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Plot holes in the SW saga — Page 6

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hehe...
its sounds as bad as flinstones meets the jetsons!
anyone remember that POS?
"Never. I'll never turn to the darkside. You've failed your highness. I am a jedi, like my father before me."
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Originally posted by: Luke Skywalker
hehe...
its sounds as bad as flinstones meets the jetsons!
anyone remember that POS?


I kinda remember it. They met thanks to some sort of time travel right? Ah, time travel is my second favorite "deus ex machina", makes anything possible. My favorite one is "it was just a dream" (which I used to belived to be the ending of episode 3, it was all a dream Luke had on the night after ROTJ).
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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ric, i think that's the only thing that could save the prequels. then all those plot holes would be ok because dreams are not supposed to make sense anyway...

and about Star Trek: I like SW (obviously) and also Stargate SG-1 but I couldn't care less for Star Trek somehow...
"Last night, Darth Vader came down from planet Vulcan and told me that if I didn't take Lorraine out that he'd melt my brain."
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Again.............Where are the fucking plot holes......................

And don't give ne shit about Obi_wan noy saying this, or Yoda doing that!!!

Give me some proper examples of plot holes in Star Wars and then I'll shut up!!

http://www.facebook.com/DirtyWookie

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i love SW, like somewhat SG-1 and dont like ST...
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent."
Qui-Gon Jinn (R.I.P.)
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I like Star Wars and Star Trek, but strangley SG-1 doesn't interest me that much. I don't hate it. But I just don't jump with joy when it comes on either.

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Originally posted by: ricarleite
Two theories:

1- In the star wars universe, there was no Earth, and never there will be. Humans are just an alien race that looks like us, and for some reason, they are a dominating alien race. This is probably the answer.

2- Maybe they have some conection with us... maybe time is cyclical, and we are them in the future/past. Or maybe they will become us...


Sorry about the two posts but the topics are completly different.
Why is it so strange that there could be humans on other planets? There are other humanesque races in Star Trek. And for all we know in Basic the word human could be something like queso or something.

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But wouldn't you find it a bit strange if, for example, Luke had a pet labrador? It wouldn't really fit in... humans are the only characters in the movies who look like anything we would ever see on earth, all the other races and characters are completely different... it just isn't very believable that it could really happen, that's all. I mean, do you seriously imagine that if you travelled millions of light years away to a far distant galaxy you could meet a race of beings that look -exactly- like we do who are called Humans? It doesn't bother me because there are plenty of thins in the Star Wars universe that aren't supposed to reflect reality; and the fact is, it works... but it doesn't really make logical sense.
-Everyone is entitled to my opinion-
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ok this madness has gone far enough!!!

gladiator has a plot hole - they speak english.

troy has a plot hole - they speak english.

LOTR has a plot hole - giant elephants? english?

i can go on and on.
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent."
Qui-Gon Jinn (R.I.P.)
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Argh!! I never said it was a plot hole!!! And I wasn't making a serious point, just an observation! If I'd known it was going to cause a debate I would have kept my mouth shut. It's not important!!! (for the third time!)
-Everyone is entitled to my opinion-
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not talking to you samatar... to this entire thread, me included.
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent."
Qui-Gon Jinn (R.I.P.)
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Oh... OK... I just assumed because I said that bit about speaking English. I'll slink away sheepishly now...
-Everyone is entitled to my opinion-
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Originally posted by: Samatar
But wouldn't you find it a bit strange if, for example, Luke had a pet labrador? It wouldn't really fit in... humans are the only characters in the movies who look like anything we would ever see on earth, all the other races and characters are completely different... it just isn't very believable that it could really happen, that's all. I mean, do you seriously imagine that if you travelled millions of light years away to a far distant galaxy you could meet a race of beings that look -exactly- like we do who are called Humans? It doesn't bother me because there are plenty of thins in the Star Wars universe that aren't supposed to reflect reality; and the fact is, it works... but it doesn't really make logical sense.



Well, that all depends upon your look of the universe and life in general. If we take in pure mathematic possibilties with the evolution equation theory kind of stuff, our existance is one in a billion trillion or something like that. And then how we evolved and survive becomes another big number. If you accept a God in the picture, then we have some divine purpose and perhaps God willed the other or another race of sentient beings to look like us. Depends greatly on one's own point of view.
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Samatar, thats because star wars is supposed to be some sort of alternate universe, where humans do co-exist with those other alien races, and Earth never existed.
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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I wouldn't say alternate universe, it says "a galaxy far, far away", leading me to believe that the notion of the movies is Star Wars is out there in space, somewhere.
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in every movie, be it sci-fi, fantasy or even dramas, there has to be a certain suspension of disbelief. it's only when something does not make sense within the story that it can get messy.

"Last night, Darth Vader came down from planet Vulcan and told me that if I didn't take Lorraine out that he'd melt my brain."
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okay this isnt really a plot hole but i was watching an interview with George Lucas yesterday and he said that during the time of ANH release he already had the whole story written out as well as the back story... but he knew he could only make this one movie so he decieded with the timeline of ANH...

now if he is telling the truth and knew the whole story of Star Wars then that means he knew Luke and Leia were brother and sister...
so if that is true then why in the hell did he allow them to kiss in ESB??

i think Lucas is bullshitting...
my opinion is he wrote ANH realized how much of a success it was... then wrote ESB, got more money and figured hell, why not make another, hence ROTJ..

what do you guys think?
"Never. I'll never turn to the darkside. You've failed your highness. I am a jedi, like my father before me."
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Originally posted by: Luke Skywalker
my opinion is he wrote ANH realized how much of a success it was... then wrote ESB, got more money and figured hell, why not make another, hence ROTJ.

