear why Fives and Echo are with the 501st, or why they have new armor. Also, the fact that it’s only been about “2 weeks” since they were cadets means that it doesn’t really feel like much of a reunion

I think 99 not having heavy’s medal is another good aspect of the episode that is lost by not having the triumph at the end of their training. It also makes 99’s dialog feel a bit choppy at the end when you have to cut around it

Without at least some of Obi-Wan’s underwater adventure, it comes as an unexplained surprise when we suddenly see Anakin on the surface, as Obi-Wan never told him to come down.

Thoughts on Resistance on Ryloth

This was another episode I was very curious to watch because you said that you had dramatically changed the story.

The opening is kind of disorienting. This is a general note for the whole series whenever you remove any exposition, but I think that it is important to not rely on the opening text to inform the viewer as to what is going on, and still have the episode itself properly explain everything. The vast majority of viewers just kind of zone out for the opening crawls of Star Wars movies, and they serve as context rather than important exposition. If you closed your eyes at the beginning of the ANH title crawl, you would still be able to easily follow the movie.

1:56 We cut from blobby watching Mace advancing on the city on foot to Mace standing inside discussing plans. This is confusing because without the context of seeing Mace being forced out of the AT-TE in an assault that we see in the original episode, the viewer is left wondering why he was just walking outside for seemingly no reason. Additionally, Mace’s “we’re going to need help to take the city” line feels very strange by itself without the rest of the conversation he is having with the trooper.

3:12 the “they won’t breach the blockade” dub is very noticeable. The audio mixing does not seem to include any of the distortion from the hologram that the other characters like Palpy seem to have. The conversation itself also seems very strange with its inclusion. Mace is clearly indicating that the way to win the fight is to recruit the resistance, but then the audience is implicitly told “actually no, that’s not what’s important right now. We’re going to focus the next 10 minutes on the blockade that was only briefly brought up as a secondary consideration.” There is a conflict as to what the driving force of the narrative is.

13:13 Mace’s line about postponing the invasion is very odd in the new chronology where he is already advancing on the city. In the previous zoom call, Mace had all but dismissed the reinforcements idea to focus entirely on the resistance fighters (because in the original episode it was made clear that reinforcements simply weren’t an option). To now have him say that they can’t do anything until the blockade is broken feels contradictory.

19:12 The cut from a gesture of good will to the ominous fleet feels very jarring. It almost feels intentionally ironic, which I don’t think is the case.

24:42 Mace’s urgent and specific order for Anakin to destroy the bombers is strange considering that he supposedly hasn’t even gotten close to getting past the blockade (it’d be like telling allied forces to start taking out artillery in Berlin when D-Day hasn’t even happened yet)

I’ve noticed this a few times, but it really stood out to me here: most Clone Wars episodes end on a celebratory note, so to have it go from that to the sad, melancholy music you use for the end credits (as opposed to the original episodes’ fanfare) feels very off.

Ultimately I think splicing the two episodes creates confusion more than anything else, and the conversations that the characters have don’t make much sense given the context of what is going on in the other plot line. The narrative driving force gets muddied and it feels unclear what the characters are working towards as what needs to happen to win.

I think a lot is lost by leaving out Innocents of Ryloth entirely. In the original Ryloth trilogy, it created a very clear bridge in the invasion progression of “reach the planet”->“establish a military presence”->“take the capital.” I feel that that structure creates more building action that feels that the heroes are getting tangibly close to their goal at every step. I definitely think that some of the babysitting plotline and droid hijinks can be pared down, but the episode also has some of the emotional highlights of the entire episode trilogy that are sorely missed by its total omission.

I hope my long posts of feedback don’t come off as too negatively critical. I think a lot of what you’ve done is extremely admirable and impressive, I just think there are times where the cuts/changes can be overly aggressive such that the seams become noticeable. I think this project can very well become a genuinely ideal alternative to the originals.

Thoughts on The Death Watch:

Ahsoka being punished for Ryloth as opposed to the incident on Felucia doesn’t feel like it makes a lot of sense. Instead of being reprimanded for acting out of line that led to disaster, it’s for being decisive as the acting senior officer (like she was instructed to do) which led to a victory? I also don’t think the addition of this scene is at all necessary given that there’s no reason for her to be present anyways in what is a personal mission for Obi-Wan. In terms of narrative cohesion, it doesn’t feel great to devote the opening scene of the episode to just explaining why a character isn’t present (as opposed to in the original episode where the opening scenes put Ahsoka into place for a role she would play in the story.)

Thoughts on Children of Night:

13:32 I know I’m usually one calling for more establishing shots, but I think here it’s actually unnecessary. Since the immediately preceding shot is one of the mother alluding to her revenge, I think that an immediate cut to her call with Dooku would create a smoother transition. It’s almost not even a new scene.

I’m not sure if I agree with the decision to remove the assassination attempt. You mention in your notes that you don’t like adding new “force powers”, but I actually think that this is a fairly explicit example of magic separate from the force that the sisters have access to. It establishes that they have some sort of mysterious abilities totally distinct from what we see in the Jedi/Sith. You say that it just returns to the status quo, which is a little true, but the mother reveals that it is part of a larger plan to make Dooku feel uneasy and vulnerable, thereby necessitating a new assassin. Also, as you point out, it’s just a really fun sequence to watch.

Similarly, I don’t know if cutting the first two challenges is an improvement. It’s a good sequence of events that also highlight how sadistic Ventress is, and how the two brothers were all that remained of a grueling crucible (plus “let the game begin” isn’t a phrase people say and sounds awkward, as is having a second character say “begin” immediately after she does)

49:50 I was about to comment that this cut from one angle to another on the same speaker during the same sentence is distracting, but that’s on Giancarlo Volpe, not you.

Overall I think my commentary on this is similar to the other fan-favorite episodes: it’s better to use a scalpel than a axe. You don’t need to fix what isn’t broken.