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The Rise of Skywalker: Ascendant (Released) — Page 383

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That’s exactly what I meant Hal. Terrio literally uses that word in his paragraph, although in the past tense (“leave it to debate about at which point they became this dyad in the Force”)

I believe what he is saying is that Palpatine authorized Snoke to create a mind link, however it spiraled out of control because of the dyad. Palpatine was not aware of that part. It’s simply up to interpretation when the dyad side of things started. Again, my personal theory is the interrogation scene, but arguably you could go back even further than that.

So, according to that logic, the Skype calls are not a part of the dyad, they only helped it grow. Not sure how I feel about that, but alright.

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Intersting … Oye. What a mess. It could have been easily cleared up if Kylo elaborated just a sentence or two about it when he revealed the “dyad stuff.” Like, something on the lines of “When Snoke/Palpy linked our minds, they unknowingly awoken/something something/ our dyadness and have no idea what we can do” or something on those lines.

Sigh.

Especially if the Skype calls were not part of it … but can move physical things in space … because … their minds linked? Like if I am connected to a friend on the phone from my house to his, he can “hand me” his pen … because you know … we are connected.

“Because you are a PalpaWalker?”

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That is a perfect line, jarbear. Would have been perfect, that is. RIP.

https://streamable.com/uorkfi

Just listened to sherlock’s clip on my computer and yet again I’m mostly content with it. It’s the same quality as “You were right” imo.

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jarbear said:

Especially if the Skype calls were not part of it … but can move physical things in space … because … their minds linked? Like if I am connected to a friend on the phone from my house to his, he can “hand me” his pen … because you know … we are connected.

Yeah I believe what they’re suggesting is that part of the Skype calls is their dyad, while everything else is a mind link. I’m still leaning more towards removing Snoke’s involvement, but I’m gonna think about it for a bit.

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Jar Jar Bricks said:

Holy shit guys:

"That really helped us in thinking about Rey and Kylo Ren, which is to say that we wanted to elaborate on the idea that Snoke bridged their minds in ‘The Last Jedi.’ But what we wanted to say is that there’s something deeper there, and leave it to debate about at which point they became this dyad in the Force, where they were really two, or were they one, whether that was a mistake that Palpatine made by bridging them and therefore creating this thing. But regardless, their relationship is extremely interesting and complicated, and it was one of the things that J.J. and I loved about ‘The Last Jedi’ that we luckily inherited and could build.”

Straight from the horse’s mouth (Chris Terrio).

Seems I was right that the ‘mind brigde’ and the ‘dyad’ are supposed to be two different things, but more importatly, seems we were right that not even they had any idea what they were trying to do, leaving all major plot points up “to debate” lol.

Also sherlockpotter’s clip sounds pretty seamless to me too.

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This … kinda makes me mad.

The end of a Saga, the last movie of a “connected” series (9 movies in total) should answer questions at the end … not leave more questions…

“Because you are a PalpaWalker?”

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They leave it up to debate because they realize that their dyad idea is contradicted by Snoke having created the mind link. So they basically took a step back and were like, “Well, Snoke’s thing was completely different even though it’s the exact same concept of two people being really close. But the dyad is just the material exchange and the Palpatine rejuvenation juice.” Thing is, that distinction is never suggested in the films and it just makes the concept even more confusing.

Gah just end my suffering please.

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jarbear said:

This … kinda makes me mad.

The end of a Saga, the last movie of a “connected” series (9 movies in total) should answer questions at the end … not leave more questions…

It’s a trademark of all Abrams productions. It’s why I was mortified when I found out he was being tapped for the Sequel Trilogy.

Forum Moderator
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The kinda “official” (?) answer about the Dyad (I don’t know how much you care about this, but still) is something like:
The Dyad is a natural phenomenon, not something you really can create. When Ben became Kylo and fought the previous leader of the Knights of Ren, Ben and Rey shared… something. It’s like she feels he’s falling to the Dark Side, meaning that they had a connection years before the movies (all this stuff comes from Kylo’s comic).
All other things that happen (Kylo probing her mind in TFA and Snoke mind bridging them) just enhanced something that was already there.

Italian faneditor.

EDITS LIST:
Episode IV - THE HEIR OF SKYWALKER. Episode VI - RETURN OF THE JEDI RENEWED. DYAD IN THE FORCE (3-into-1 sequels).
PM me for links if interested.