I agree to a degree. He wrote ANH and saw what a success it was and then wrote ESB and ROTJ together. How could he have risked writing ESB with the ending that it had and, if it wasn't successful, he winds up with a story line that is dangling at the end. ESB and ROTJ were written together. I'm sure he had the idea of making this a series from the get go. But I doubt he had the story dreamed up. Just a rough outline, at best.
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
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Originally posted by: Luke Skywalker

my opinion is he wrote ANH realized how much of a success it was... then wrote ESB, got more money and figured hell, why not make another, hence ROTJ..


This is from IMDB. I've heard this from other sources as well, and I belive this is the real story:

"Although it is often claimed by George Lucas that Star Wars was always intended as part of a series (originally nine parts, later six), producer Gary Kurtz claimed differently in a interview in 1999. According to Kurtz, Star Wars was meant to be a standalone film. It was only after the film's incredible success that he and Lucas got together to consider sequels. They came up with the idea that Star Wars was the fourth story of a nine-part series and penned rough outlines for each episode. After releasing the "fifth" episode (The Empire Strikes Back (1980)), Lucas made Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981) with Steven Spielberg. The success of this film convinced Lucas to increase the emphasis on action in the "sixth" Star Wars episode. According to Kurtz, the Emperor was not originally going to make an appearance until episode 9. Luke and Leia were not brother and sister. There was no Death Star II. The search for Han Solo was the main plot of the film, during which Luke would have furthered his Jedi training. Solo was going to die in the final battle. Luke was going to go off to complete/continue his Jedi training and Leia was going to resume her position as Queen of her people, separating the major characters in a "downer" ending similar to that of Episode 5. Kurtz strongly objected to Lucas'schanges and insisted they should stay with the story they had originally planned. Lucas just as strongly disagreed and the two parted company. (Kurtz left to make Dark Crystal, The (1982) with 'Henson, Jim' and hasn't worked with Lucas since.)"

I have no idea why George keeps lying about this.
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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Originally posted by: Bossk

I agree to a degree. He wrote ANH and saw what a success it was and then wrote ESB and ROTJ together. How could he have risked writing ESB with the ending that it had and, if it wasn't successful, he winds up with a story line that is dangling at the end. ESB and ROTJ were written together. I'm sure he had the idea of making this a series from the get go. But I doubt he had the story dreamed up. Just a rough outline, at best.


Okay, once more.

GL wrote Episode VI after he had finished Episode V. He may have written some of the back story earlier, but while writing Episode VI he was seriously wondering if he would follow up on the father-son relationship he hinted on in Episode V. He admits to this in an interview on the documentary VHS tape "Star Wars to Jedi: The Making of a Saga". He made sure not to leave any blank spots (story wise) by having Uncle Owen and Obi-wan tell Luke in Episode IV that his father was murdered by Darth Vader. In Episode VI he decided to turn the story around and establish the father-son relationship between these two characters.

So ... NO. He didn't write both stories at the same time. A rough outline might have been writen earlier, the actual screenplay/story of Episode VI was written when Episode V has released in theater.
The open ending or cliffhanger at the end of Episode V was to make people curious about the next Episode, to lure them into the theater for the next movie. I'm sure that, if Episode V would not have made enough money at the box office, Episode VI and all prequals would never have been made.
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Okay, so Kurtz and Lucas disagreed on this stuff. Lucas wanted everything listed in your post and Kurtz didn't. They fought and subsequently parted ways forever only to see Lucas overturn his initial ideas and wind up in agreement with Kurtz. Typical.

VT, okay I should have been more specific. I didn't mean that he had the script written, but he had it all planned out when he did ESB. You would have to in order to justify having a cliffhanger ending like the one in ESB. You have to know ahead of time where you will take it. Maybe not the dialogue involved, but the story was pretty well planned with some exceptions.
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
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Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com
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Originally posted by: Bossk

VT, okay I should have been more specific. I didn't mean that he had the script written, but he had it all planned out when he did ESB. You would have to in order to justify having a cliffhanger ending like the one in ESB. You have to know ahead of time where you will take it. Maybe not the dialogue involved, but the story was pretty well planned with some exceptions.


He had some of it planned, but not everything. Example: Han surviving the carbonite freezing was not yet decided, as Harrison Ford was hesitating about signing to do a third movie. And I seriously doubt he had planned that Leia was Luke's sister.
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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Originally posted by: ricarleite
And I seriously doubt he had planned that Leia was Luke's sister.

Why do you doubt it? Just because he had Leia kiss Luke in ESB? I dunno. I think he had the idea lurking in his head and just hadn't decided whether or not to go that way.
"You fell victim to one of the classic blunders, the most famous of which is 'Never get involved in a land war in Asia'."
--Vizzini (Wallace Shawn), The Princess Bride
-------------------------
Kevin A
Webmaster/Primary Cynic
kapgar.typepad.com
kapgar.com
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i will bet pretty much anything on the fact that after ANH, GL knew what was going to happen in ESB and ROTJ. he knew vader was lukes father and that luke and leia are siblings and that yoda will die, and that anaking will be saved, the emperor killed and han and leia together.
"The ability to speak does not make you intelligent."
Qui-Gon Jinn (R.I.P.)
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"I wouldn't say alternate universe, it says "a galaxy far, far away", leading me to believe that the notion of the movies is Star Wars is out there in space, somewhere."

That was sort of my point... the fact that this story wasn't set in another dimension, but in our universe, made it confusing.
-Everyone is entitled to my opinion-