Originally posted by: Warbler
Personally, I don't care what my money says, as long as I can spend it. However, you need to keep in mind that our money is printed by the Federal Reserve, which is a private bank, not a government agency. A matter of semantics, yes, but a crucial one.
One last thing, alot of people say the 1st Amendment only gives freedom of religion and not freedom from religion. I ask, how can you have true freedom of religion without having freedom from religion?
Originally posted by: JediSage
None of our founding documents forbids the oft forgot second half of the "establishment" clause from being practiced in, on, or around public grounds or buildings, yet the secular establishment, using tax payer dollars and municipal funds to pay court fees, is continually assaulting religious people/groups/organizations on that particular issue. We now live in a society where children who try to read bibles during their free time in public schools have their bibles siezed and thrown in the garbage by school beaurocrats with a secular axe to grind. Yes, there are many grey areas, but let's be clear about who's at which end of the lash right now.
And the reason why Christmas and Easter will never be excised is because they've been stripped of all their Christian meaning, and secularized to the ground (Happy Holidays!). If they still had their original Chrisian conotations, they would cease to exist and the Gaia worshippers would rule the day even more so than they do now.
Ok, I have never heard of any children having their Bibles siezed and thrown in the garbage. That was an unneeded exaggeration. One thing I hate when people use obvious
exaggerations to support their argument.
It's obvious that your reaction temporarily prevented you from doing a Google search:
Article
So, in other words, anyone who assumes public office or works in government automatically abbrogates their right to the free exercise of religion? Must they now take a vow of official atheism prior to taking the position? I'm sorry, I'm just looking for that part of the amendment...I work at a non-profit that receives state funds. Guess I'd better be careful when someone sneezes of saying God Bless You.
About the "In God We Trust" on our money and "One Nation Under God" in our pledge. Tell me, would the Government be allowed to change the words to "In God We Do Not
Trust", and "One Nation Not Under God"? If the Government can't print on our money "In God We Do Not Trust", why can the Goverment print on our money "In God We Trust"? By allowing "In God We Trust" and disallowing "In God We Do Not Trust" The Government is imho, establishing a religous belief. Which is outlawed by the 1st Amendment.
Same goes for the pledge.
None of our founding documents forbids the oft forgot second half of the "establishment" clause from being practiced in, on, or around public grounds or buildings, yet the secular establishment, using tax payer dollars and municipal funds to pay court fees, is continually assaulting religious people/groups/organizations on that particular issue. We now live in a society where children who try to read bibles during their free time in public schools have their bibles siezed and thrown in the garbage by school beaurocrats with a secular axe to grind. Yes, there are many grey areas, but let's be clear about who's at which end of the lash right now.
And the reason why Christmas and Easter will never be excised is because they've been stripped of all their Christian meaning, and secularized to the ground (Happy Holidays!). If they still had their original Chrisian conotations, they would cease to exist and the Gaia worshippers would rule the day even more so than they do now.
Ok, I have never heard of any children having their Bibles siezed and thrown in the garbage. That was an unneeded exaggeration. One thing I hate when people use obvious
exaggerations to support their argument.
It's obvious that your reaction temporarily prevented you from doing a Google search:
Article
The First Amendment:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
To me, this says that people can practice their religion on public property but the government can't get involved in it. So although you have the right to pray to the god of the your choice while on school property, School officals can't lead a prayer or have an offical school prayer. Which means reading the Bible on your own free time, say at lunch is perfectly O.K.
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
To me, this says that people can practice their religion on public property but the government can't get involved in it. So although you have the right to pray to the god of the your choice while on school property, School officals can't lead a prayer or have an offical school prayer. Which means reading the Bible on your own free time, say at lunch is perfectly O.K.
So, in other words, anyone who assumes public office or works in government automatically abbrogates their right to the free exercise of religion? Must they now take a vow of official atheism prior to taking the position? I'm sorry, I'm just looking for that part of the amendment...I work at a non-profit that receives state funds. Guess I'd better be careful when someone sneezes of saying God Bless You.
About the "In God We Trust" on our money and "One Nation Under God" in our pledge. Tell me, would the Government be allowed to change the words to "In God We Do Not
Trust", and "One Nation Not Under God"? If the Government can't print on our money "In God We Do Not Trust", why can the Goverment print on our money "In God We Trust"? By allowing "In God We Trust" and disallowing "In God We Do Not Trust" The Government is imho, establishing a religous belief. Which is outlawed by the 1st Amendment.
Same goes for the pledge.
Personally, I don't care what my money says, as long as I can spend it. However, you need to keep in mind that our money is printed by the Federal Reserve, which is a private bank, not a government agency. A matter of semantics, yes, but a crucial one.
One last thing, alot of people say the 1st Amendment only gives freedom of religion and not freedom from religion. I ask, how can you have true freedom of religion without having freedom from religion?
I find it odd that we need to oppress freedom in order to attain it, however, I'll bite:
The same can be said of almost anything in the bill of rights. How can we have freedom of the press without the right to control it? For example, the reporter just put in jail for not revealing their sources in a criminal investigation. Here's a link so I don't get accused of fabricating that example to support my point: Reporter
Soon that excuse will be used to drive the crosses from church tops, or the stars from temples on main street in the local towns so that the "include it, or exclude it" crowd, along with the atheists won't have to see them while driving on a public street. I actually had someone tell me that once (a blazing leftist/atheist) that he should be free from "religiosity" while driving on public roads (unfortunately I was unable to get this on video so your just going to have to trust that I didn't fabricate that example).
Keep in mind that appeasing all faiths via a position of no faith is just as much of a philosophy as any religion. By definition it's excluding the people who believe and practice their faiths.