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Post #1439845

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I abhor the "X undoes Y's accomplishments" criticism so much.
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14-Jul-2021, 10:19 PM

And yet it allowed the Resistance to destroy Starkiller.

He had already lowered the shields. Confronting Kylo was completely unnecessary to that.

Dude, the literal reason she sent Ben to Luke was because she saw him as another Vader. She overcomes this when training Rey, whom she knew as Palps’ grandkid.

This is never said in the movies.

Ben also felt betrayed by Han and Luke, as established in TFA and TLJ, respectively.

You know what I was saying about how the ST made the OT heroes into bad people and failures? This is partly why. Leia, Han, and Luke apparently did such a terrible job of raising Ben that he sees himself as a victim of their mistreatment. ST Luke and ST Han are horrible people.

Ben is making up for his mistakes and loves Rey. He had no idea resurrecting her would kill him. By your logic, Vader had no agency when saving Luke from Palps.

Except Anakin killed Palpatine, thereby saving the galaxy and destroying the Sith. Kylo didn’t do squat except give Palpatine access to that precious Force Dyad, then revive Rey. He could have been completely removed from the climax of the film.


Because there’s no rhyme or reason to what happened on Crait from an observer’s perspective. Kylo swings his saber at Luke for a while. Luke dodges. Luke turns out to be an apparition or something, then vanishes. And most people won’t even know that Luke died, so it’s barely even an heroic act, from their perspective. It would just be seen as strange by most people.

To undermine him and mock him. It’s like kids mocking their parents behind their backs.

Wow, what an intimidating faction. I can totally take them seriously as villains.


And the galaxy’s freaking huge! A shipful of people can’t spread a story like that across thousands of planets. The scale of this world is simply too enormous for that to happen.

Again, the FO is not doing well. And we literally see them standing up at the end of TROS.

You keep saying they’re not doing well, yet have no real evidence for it. And what took those people so long to stand up? Why did they ignore the call for help on Crait?


The Resistance is freaking boring, dude. And the new characters are flat and poorly written. It’s as simple as that.

Han NEVER abandoned his family.

What movie were you watching? Han and Leia are basically divorced, and Han left Leia to go off and play at being a smuggler again, while she was left alone to fight off their son’s regime with her tiny army. Luke had just abandoned her, then Han abandoned her too, when she needed support the most. Han. Abandoned. His family.

Again, it allowed the Resistance to destroy Starkiller. D’Qar would’ve been destroyed had it not been for Han.

He had already done that. Facing Kylo was needless for that goal.

And his actions inspired the galaxy anyway.

At no point is it said that the fleet attacking Exegol was there because they were “inspired by Luke.” That’s just conjecture on your part.

The Trade Federation in TPM and the Separatists pre-clones in AOTC say otherwise.

The Trade Federation was still considered a legitimate business within the Republic during TPM. And as soon as the CIS was formed, the question of forming an army to counter them was quickly raised. Because of the emergency nature of the situation, it made sense to use a clone army that had already been produced rather than raising one manually from member planets. The whole point of Palpatine engineering the founding of the CIS was to place the Republic in a no-win situation, where they had to militarize, but in doing so, they accepted the Clone Army, which was created under shady circumstances and ultimately answered only to Palpatine. That was the source of the downfall. Having a recruited self-defense force is not comparable to that.

THAT undermines the PT. And THAT’S no longer canon, too.

And Snap Wexley’s fart wedding is canon. I don’t give a damn about what Lucasfilm says is canon anymore. And neither should you, honestly.

And no, it doesn’t undermine the PT when there’s a freaking Sith Empire that controls half the galaxy, and is actively trying to control all of it. Something like that wouldn’t have been possible during the time of TPM. Which is why the Separatist Crisis was such a big deal. Because there had been a thousand years of peace.

Dude, Palpatine has NO OTHER CLONES BY TROS, and Rey killed him for good but NOT IN HATRED. And if they DO bring him back post-TROS, it WOULD undermine Rey’s arc (that’s fo’ anotha’ discussion, too). Lucasfilm wouldn’t want to do that.

As far as we know, Palpatine doesn’t need a clone, just any new body. And how do we know he doesn’t have another secret clone planet somewhere else?

Anakin killed Palpatine out of love for his son. Shouldn’t that have been enough, then?

Oh, of course. God forbid we undermine Rey’s arc. Undermining Anakin’s and Luke’s arcs is totally fine, though.

Dude, “cheat death” refers to keeping yourself alive. Look it up. And he CAN’T be referring to Anakin wanting to save Padme. Otherwise Anakin would be upset that Palps lied to him about knowing how to save Padme.

Let’s revisit the scene:

“Just help me save Padme’s life. I can’t live without her.”

“To cheat death is a power only one has achieved, but if we work together, I know we can discover the secret.”

He’s CLEARLY talking about cheating Padme’s death. And yeah, Anakin should have been mad at Palpatine for misleading him about it, but no one said the dialogue in RotS was perfect.

And Palpatine obviously isn’t referring to himself here when he mentions the “only one,” so by process of elimination, he’s talking about Plagueis. That’s the only person he could be referring to.