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IlFanEditore said:

All other things that happen (Kylo probing her mind in TFA and Snoke mind bridging them) just enhanced something that was already there.

I don’t know, I just feel like these sorts of force abilities should evolve on their own over time without any artificial enhancements. Maybe that’s just me. Otherwise, things get way too complicated when you try to wrap your head around this concept.

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I get it. It’s already unacceptable that to receive infos one has to read novels, comics, visualdictionariesandstuff.
The way I see it is that the Dyad would have evolved anyway, without anyone doing anything. More slowly, probably, but still. Snoke (who probably had some thought freedom) just made the connection grow faster.

Italian faneditor.

EDITS LIST:
Episode IV - THE HEIR OF SKYWALKER. Episode VI - RETURN OF THE JEDI RENEWED. DYAD IN THE FORCE (3-into-1 sequels).
PM me for links if interested.

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The problem is that the entire plot hinges on the dyad. I don’t buy for a second that Palpatine would absorb enough latent energy left over from Snoke’s mind bridging alone to fully restore him. At that point, why didn’t he just drain Snoke himself? There would be even more energy inside of him, after all.

So you HAVE to make the dyad make sense. And in order for the dyad to make sense, you need to go back to the previous movies and change some things (at least that’s how I feel).

Big sad.

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Yeah I’m not saying that “we’ve become a dyad in the force” doesn’t solve anything. In fact, it lines things up more correctly with canon, and therefore is a good change to make things more understandable. But that’s just the problem: current canon is kinda confusing when it comes to the dyad because of all the retcons it involves.

That’s why I’ll always stand by going to the original point and fixing it to be more in line with the retcon. Because like I said in the previous post, this movie’s plot depends on the dyad.

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Movies Remastered said:

Damn, 4 new pages!! Anyone wanna paraphrase what I’ve missed?

That clip from sherlockpotter sounds great.

We all tore our hair out about how the dyad makes little sense and didn’t really decide on anything. Meanwhile, poppasketti posted his version of a clean plate for the puppet show.

JEDIT: Just a random thought. I really appreciate that jonh’s addition of the ghosts gives us some sort of reason why not to expect Palpatine to just return… again. Because the Jedi ghosts took him DOWN with their ghostly powers, tackling him to prevent him slipping away from true death. Or whatever.

My stance on revising fan edits.

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“We’ve become a Dyad in the force” is good enough for me. Snoke bridged their minds, already an unusual thing in the force. That was inadvertently the catalyst which formed the Dyad. Snoke and Palpatine didn’t know it would happen. Snoke thought he made up their relationship, but it was so naturally incomprehensibly powerful, that it continued beyond his control, and lead to a full on mystical Dyad. It’s basically a coincidence. If Snoke hadn’t bridged their minds (which is JUST them force skyping and seeing their surroundings), a Dyad wouldn’t have happened. Transfering items and having enough power to handle having their combined lifeforce sucked out of them to restore a body full of thousands of generations of sith… and still have enough energy to both get up from that… is what their Dyad is. (As well as healing each other, but that’s just my head canon.)
It still works this way for me, and it’s important to have Snoke do something in 8. Because he doesn’t do much else besides this, lol. Snoke is a fool and his downfall was thinking he could manipulate Rey and Kylo, I suppose.
I understand the want to get rid of this, but i like the mystery behind it. There’s just enough there for me to understand it enough without it being confusing. (although ironically, this is all rather confusing.)

Save the Sebastian Shaw Ghost! Save the dream…!

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Since we’re debating on the dyad and it forming after Snoke bridging Rey and Kylo’s minds, I suggest we remove the explanation we already have for how the dyad formed since it would muddle things: “My mother was the daughter of Vader, your father was the son of Palpatine.”

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Hal 9000 said:

Why remove that line? The fact would remain anyway, and I don’t see what there’d be to gain.

You guys are proposing that the dyad forms because of Snoke bridging their minds, whereas in the actual films the dyad was formed because Rey and Kylo Ren were the respective grandchildren of two separate Force-sensitives. If you have both, it would muddle things.

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Reading this thread is exhausting. Why are we doing this to ourselves?

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That wasn’t my understanding. I thought we said the dyad and the mind bridge were two separate things that interacted to some degree.

I don’t blame anyone for getting confused.

My stance on revising fan edits.